Show Transcripts
Deanne DeMarco MT, MA, RCC
Keep Your Communication Style in Scnc
Learn about the 4 communication styles
Today’s Inspiring Women
Host: Deanne DeMarco
The Four Communication Styles.
Air Date: May 2, 2013
Deanne: Welcome to Today’s Inspiring Women, I’m your host Deanne DeMarco. If you are interested in becoming a sponsor for the show, give us a call at 708-836-0118. If you are ready to take the next steps to become empowered, motivated and better equipped for success then stay tuned, today we are going to be talking about improving your communication.
Have you ever worked with someone who you ask them their opinion and they don’t say anything and they ask you, what do you think so you do it and you never did get their opinion? How about the person that talks and talks and talks and you can’t get a word in edge wise? How about someone who is so much in to the details and the facts that they keep asking for more and more details and you want to just say, stop, let’s just get the work done? How about those people that are so over bearing they want to do things their way and that’s the only way, they are intimidating and they don’t want to listen to your opinion? Have you ever had to deal with people like this, maybe your colleague or peer? Maybe you are in sales and you don’t know quite how to sell to these types of people?
Well today we are going to be talking exactly how to deal with all of those issues and by the end of the day I hope you can get some skills, that you will be able to retain some key employees, you will be able to communicate more effectively and drive some sales for yourself as well.
In my consulting and coaching practice, I see communication as one of the key issues today and so that is why I wanted to talk about this to try and help you get a better grounding of communication. The communication direction I am going to be talking about today was actually investigated for the first time by a guy by the name of Hippocrates; some of you might have known him as the father of medicine. Later on the 1920’s Hippocrates work was picked up by William Marsden who was a Harvard trained psychologist as well as an MD. And he outlined the four communication styles that are widely accepted today in understanding behavior into how people communicate.
One of the things you need to understand is that successful people understand themselves and how their behavior affects others. They understand their reactions to other people, they know how to maximize on what they do well, they have a positive attitude about themselves which causes others to have confidence in them and successful people know how to adapt their behavior to meet the needs of others and in particular situations.
You need to understand that in talking about the communications styles we need to look at all four styles because you need to understand who you are and how you communicate and how your communication is perceived by others. And then look at your strengths, look at your weaknesses and then we’ll go from there, so let’s talk about these four communication styles.
The first one is known as dominance or the D style. The D style communication style is direct, they are opinionated, they want the bottom line, they seek immediate results and they enjoy challenges. Communicators who use this D style like to win, they will take risks and they work hard to get the desired results that they are looking for. They prefer a fast pace, they like new activities, they like change, variety and use a direct approach to solving problems. They are confident leaders and believe in pragmatic principles, if it doesn’t work, get rid of it, is pretty much their model. And you also hear them say things like, just give me the bottom line here.
So to be effective with these people you notice you need to show them the simplest and quickest way to be productive, you need to be firm, direct and clearly define the limits of their authority. They like public recognition for creating results that make a difference in the world.
Let me talk a little bit about their strengths and a little bit about their weaknesses. So their strengths are they are truly born leaders, they excel in emergencies, they are very goal oriented, they are motivated, they are logical thinkers and they are very confident about themselves. Some of their weaknesses is they tend to be a little bossy, they tend to be a little intolerant of others, sometimes they are seen as over demanding, workaholics, impatient and rude. Let’s go in to the second style.
So the second style is the Influence style or the High I. So the Influence style or the High I, these communicators like to interact with people, they are fast paced, they are very animated, they are enthusiastic, they like to express their thoughts and feelings, these outgoing people desire results. However they are very, very sociable and they love interacting with others; they are excellent communicators and are viewed as friendly, creative and are very persuasive. To be effective, you need to avoid overwhelming details with the High I communications style and you need to request specific feedback to check on their understanding of how to complete a specific project. You need to use public praise and provide opportunities for them to interact with others.
Let me talk a little bit about their strengths and weaknesses as well. So their strengths, they are magnetic, they have just a magnetic personality, they are great story tellers, they are very entertaining, friendly, very creative, they are very colorful in their language, they like a lot of color, their work environment has a lot of color in it and they are very, very enthusiastic about things that they like. Some of their weaknesses, they tend to exaggerate, for those of you who are the High I out there, you tend to exaggerate. Sometimes they are compulsive talkers, undisciplined, immature; they often interrupt and are often disorganized.
So let’s talk about the third style. So those first two styles, the High D and the High I, they were more the extroverted type, they are people who react to their environment, they react to information, they react to situations, so they are very outgoing. Let’s talk about the next two and the next two are more on that introverted scale, people who are more guarded, people who are more process oriented.
So let’s talk about the first one, the first one is known as steadfastness or the S style. The S style communicator is very accepting of others, they like cooperation and harmony. They are very good at calming others and in fact they are known as the harmonizers and people often see them as such. The S communicators like security, they like being part of a team and they love stability and they like a stable environment. These people are not risk takers at all like the D’s and the I’s were. And they totally dislike change and in fact they will avoid change at all costs. They are very, very patient, they are very, very loyal and they are wonderful listeners.
In fact in testing the communications styles with listening tests that you can actually fail the ones that score the highest in those listening tests are the S’s. Typically my S’s will score in those listening tests from the 80 to 90 percentile range whereas all the other types, the D, the I, and the last one that I’ll mention which is the C type tend to score much lower, 50% or lower, just a little FYI.
So let me talk a little bit more about the steadfast style. The S’s prefer to work with others, they like to take time to establish cohesiveness, they don’t want to just like rush and jump in to things, they want us to get to know each other better. They have a very predictable manner and are known as the peacemakers. In fact if you are in a workplace conflict, find your local S to help resolve that conflict because they are intuitively very, very good at resolving conflict.
Let’s talk about the last style. This is also an introverted style, very guarded and that’s the Conscientious style or the high C. The C communicator is very, very cautious, they are detailed, they demand quality, they like to work under known conditions, and they prefer to follow written standards and rules of procedures. They are neat and orderly and tidy, they value accuracy, in fact precision is their middle name, and they are very, very tactful and diplomatic.
So let me talk a little bit about their strengths and their weaknesses as well. Some of their strengths are they are artistic and musical, very schedule oriented, they keep their emotions in check, they like long range goals, are serious and analytical and they like charts and graphs and data and more data and more data. Their weaknesses they tend to be very perfectionist, they can be moody and are very suspicious of information unless they have the good facts for it. Can be inflexible at times, pessimistic and sometimes slow to action.
So you need to understand these four types. We are going to take a break right now and when we come back we are going to talk a little bit more about how do you coach and manage these four styles and we’ll come back in a just few minutes in Today’s Inspiring Women, stay tuned.
Welcome back to Today’s Inspiring Women, I am your host Deanne Demarco and today we are talking about communication, how to improve your communication so you can drive sales, so you can retain the best and the brightest and you can help maybe reduce workplace conflict. Just before the break I was talking about the four communication styles and before we go on I want to give you a little bit more information around the fears of the four communication styles. Because a lot of times if we can understand the fears of the four communications styles we are able to understand them a little bit better.
And the fear with the dominant style or the high D, remember the D style was the extroverted driver, their fear is loss of control. So they like to be in charge of their environment, they like to be in charge of everything that they do so their fear is loss of control.
And looking at the other extroverted type which is the influence style or the high I, they are the ones that like to socialize and have a lot of communication with people, their fear is the fear of social rejection. So you need to understand that in communicating with this high I, they definitely have a fear that you may not like them because they like to have this social communication and interaction with people.
And taking a look at the two styles on the introverted scales, the S or the steadfastness styles their fear is the loss of a stable environment, remember the steadfast or the S person is somebody who likes a nice, calm environment, they like a harmonious environment so their fear is the loss of a stable environment or loss of stability.
And the last style was the Conscientious style or the C style, those were the ones who are very perfectionist, their fear is the fear of criticism of their work so they tend to get a lot of details around their work because they want their work to be accurate because of their fear of criticism on their work.
So I wanted you to understand their fears just a little bit. So let’s talk a little bit more about how strengths over used become weaknesses. So the D style, who is very good at directing and deciding may become a little autocratic. The high I who is good at promoting and persuading may over sell and end up manipulating. The S, the steadfast group who is steady and agreeable may give in despite their own personal needs in fact they are often seen as the person who will give you the shirt off their back in order to please you. The C who is really good at analyzing and checking for details and checking for accuracy may become perfectionistic and indecisive.
So all of these styles have strengths and all of these styles have weaknesses and so I want to address that just a little bit more on how do you manage and how do you coach them and how do you actually sell to these four different styles.
So let me tell you a little bit more about you and each of these four different styles. If you are a dominance manager leader your strengths may include that you are really comfortable in the leadership role, you are really quick at decision making, you are direct with people so they know where you stand and you are excellent at solving problems. But you need to understand that people may often perceive you as being intimidating and being insensitive to others needs and that you may be a little bit impatient. So if you are this high D style you need to be, in order to be more effective as a manger leader, you need to start developing more patience, you need to maybe tone down your directness and start asking more questions to people rather than telling them what to do all the time because that telling seems like, other people feel like they are just been hit on the head with a hammer all the time. In order to be more effective as a manager in your D style, you need to start spending more time with those people that you direct and that you lead because as D’s we don’t tend to do that.
So let’s talk a little bit more about your fear of this influence [17:52], of this high I manager leader. So your strengths are that you have a true and open door policy, come in and talk to me and we will talk about it. You are someone who gives time easily to those who you direct so if anybody has an issue they can come in and talk to you. You are wonderful at inspiring others and motivating others. You are very enthusiastic in fact people will often comment how you are the energizer bunny, you are just very enthusiastic. You tend to give a lot of positive feedback to others and even when delivering negative feedback you have a natural tendency to be able to do that in a real positive way, I’m not sure how you are able to do that but you are able to do that. Those that work with you however may see some limitations in your management style. For example they may not be getting the details that they need from you in directing them. They may see that your approach tends to be more superficial, that you tend to lack follow through. In order to be more effective as a manager if you are in the high I or this influence style, you need to be more specific; in fact specific is the key operative word here, more specific in praise and giving work directions to others. You need to start listening better, you need to start talking less and listening more, so you can hear what people really need from you. You are not going to like this one at all but you need to start being a little bit more organized, freedom from chaos can be a beautiful thing but you need to start being a little but more organized.
So let’s talk about the last two, the steadfast style and the conscientious style. If you are that steadfast manager or leader, some of your strengths are you are a phenomenal listener I mean you’ll listen to everybody, you are excellent at listening. You are very empathetic and you are sensitive to the needs of others sometimes to a fault actually. You are good with self directed work teams, teams that are able to direct themselves, you appreciate your people and you tell them why you appreciate them and you are very good at that. And you tend to be very, very consistent in your leadership style so people tend to be able to depend on you and the type of style that you have.
You need to know that people that you need may see some of the following limitations in the way that you are leading them. One of them is that you tend to be indecisive and they are wondering why you taking so long to make a decision. Sometimes you are not really very direct with your direct reports and giving directions to them so they see you as been way too indirect in giving directions. Sometimes they see you as been hesitant to implement a needed change and that’s part of the fact that you don’t like change so you tend to be hesitant in implementing a needful change.
Now if you are in this S style you can be more effective as a manager, leader if you start becoming more assertive and direct and that might be a little bit hard but you need to start been more assertive and direct. You need to start learning how to cope better with change and not carrying the burden of everyone’s problems on your shoulders, spread it around let other people deal with some of those burdens as well.
Let’s talk about more about you as a conscientious leader this that high C manager or leader. So some of your strengths are you believe in fairness to everyone, you follow standards and procedures and you want those policies and procedures in place. You are very conscientious, you are willing to pitch in and do the same work as your people. You are very, very accurate and you are able to keep confidences.
Now you need to understand that people who work with you may see you as being overly perfectionistic. Sometimes they see you as being a little aloof, that you tend to hamper creativity in others with your desire to stick to the rules and the facts. So you can be more effective as a manager if you are the C style, the conscientious style if you start accepting differences, talking more with those people you direct since you tend not to be a very talkative person. You need to start to encourage creativity in others.
So these are just some of the little, more information about you. Let me talk a little bit about, before we go in to break here let me talk a little bit about some of the humorous sides of these communications styles.
Now if you are a high D the chances are you sometimes like to eat over the sink, you love to microwave everything including water, you never follow recipes and you are always adding in some substitute or adding in new things.
If you are a high I you tend to like gourmet foods, you have the latest kitchen gadgets even if you don’t know how to use them and you are attracted to fancy packaging which should be a clue also for the sales people who are listening.
If you are a high S you tend to value meals and you consider them to be a very important family time. You tend to eat from the four basic food groups everyday and you cook whatever anyone wants to eat even if it means eating things that you personally do not like.
And with a high C you tend to read all the labels, you know all the percentages of proteins, fats and carbohydrates in foods and you tend to buy kitchen gadgets if they are economical and well constructed.
So those are some of the little humorous sides of the four types. You know that if you get in to a busy elevator and you are pushing the buttons that quickly closes the door you know that you are a high D. If you are at that elevator and saying, ‘hey there is always room for one more come on in, you don’t want to be late we’ll wait for you’, chances are you are a high I. If you are someone who waits in line, moving in one line to another, appearing to be unable to make a decision, chances are that you may be a high S. And if you get in to that elevator and if it’s crowded, you start counting the number of people and you start figuring out what the weights are of each person and look at the weight limit and the number of people limit on that elevator and if you think it is exceeding, chances are you get off the odds are you a high C.
It’s time for a break here let’s go ahead and take a break we are going to come back and talk a little bit more about communication, how to coach and manage and sell to the four communication styles so stay tuned we’ll be right back in Today’s Inspiring Women.
Welcome back to Today’s Inspiring Women, we are talking about communications, how to be more effective in communication, so you can drive sales, be more effective as a manager or a coach and how to sell to the four communications styles.
So the direction I’d like to go in next, so we are talking about the four communications styles and those four communications styles were dominance, influence, steadiness and conscientiousness. So the two styles that were on that extroverted scale was the dominance and influence side, the D and the I. Those two communications styles that were more on the introverted side were the conscientiousness and the steadfastness or steadiness group.
Now in understanding the four styles there are two that tend to be very, very task focused in the way they see the world and that is the dominance and the conscientiousness that is the D and the C. And there tend to be more on the relationship side and that tends to be the influence and the steadiness group. So if you were to draw a box and divide it in half each way so that you end up with four quadrants, that upper left would be dominance or that High D, to the right of that would be the high I and those would be your extroverts. And on the bottom would be on the far lower right the S or the steadiness or the steadfast style and on the lower left would the conscientiousness or the C, the C style.
So taking a look at it from those four quadrants, the upper two boxes are your fast paced, they tend to be very, very reactive in how they communicate whereas the two in the bottom tend to be the introverted style, they tend to process information. That’s a keyword in understanding both the S and the C, is they tend to process information. So looking at the two boxes that are on the far left which would the dominance and the conscientious style, those two groups are very task focused, they are very guarded in the communication. Whereas the two on the far right would be the influence and the steadfast style and those are the two styles that are very open in their communication and they are very relationship driven.
So that gives you a little understanding about these four styles a little bit more. So let’s talk about if you are going to be coaching or managing these four styles.
So if you are going to be managing and coaching these four styles let’s take a look at the high D. The high D is someone who wants power, they want authority, they want prestige, they love challenges. In fact when looking at challenges they like to win, you need to understand that, they are very results oriented because they are on that task focused side, very results bottom line. In fact you often hear them say, ‘just give me the bottom line here’. They like to understand, if you are going to be giving them a task, they like to understand the wide scope of the operation, so you need to give them that big picture view before you give them their individual task. They are someone who really likes direct answers to direct questions. They like a lot of freedoms from controls so once you give a high D a task or a project don’t go micro managing them unless of course you want them to quit on you because they like to have a lot of control around their work and the work that they do. They also like a lot of new and varied activities; they are not someone who likes to do the same type of activity day in and day out, they tend like to have a variety in their life. So through mentoring or coaching, you can assist them to learn how to identify better with others, you can help them to focus on their intrinsic rewards around projects. You can help them and coach them to be more empathetic when working with others. The D’s need to understand that they often come on as very coarse with others, that they often come on as sometimes too independent with others and that they often intimidate others or even alienate others.
So in managing or coaching your high D’s, you need to give them really an understanding of where they are coming from. So in coaching a D show them the simplest and quickest way to be productive, be firm and direct and clearly define the limits of their authority so they know because otherwise they won’t know, they will either try and take over or they’ll think somebody else is in charge and they won’t do the work at all. So those clear lines of authority are very, very important with that D.
So let’s look at how do we coach and manage someone with that high I or that high influence dimension of behavior. So some of the high I dimension behavior he’s going to want definitely social recognition, they are definitely going to want rewards, they want to know that what their work is doing is making a difference. They are going to want people to know that they are doing a great job so public recognition of their ability. They want people to talk to, don’t put a high I in isolation unless of course you want them to quit on you. They love talking with others, they love these casual warm relationships, they like freedom from control and they really dislike detail, pair them up with someone who loves detail and let that person deal with the detail work, they do not like a lot of detail. They like approval, they like you to be friendly and they just like to be around others so they really like to work in team and getting interacting with others.
So let me just talk about the differences between a D and an I here. So if you are going to give a task to a High D, the high D is going to say, just give me the bottom line, telling me as it is, what do I need to do, what is the quality level and then just leave me alone and let me do it.
The high I on the other hand, you give them that same task and they are going to say, great who else is involved, who else can get involved in this project, who else can work with me on this project and, oh by the way can we have a party afterwards? So in coaching that high I, you may need to give them an understanding around the sense of urgency around the completion of a task, you may need to give them some more precise and detailed information around the task.
So let’s take a look at how do we manage and coach the two on the bottom half, the S and the C behavior, I am talking about if you put the four quadrants together, those two introverted styles. So if you are going to be giving a task to a high S or a steadfast style, you need to understand they are going to want to know like what’s the status quo, is there security in this project, are we going to get it completed. They really like to work with people who are happy and are in calm environments, they like standardized procedures and they really want you to be sincere and believe me they can tell if you are not sincere in talking with them. They like genuine appreciation but not necessarily in public in fact they almost prefer it in private. They also like recognition for their service in the task that they are completing and they like the opportunity to really specialize in some task or activity at work so give them that opportunity.
So in coaching and mentoring this group you may need to assist this person with definitely anything around change. You need to understand that if there is a change coming on, you need to give them fair warning about that change way in advance because they need time to process that there might be a change coming because it really interferes with their whole need for stability in their lives. You may need to give them some more self affirmations, give them some short cut methods on how to do something. You need to help them understand that what their accomplishments are definitely worthwhile.
So in coaching this high S you need to understand that you need to use a step by step plan for their development, you need to provide that one on one hands on instruction with them and use real regular informal type of feedback with them and you need to be warm and sincere and statements that are complimentary, complimenting their efforts so they know that you appreciate their work.
And taking a look at the C, managing and coaching the high C, you need to understand that the C dimension behavior may want really clearly defined expectations, real limited exposure. They like you to be really reserved, they like a business like type of environment, they like an opportunity to really demonstrate their expertise with no sudden changes, they like selective involvement in the work that they are doing.
So you may need to help or coach or manage them or mentor them in coming with a realistic assessment of practical limits, understand that there is a tolerance for conflict, how to participate in groups and you might need to give them some group participation skills because they may not have those skills. And they have a tolerance for ambiguity so you need to help them and coach them in those areas.
So in coaching or managing this conscientious, this C type you need to provide very specific, factual statements of what level of performance is required. You need to use real accurate statements and check for understanding and acceptance of information. You need to provide them time because they are process oriented just like the S’s are, very process oriented with the information that you are giving them and time for them to practice skills and set time limits for practicing otherwise they will just keep going over and over and over to do the project that you have given them, so just a little bit more about those four styles in coaching and managing them.
So let me just give you a little bit more humor here, if you are on the golf course, you got to be careful of a D driving the golf cart because they frequently will drive their golf cart and play through groups of golfers. On the golf course that high I spends so much time in the club house, talking on the course, they may forget that they had a tee time. The S golfs’ the same day at the same time in the same place using the same clubs every time. And on the golf course that high C keeps scores and plays strictly by the rules and you can count on them often cleaning their clubs every time they have used it, just wanted to give you a heads up, a little bit about the humor around the golf course on the four styles.
This is Deanne Demarco, we are going to take a short break here and when we come back we are going to talk more about conflicts and selling to the four communications styles so stay tuned, we’ll be right back with Today’s Inspiring Women.
Welcome back, this is Deanne Demarco with Today’s Inspiring Women. We are talking about how to fine tune you communication to be more effective in retaining the best, increasing sales, decreasing conflict and how to manage and coach the four communication styles in the workplace. So we talked in the first segments about the four communication styles, dominance which is the high D style, influence which is the high I style, steadiness which is the high S style and conscientiousness which is the high C style.
We talked about how each of them have strengths and how each of them have weaknesses, for example we said dominance or the D style likes to delegate and they thrive in their position whereas their weaknesses is they tend to be quick tempered and they often cant relax. The high I style, someone who is very sincere and creative and cheerful, they are the life of the party but their weakness is they tend to dwell on trivia and they tend to be compulsive talkers and sometimes forgetful and they often repeat stories. The high S or the steadfast styles, they tend to be very patient and loyal and they are good listeners and their weaknesses is they tend to worry a lot, they need structure they tend to be too shy or too compromising. And the high C style, the conscientious style, tends to be very, very analytical, analystic, perfectionist, they tend to be. On their weakness side they tend to be self centered and hard to please, sometime spend too much time planning.
So what I’d like to go in to now is, now that you understand these four styles a little bit is how do you deal with conflict with these four styles? So in dealing with conflict with the four styles, the high D, you need to understand that that high D is because they are drivers, for them to be in conflict, they perceive conflict that they have to win this conflict, they’re like a Sherman tank. The Sherman tank has a gun, that big gun up the front and you just load those shells in and pound and pound until the whole army can go through the wall. That’s how the D’s are in conflict, is they’ll just pound you and pound you and pound you and just keep driving their point until it’s like I win, you lose, it’s take no prisoners, I win, you lose, it’s their way or the highway.
Let’s look at conflict with that high I, so the high I remember this is the talkative group, the high I group is like throwing a hand grenade, you pull the pin out of a hand grenade, you throw the hand grenade into a group of people and you hope the shrapnel hits something. Well that’s how high I’s are in conflict, we may start talking about and arguing about whether we should have bottled water, not have bottled water and then they’ll start bringing in all these other different topics and you end up talking about yellow folders. And you’ll sit there and scratch your head and go, wait a minute how did we get from bottled water to yellow folders? And it’s because they bring up all these different ideas and they don’t sit on any one of them too long and they keep bouncing from idea to idea to idea where you are going from one idea to another and you sit there and you scratch your head and you go, wait a minute, how did we get there? So that’s the high I style, it’s like that hand grenade.
The high S in conflict tends to be the yes man, whatever you say, just tell me what you want and we are going to go ahead and do it. And so they are often perceived as these yes people, we’ll just do it; whatever you want to do is how we are going to do it.
And conflict with the C’s, they are often perceived as whiners and the reason for that is because they are so fact focused that they can’t see any other way of doing a project other than what their facts are telling them is the correct answer. So they tend to be perceived as whiners in trying to get their point across that this is the only way to do it.
So how do you deal with each of these four different types? If you are dealing with the high D, you need to stand toe to toe, you need to be clear on what your position is and that they need to listen to you, do not back down. In fact they will see you as weak and try to take advantage of that if they perceive that you are weak so you need to stand toe to toe.
Now if there are two of you who are D’s together and you are having a conflict, you need to understand that two D’s going head to head, have you ever seen pictures of the sheep with the horns that ram each other and they just crash in to each other? That’s how two D’s are in conflict so what ends up happening is the two D’s will truly butt heads together until one wins. So if you are having a conflict with another D you need to really say, I perceive that both of us each have a firm stand here, let’s maybe do a pro con chart and look at the different directions. Maybe we both need to look at compromise, maybe we both need to look at how we can cooperate so that we can both get the results that we want. The other thing that might happen with two D’s in conflict is one may totally breakdown and say, fine we’ll do it your way, and then that person that just backed down won’t do what they are supposed to do. They’ll tell you they will but they won’t do it.
In dealing with conflict with a high I, you need to help keep them focused on what you are really having the conflict about, so you really need to help them maybe actually write it down that this conflict is around the bottled water versus tap water and so you keep them focused on that conflict.
If you are having a conflict with a high S you need to ask more questions, do not give your position on the conflict until you hear their conflict ahead of time. Also making an appointment with that person, say you know I perceive we are having a conflict around whether or not we should have bottled water or tap water, why don’t we get together again tomorrow and talk about how we can address the water issue and the direction we should go. Do not give your opinion first; let them give their opinion first.
If you are having a conflict with a high C, then that high C you need to also give them time to get their data so you also need to maybe set an appointment with them and then you need to be prepared with data as well and need to take a look at the data that both of you have acquired in dealing with the issue at hand. What are the pros and cons of using bottled water, what are the pros and cons in using tap water so both of you need to get all that information together.
And sales, how do you sell to those four types? With the D’, be direct, to the point, get to the bottom line, don’t give them a lot of fluff, get right to task and know your stuff. With the high I, if you are trying to sell to a high I, you need to start with relationships and help them to understand that you care about them as a person before going in to the sales pitch. If you are selling to a high S, you need to give them time to process, they need time to think about it, you need to know your facts but you need to be very, very personable with them and you need to approach them, not be real pushy, but you need to approach them in a nice, calm manner in the approach and what their needs are, ask those questions don’t be asking telling questions. If you are trying to sell to a high C, man, you had better know the details. If you do not know all the details about what it is you are trying to sell them, they will not even listen to you. So you must know the details around all the information that you are trying to sell.
So if you would like more information around this communication stuff, I actually in my coaching practice actually have the Marsten test that I distribute to people and then we can fine tune the results of that test on sales or coaching or managing or leading the four different types or more general ones as well, I also have one for personal relationships also. So you can contact me at [email protected] for that information or call me at 708-836-0118 and I’ll be glad to hook you up with the communication styles stuff. It’s just fascinating; I’ve just touched the iceberg here on all the information that is available round these communication styles.
Today’s show was brought to you by Breaking Boundaries International, Breaking Boundaries provides personalized coaching and corporate training services to business professionals and organizations. If you are looking to breakthrough your personal boundaries and career roadblocks, Breaking Boundaries International can help. Breaking Boundaries International has won national recognition from Training Magazines top 100 for the management coaching clinic programs. Their services include executive and personal coaching, corporate training for managers, Breaking Boundaries can also provide motivational business speakers for your next business meeting or next conference or association meeting. They can be reached at www.breaking-boundaries.com and their phone number is 86691COACH.
I want to leave you with a quote today and the quote I want to give you is by George Deer and he says that, everything you want is on the other side of your fear. I just love that, everything that you want is on the other side of your fear.
Well you have been listening to Today’s Inspiring Women, I am your host Deanne Demarco and each week we address relevant topics for women to spark your career and life and personal and professional growth. Thank you for tuning in today, I am your host Deanne Demarco, have a wonderful day.
Host: Deanne DeMarco
The Four Communication Styles.
Air Date: May 2, 2013
Deanne: Welcome to Today’s Inspiring Women, I’m your host Deanne DeMarco. If you are interested in becoming a sponsor for the show, give us a call at 708-836-0118. If you are ready to take the next steps to become empowered, motivated and better equipped for success then stay tuned, today we are going to be talking about improving your communication.
Have you ever worked with someone who you ask them their opinion and they don’t say anything and they ask you, what do you think so you do it and you never did get their opinion? How about the person that talks and talks and talks and you can’t get a word in edge wise? How about someone who is so much in to the details and the facts that they keep asking for more and more details and you want to just say, stop, let’s just get the work done? How about those people that are so over bearing they want to do things their way and that’s the only way, they are intimidating and they don’t want to listen to your opinion? Have you ever had to deal with people like this, maybe your colleague or peer? Maybe you are in sales and you don’t know quite how to sell to these types of people?
Well today we are going to be talking exactly how to deal with all of those issues and by the end of the day I hope you can get some skills, that you will be able to retain some key employees, you will be able to communicate more effectively and drive some sales for yourself as well.
In my consulting and coaching practice, I see communication as one of the key issues today and so that is why I wanted to talk about this to try and help you get a better grounding of communication. The communication direction I am going to be talking about today was actually investigated for the first time by a guy by the name of Hippocrates; some of you might have known him as the father of medicine. Later on the 1920’s Hippocrates work was picked up by William Marsden who was a Harvard trained psychologist as well as an MD. And he outlined the four communication styles that are widely accepted today in understanding behavior into how people communicate.
One of the things you need to understand is that successful people understand themselves and how their behavior affects others. They understand their reactions to other people, they know how to maximize on what they do well, they have a positive attitude about themselves which causes others to have confidence in them and successful people know how to adapt their behavior to meet the needs of others and in particular situations.
You need to understand that in talking about the communications styles we need to look at all four styles because you need to understand who you are and how you communicate and how your communication is perceived by others. And then look at your strengths, look at your weaknesses and then we’ll go from there, so let’s talk about these four communication styles.
The first one is known as dominance or the D style. The D style communication style is direct, they are opinionated, they want the bottom line, they seek immediate results and they enjoy challenges. Communicators who use this D style like to win, they will take risks and they work hard to get the desired results that they are looking for. They prefer a fast pace, they like new activities, they like change, variety and use a direct approach to solving problems. They are confident leaders and believe in pragmatic principles, if it doesn’t work, get rid of it, is pretty much their model. And you also hear them say things like, just give me the bottom line here.
So to be effective with these people you notice you need to show them the simplest and quickest way to be productive, you need to be firm, direct and clearly define the limits of their authority. They like public recognition for creating results that make a difference in the world.
Let me talk a little bit about their strengths and a little bit about their weaknesses. So their strengths are they are truly born leaders, they excel in emergencies, they are very goal oriented, they are motivated, they are logical thinkers and they are very confident about themselves. Some of their weaknesses is they tend to be a little bossy, they tend to be a little intolerant of others, sometimes they are seen as over demanding, workaholics, impatient and rude. Let’s go in to the second style.
So the second style is the Influence style or the High I. So the Influence style or the High I, these communicators like to interact with people, they are fast paced, they are very animated, they are enthusiastic, they like to express their thoughts and feelings, these outgoing people desire results. However they are very, very sociable and they love interacting with others; they are excellent communicators and are viewed as friendly, creative and are very persuasive. To be effective, you need to avoid overwhelming details with the High I communications style and you need to request specific feedback to check on their understanding of how to complete a specific project. You need to use public praise and provide opportunities for them to interact with others.
Let me talk a little bit about their strengths and weaknesses as well. So their strengths, they are magnetic, they have just a magnetic personality, they are great story tellers, they are very entertaining, friendly, very creative, they are very colorful in their language, they like a lot of color, their work environment has a lot of color in it and they are very, very enthusiastic about things that they like. Some of their weaknesses, they tend to exaggerate, for those of you who are the High I out there, you tend to exaggerate. Sometimes they are compulsive talkers, undisciplined, immature; they often interrupt and are often disorganized.
So let’s talk about the third style. So those first two styles, the High D and the High I, they were more the extroverted type, they are people who react to their environment, they react to information, they react to situations, so they are very outgoing. Let’s talk about the next two and the next two are more on that introverted scale, people who are more guarded, people who are more process oriented.
So let’s talk about the first one, the first one is known as steadfastness or the S style. The S style communicator is very accepting of others, they like cooperation and harmony. They are very good at calming others and in fact they are known as the harmonizers and people often see them as such. The S communicators like security, they like being part of a team and they love stability and they like a stable environment. These people are not risk takers at all like the D’s and the I’s were. And they totally dislike change and in fact they will avoid change at all costs. They are very, very patient, they are very, very loyal and they are wonderful listeners.
In fact in testing the communications styles with listening tests that you can actually fail the ones that score the highest in those listening tests are the S’s. Typically my S’s will score in those listening tests from the 80 to 90 percentile range whereas all the other types, the D, the I, and the last one that I’ll mention which is the C type tend to score much lower, 50% or lower, just a little FYI.
So let me talk a little bit more about the steadfast style. The S’s prefer to work with others, they like to take time to establish cohesiveness, they don’t want to just like rush and jump in to things, they want us to get to know each other better. They have a very predictable manner and are known as the peacemakers. In fact if you are in a workplace conflict, find your local S to help resolve that conflict because they are intuitively very, very good at resolving conflict.
Let’s talk about the last style. This is also an introverted style, very guarded and that’s the Conscientious style or the high C. The C communicator is very, very cautious, they are detailed, they demand quality, they like to work under known conditions, and they prefer to follow written standards and rules of procedures. They are neat and orderly and tidy, they value accuracy, in fact precision is their middle name, and they are very, very tactful and diplomatic.
So let me talk a little bit about their strengths and their weaknesses as well. Some of their strengths are they are artistic and musical, very schedule oriented, they keep their emotions in check, they like long range goals, are serious and analytical and they like charts and graphs and data and more data and more data. Their weaknesses they tend to be very perfectionist, they can be moody and are very suspicious of information unless they have the good facts for it. Can be inflexible at times, pessimistic and sometimes slow to action.
So you need to understand these four types. We are going to take a break right now and when we come back we are going to talk a little bit more about how do you coach and manage these four styles and we’ll come back in a just few minutes in Today’s Inspiring Women, stay tuned.
Welcome back to Today’s Inspiring Women, I am your host Deanne Demarco and today we are talking about communication, how to improve your communication so you can drive sales, so you can retain the best and the brightest and you can help maybe reduce workplace conflict. Just before the break I was talking about the four communication styles and before we go on I want to give you a little bit more information around the fears of the four communication styles. Because a lot of times if we can understand the fears of the four communications styles we are able to understand them a little bit better.
And the fear with the dominant style or the high D, remember the D style was the extroverted driver, their fear is loss of control. So they like to be in charge of their environment, they like to be in charge of everything that they do so their fear is loss of control.
And looking at the other extroverted type which is the influence style or the high I, they are the ones that like to socialize and have a lot of communication with people, their fear is the fear of social rejection. So you need to understand that in communicating with this high I, they definitely have a fear that you may not like them because they like to have this social communication and interaction with people.
And taking a look at the two styles on the introverted scales, the S or the steadfastness styles their fear is the loss of a stable environment, remember the steadfast or the S person is somebody who likes a nice, calm environment, they like a harmonious environment so their fear is the loss of a stable environment or loss of stability.
And the last style was the Conscientious style or the C style, those were the ones who are very perfectionist, their fear is the fear of criticism of their work so they tend to get a lot of details around their work because they want their work to be accurate because of their fear of criticism on their work.
So I wanted you to understand their fears just a little bit. So let’s talk a little bit more about how strengths over used become weaknesses. So the D style, who is very good at directing and deciding may become a little autocratic. The high I who is good at promoting and persuading may over sell and end up manipulating. The S, the steadfast group who is steady and agreeable may give in despite their own personal needs in fact they are often seen as the person who will give you the shirt off their back in order to please you. The C who is really good at analyzing and checking for details and checking for accuracy may become perfectionistic and indecisive.
So all of these styles have strengths and all of these styles have weaknesses and so I want to address that just a little bit more on how do you manage and how do you coach them and how do you actually sell to these four different styles.
So let me tell you a little bit more about you and each of these four different styles. If you are a dominance manager leader your strengths may include that you are really comfortable in the leadership role, you are really quick at decision making, you are direct with people so they know where you stand and you are excellent at solving problems. But you need to understand that people may often perceive you as being intimidating and being insensitive to others needs and that you may be a little bit impatient. So if you are this high D style you need to be, in order to be more effective as a manger leader, you need to start developing more patience, you need to maybe tone down your directness and start asking more questions to people rather than telling them what to do all the time because that telling seems like, other people feel like they are just been hit on the head with a hammer all the time. In order to be more effective as a manager in your D style, you need to start spending more time with those people that you direct and that you lead because as D’s we don’t tend to do that.
So let’s talk a little bit more about your fear of this influence [17:52], of this high I manager leader. So your strengths are that you have a true and open door policy, come in and talk to me and we will talk about it. You are someone who gives time easily to those who you direct so if anybody has an issue they can come in and talk to you. You are wonderful at inspiring others and motivating others. You are very enthusiastic in fact people will often comment how you are the energizer bunny, you are just very enthusiastic. You tend to give a lot of positive feedback to others and even when delivering negative feedback you have a natural tendency to be able to do that in a real positive way, I’m not sure how you are able to do that but you are able to do that. Those that work with you however may see some limitations in your management style. For example they may not be getting the details that they need from you in directing them. They may see that your approach tends to be more superficial, that you tend to lack follow through. In order to be more effective as a manager if you are in the high I or this influence style, you need to be more specific; in fact specific is the key operative word here, more specific in praise and giving work directions to others. You need to start listening better, you need to start talking less and listening more, so you can hear what people really need from you. You are not going to like this one at all but you need to start being a little bit more organized, freedom from chaos can be a beautiful thing but you need to start being a little but more organized.
So let’s talk about the last two, the steadfast style and the conscientious style. If you are that steadfast manager or leader, some of your strengths are you are a phenomenal listener I mean you’ll listen to everybody, you are excellent at listening. You are very empathetic and you are sensitive to the needs of others sometimes to a fault actually. You are good with self directed work teams, teams that are able to direct themselves, you appreciate your people and you tell them why you appreciate them and you are very good at that. And you tend to be very, very consistent in your leadership style so people tend to be able to depend on you and the type of style that you have.
You need to know that people that you need may see some of the following limitations in the way that you are leading them. One of them is that you tend to be indecisive and they are wondering why you taking so long to make a decision. Sometimes you are not really very direct with your direct reports and giving directions to them so they see you as been way too indirect in giving directions. Sometimes they see you as been hesitant to implement a needed change and that’s part of the fact that you don’t like change so you tend to be hesitant in implementing a needful change.
Now if you are in this S style you can be more effective as a manager, leader if you start becoming more assertive and direct and that might be a little bit hard but you need to start been more assertive and direct. You need to start learning how to cope better with change and not carrying the burden of everyone’s problems on your shoulders, spread it around let other people deal with some of those burdens as well.
Let’s talk about more about you as a conscientious leader this that high C manager or leader. So some of your strengths are you believe in fairness to everyone, you follow standards and procedures and you want those policies and procedures in place. You are very conscientious, you are willing to pitch in and do the same work as your people. You are very, very accurate and you are able to keep confidences.
Now you need to understand that people who work with you may see you as being overly perfectionistic. Sometimes they see you as being a little aloof, that you tend to hamper creativity in others with your desire to stick to the rules and the facts. So you can be more effective as a manager if you are the C style, the conscientious style if you start accepting differences, talking more with those people you direct since you tend not to be a very talkative person. You need to start to encourage creativity in others.
So these are just some of the little, more information about you. Let me talk a little bit about, before we go in to break here let me talk a little bit about some of the humorous sides of these communications styles.
Now if you are a high D the chances are you sometimes like to eat over the sink, you love to microwave everything including water, you never follow recipes and you are always adding in some substitute or adding in new things.
If you are a high I you tend to like gourmet foods, you have the latest kitchen gadgets even if you don’t know how to use them and you are attracted to fancy packaging which should be a clue also for the sales people who are listening.
If you are a high S you tend to value meals and you consider them to be a very important family time. You tend to eat from the four basic food groups everyday and you cook whatever anyone wants to eat even if it means eating things that you personally do not like.
And with a high C you tend to read all the labels, you know all the percentages of proteins, fats and carbohydrates in foods and you tend to buy kitchen gadgets if they are economical and well constructed.
So those are some of the little humorous sides of the four types. You know that if you get in to a busy elevator and you are pushing the buttons that quickly closes the door you know that you are a high D. If you are at that elevator and saying, ‘hey there is always room for one more come on in, you don’t want to be late we’ll wait for you’, chances are you are a high I. If you are someone who waits in line, moving in one line to another, appearing to be unable to make a decision, chances are that you may be a high S. And if you get in to that elevator and if it’s crowded, you start counting the number of people and you start figuring out what the weights are of each person and look at the weight limit and the number of people limit on that elevator and if you think it is exceeding, chances are you get off the odds are you a high C.
It’s time for a break here let’s go ahead and take a break we are going to come back and talk a little bit more about communication, how to coach and manage and sell to the four communication styles so stay tuned we’ll be right back in Today’s Inspiring Women.
Welcome back to Today’s Inspiring Women, we are talking about communications, how to be more effective in communication, so you can drive sales, be more effective as a manager or a coach and how to sell to the four communications styles.
So the direction I’d like to go in next, so we are talking about the four communications styles and those four communications styles were dominance, influence, steadiness and conscientiousness. So the two styles that were on that extroverted scale was the dominance and influence side, the D and the I. Those two communications styles that were more on the introverted side were the conscientiousness and the steadfastness or steadiness group.
Now in understanding the four styles there are two that tend to be very, very task focused in the way they see the world and that is the dominance and the conscientiousness that is the D and the C. And there tend to be more on the relationship side and that tends to be the influence and the steadiness group. So if you were to draw a box and divide it in half each way so that you end up with four quadrants, that upper left would be dominance or that High D, to the right of that would be the high I and those would be your extroverts. And on the bottom would be on the far lower right the S or the steadiness or the steadfast style and on the lower left would the conscientiousness or the C, the C style.
So taking a look at it from those four quadrants, the upper two boxes are your fast paced, they tend to be very, very reactive in how they communicate whereas the two in the bottom tend to be the introverted style, they tend to process information. That’s a keyword in understanding both the S and the C, is they tend to process information. So looking at the two boxes that are on the far left which would the dominance and the conscientious style, those two groups are very task focused, they are very guarded in the communication. Whereas the two on the far right would be the influence and the steadfast style and those are the two styles that are very open in their communication and they are very relationship driven.
So that gives you a little understanding about these four styles a little bit more. So let’s talk about if you are going to be coaching or managing these four styles.
So if you are going to be managing and coaching these four styles let’s take a look at the high D. The high D is someone who wants power, they want authority, they want prestige, they love challenges. In fact when looking at challenges they like to win, you need to understand that, they are very results oriented because they are on that task focused side, very results bottom line. In fact you often hear them say, ‘just give me the bottom line here’. They like to understand, if you are going to be giving them a task, they like to understand the wide scope of the operation, so you need to give them that big picture view before you give them their individual task. They are someone who really likes direct answers to direct questions. They like a lot of freedoms from controls so once you give a high D a task or a project don’t go micro managing them unless of course you want them to quit on you because they like to have a lot of control around their work and the work that they do. They also like a lot of new and varied activities; they are not someone who likes to do the same type of activity day in and day out, they tend like to have a variety in their life. So through mentoring or coaching, you can assist them to learn how to identify better with others, you can help them to focus on their intrinsic rewards around projects. You can help them and coach them to be more empathetic when working with others. The D’s need to understand that they often come on as very coarse with others, that they often come on as sometimes too independent with others and that they often intimidate others or even alienate others.
So in managing or coaching your high D’s, you need to give them really an understanding of where they are coming from. So in coaching a D show them the simplest and quickest way to be productive, be firm and direct and clearly define the limits of their authority so they know because otherwise they won’t know, they will either try and take over or they’ll think somebody else is in charge and they won’t do the work at all. So those clear lines of authority are very, very important with that D.
So let’s look at how do we coach and manage someone with that high I or that high influence dimension of behavior. So some of the high I dimension behavior he’s going to want definitely social recognition, they are definitely going to want rewards, they want to know that what their work is doing is making a difference. They are going to want people to know that they are doing a great job so public recognition of their ability. They want people to talk to, don’t put a high I in isolation unless of course you want them to quit on you. They love talking with others, they love these casual warm relationships, they like freedom from control and they really dislike detail, pair them up with someone who loves detail and let that person deal with the detail work, they do not like a lot of detail. They like approval, they like you to be friendly and they just like to be around others so they really like to work in team and getting interacting with others.
So let me just talk about the differences between a D and an I here. So if you are going to give a task to a High D, the high D is going to say, just give me the bottom line, telling me as it is, what do I need to do, what is the quality level and then just leave me alone and let me do it.
The high I on the other hand, you give them that same task and they are going to say, great who else is involved, who else can get involved in this project, who else can work with me on this project and, oh by the way can we have a party afterwards? So in coaching that high I, you may need to give them an understanding around the sense of urgency around the completion of a task, you may need to give them some more precise and detailed information around the task.
So let’s take a look at how do we manage and coach the two on the bottom half, the S and the C behavior, I am talking about if you put the four quadrants together, those two introverted styles. So if you are going to be giving a task to a high S or a steadfast style, you need to understand they are going to want to know like what’s the status quo, is there security in this project, are we going to get it completed. They really like to work with people who are happy and are in calm environments, they like standardized procedures and they really want you to be sincere and believe me they can tell if you are not sincere in talking with them. They like genuine appreciation but not necessarily in public in fact they almost prefer it in private. They also like recognition for their service in the task that they are completing and they like the opportunity to really specialize in some task or activity at work so give them that opportunity.
So in coaching and mentoring this group you may need to assist this person with definitely anything around change. You need to understand that if there is a change coming on, you need to give them fair warning about that change way in advance because they need time to process that there might be a change coming because it really interferes with their whole need for stability in their lives. You may need to give them some more self affirmations, give them some short cut methods on how to do something. You need to help them understand that what their accomplishments are definitely worthwhile.
So in coaching this high S you need to understand that you need to use a step by step plan for their development, you need to provide that one on one hands on instruction with them and use real regular informal type of feedback with them and you need to be warm and sincere and statements that are complimentary, complimenting their efforts so they know that you appreciate their work.
And taking a look at the C, managing and coaching the high C, you need to understand that the C dimension behavior may want really clearly defined expectations, real limited exposure. They like you to be really reserved, they like a business like type of environment, they like an opportunity to really demonstrate their expertise with no sudden changes, they like selective involvement in the work that they are doing.
So you may need to help or coach or manage them or mentor them in coming with a realistic assessment of practical limits, understand that there is a tolerance for conflict, how to participate in groups and you might need to give them some group participation skills because they may not have those skills. And they have a tolerance for ambiguity so you need to help them and coach them in those areas.
So in coaching or managing this conscientious, this C type you need to provide very specific, factual statements of what level of performance is required. You need to use real accurate statements and check for understanding and acceptance of information. You need to provide them time because they are process oriented just like the S’s are, very process oriented with the information that you are giving them and time for them to practice skills and set time limits for practicing otherwise they will just keep going over and over and over to do the project that you have given them, so just a little bit more about those four styles in coaching and managing them.
So let me just give you a little bit more humor here, if you are on the golf course, you got to be careful of a D driving the golf cart because they frequently will drive their golf cart and play through groups of golfers. On the golf course that high I spends so much time in the club house, talking on the course, they may forget that they had a tee time. The S golfs’ the same day at the same time in the same place using the same clubs every time. And on the golf course that high C keeps scores and plays strictly by the rules and you can count on them often cleaning their clubs every time they have used it, just wanted to give you a heads up, a little bit about the humor around the golf course on the four styles.
This is Deanne Demarco, we are going to take a short break here and when we come back we are going to talk more about conflicts and selling to the four communications styles so stay tuned, we’ll be right back with Today’s Inspiring Women.
Welcome back, this is Deanne Demarco with Today’s Inspiring Women. We are talking about how to fine tune you communication to be more effective in retaining the best, increasing sales, decreasing conflict and how to manage and coach the four communication styles in the workplace. So we talked in the first segments about the four communication styles, dominance which is the high D style, influence which is the high I style, steadiness which is the high S style and conscientiousness which is the high C style.
We talked about how each of them have strengths and how each of them have weaknesses, for example we said dominance or the D style likes to delegate and they thrive in their position whereas their weaknesses is they tend to be quick tempered and they often cant relax. The high I style, someone who is very sincere and creative and cheerful, they are the life of the party but their weakness is they tend to dwell on trivia and they tend to be compulsive talkers and sometimes forgetful and they often repeat stories. The high S or the steadfast styles, they tend to be very patient and loyal and they are good listeners and their weaknesses is they tend to worry a lot, they need structure they tend to be too shy or too compromising. And the high C style, the conscientious style, tends to be very, very analytical, analystic, perfectionist, they tend to be. On their weakness side they tend to be self centered and hard to please, sometime spend too much time planning.
So what I’d like to go in to now is, now that you understand these four styles a little bit is how do you deal with conflict with these four styles? So in dealing with conflict with the four styles, the high D, you need to understand that that high D is because they are drivers, for them to be in conflict, they perceive conflict that they have to win this conflict, they’re like a Sherman tank. The Sherman tank has a gun, that big gun up the front and you just load those shells in and pound and pound until the whole army can go through the wall. That’s how the D’s are in conflict, is they’ll just pound you and pound you and pound you and just keep driving their point until it’s like I win, you lose, it’s take no prisoners, I win, you lose, it’s their way or the highway.
Let’s look at conflict with that high I, so the high I remember this is the talkative group, the high I group is like throwing a hand grenade, you pull the pin out of a hand grenade, you throw the hand grenade into a group of people and you hope the shrapnel hits something. Well that’s how high I’s are in conflict, we may start talking about and arguing about whether we should have bottled water, not have bottled water and then they’ll start bringing in all these other different topics and you end up talking about yellow folders. And you’ll sit there and scratch your head and go, wait a minute how did we get from bottled water to yellow folders? And it’s because they bring up all these different ideas and they don’t sit on any one of them too long and they keep bouncing from idea to idea to idea where you are going from one idea to another and you sit there and you scratch your head and you go, wait a minute, how did we get there? So that’s the high I style, it’s like that hand grenade.
The high S in conflict tends to be the yes man, whatever you say, just tell me what you want and we are going to go ahead and do it. And so they are often perceived as these yes people, we’ll just do it; whatever you want to do is how we are going to do it.
And conflict with the C’s, they are often perceived as whiners and the reason for that is because they are so fact focused that they can’t see any other way of doing a project other than what their facts are telling them is the correct answer. So they tend to be perceived as whiners in trying to get their point across that this is the only way to do it.
So how do you deal with each of these four different types? If you are dealing with the high D, you need to stand toe to toe, you need to be clear on what your position is and that they need to listen to you, do not back down. In fact they will see you as weak and try to take advantage of that if they perceive that you are weak so you need to stand toe to toe.
Now if there are two of you who are D’s together and you are having a conflict, you need to understand that two D’s going head to head, have you ever seen pictures of the sheep with the horns that ram each other and they just crash in to each other? That’s how two D’s are in conflict so what ends up happening is the two D’s will truly butt heads together until one wins. So if you are having a conflict with another D you need to really say, I perceive that both of us each have a firm stand here, let’s maybe do a pro con chart and look at the different directions. Maybe we both need to look at compromise, maybe we both need to look at how we can cooperate so that we can both get the results that we want. The other thing that might happen with two D’s in conflict is one may totally breakdown and say, fine we’ll do it your way, and then that person that just backed down won’t do what they are supposed to do. They’ll tell you they will but they won’t do it.
In dealing with conflict with a high I, you need to help keep them focused on what you are really having the conflict about, so you really need to help them maybe actually write it down that this conflict is around the bottled water versus tap water and so you keep them focused on that conflict.
If you are having a conflict with a high S you need to ask more questions, do not give your position on the conflict until you hear their conflict ahead of time. Also making an appointment with that person, say you know I perceive we are having a conflict around whether or not we should have bottled water or tap water, why don’t we get together again tomorrow and talk about how we can address the water issue and the direction we should go. Do not give your opinion first; let them give their opinion first.
If you are having a conflict with a high C, then that high C you need to also give them time to get their data so you also need to maybe set an appointment with them and then you need to be prepared with data as well and need to take a look at the data that both of you have acquired in dealing with the issue at hand. What are the pros and cons of using bottled water, what are the pros and cons in using tap water so both of you need to get all that information together.
And sales, how do you sell to those four types? With the D’, be direct, to the point, get to the bottom line, don’t give them a lot of fluff, get right to task and know your stuff. With the high I, if you are trying to sell to a high I, you need to start with relationships and help them to understand that you care about them as a person before going in to the sales pitch. If you are selling to a high S, you need to give them time to process, they need time to think about it, you need to know your facts but you need to be very, very personable with them and you need to approach them, not be real pushy, but you need to approach them in a nice, calm manner in the approach and what their needs are, ask those questions don’t be asking telling questions. If you are trying to sell to a high C, man, you had better know the details. If you do not know all the details about what it is you are trying to sell them, they will not even listen to you. So you must know the details around all the information that you are trying to sell.
So if you would like more information around this communication stuff, I actually in my coaching practice actually have the Marsten test that I distribute to people and then we can fine tune the results of that test on sales or coaching or managing or leading the four different types or more general ones as well, I also have one for personal relationships also. So you can contact me at [email protected] for that information or call me at 708-836-0118 and I’ll be glad to hook you up with the communication styles stuff. It’s just fascinating; I’ve just touched the iceberg here on all the information that is available round these communication styles.
Today’s show was brought to you by Breaking Boundaries International, Breaking Boundaries provides personalized coaching and corporate training services to business professionals and organizations. If you are looking to breakthrough your personal boundaries and career roadblocks, Breaking Boundaries International can help. Breaking Boundaries International has won national recognition from Training Magazines top 100 for the management coaching clinic programs. Their services include executive and personal coaching, corporate training for managers, Breaking Boundaries can also provide motivational business speakers for your next business meeting or next conference or association meeting. They can be reached at www.breaking-boundaries.com and their phone number is 86691COACH.
I want to leave you with a quote today and the quote I want to give you is by George Deer and he says that, everything you want is on the other side of your fear. I just love that, everything that you want is on the other side of your fear.
Well you have been listening to Today’s Inspiring Women, I am your host Deanne Demarco and each week we address relevant topics for women to spark your career and life and personal and professional growth. Thank you for tuning in today, I am your host Deanne Demarco, have a wonderful day.
Michelle Van Slyke VP Marketing of USP Stores
Jennifer Kahweiller: Author, Quiet Influence
Host: Deanne DeMarco
Guests: Michelle Van Slyke, VP of UPS Stores
Jennifer Kahweiller, Author
Air Date: April 25, 2013
Station Intro Welcome to Today's Inspiring Women, with your host Deanne DeMarco. On today's program, you will meet the next business and entrepreneurial rising star. You will learn from their successes, challenges and life lessons to find out what has made them recognized in their fields. Now here is your host Deanne DeMarco.
Deanne: Welcome to Today's Inspiring Women. I am your host Deanne DeMarco. If you are interested in becoming a sponsor for this show, give us a call at 708-836-0118. If you are ready to take the next steps to become empowered, motivated and better equipped for success, then stay tuned. My first guest today is Michelle Van Slyke, Vice President of Marketing and Small Business Solutions at the UPS Store. She is in charge of leading advertising, PR, communications and product development for over four thousand three hundred at the UPS Store locations. At the helm, she has led a brand repositioning to focus and developing products and services designed to meet the needs of small business owners. Michelle has spent her career in the world of advertising, either at the helm of the Chief Marketing Office or for such companies as Ford Motor Company, Jaguar, Mercedes Benz, Jacuzzi. So we are going to learn a lot from her today. Michelle welcome to Today's Inspiring Women.
Michelle: Oh, it is my pleasure to be with you.
Deanne: I am reading over your background. You have a lot that we can learn from you. Tell me, how did you get started down this path?
Michelle: I have been so fortunate. You know, you talk about mentors and I have had my share of mentors along the way. It certainly started at the University of Southern California. I had one professor from my Marketing 101 class as you could imagine, Professor _______ got me excited about marketing and I have been in it ever since.
Deanne: So that is how you started getting into marketing and advertising. How did you get into tthat first? I mean, you started out in the automobile industry, so how did you get started down that path?
Michelle: Yeah, it was great. I went to Notre Dame for graduate school and Ford Motor Company recruited out of obviously Notre Dame and really just a wonderful way to start a career. Ford is so customer focused, I actually started in the customer call center talking to customers. So, as a marketer it has been extremely valuable throughout my career to be a good listener with what the customers needs are, what their concerns are, what they love, so I started early in my career at Ford and learned a lot.
Deanne: Now the automobile industry is a really male dominated field right?
Michelle: Yeah it is. It is like anything else. So many industries are male dominated and you go in and you focus on doing your job really well. I always tried to make sure that I was contributing. I find so often, sometimes that women get into roles, or men for that matter, and they focus on getting things done but it necessarily doesn't impact your business. So, I always focused on how am I contributing to growing the business and the rest is really it from there, but I also had great mentors. In the automotive industry men can be great mentors.
Deanne: What were some of the challenges that you had to face and how did you overcome them?
Michelle: You know it is a lot of working with the teams, you know, bringing a product to market can be very complicated. So, you ended up working in teams and most of the teams were all male and you just tried to work with them, focus on what the problems and issues were, be crystal clear on what they were and then look to really solve those. You know, it is a balance between doing your job and sort of getting along with others, learning who they are and understanding what their issues are and seeking to overcome those.
Deanne: Wow. So was there anything as far as having to bolster your credibility in working with men or any issues like that, that you had to work through?
Michelle: You know, sometimes I felt like I needed to be the overachiever and do things either better, or do more of them. As a result, I would say early in my career, not always a good balance between work and life. I found that my work clearly dominated my life. So where I am today is more a balance. I think it should go on and be able to be successful. You are able to balance that out better.
Deanne: So it sounds like in the beginning there were some of those real balance issues with family.
Michelle: Oh, absolutely. Yeah. I got married for the first time, I keep joking, about 3 years ago, so I just completely focused on my career early on and felt that it was really necessary to be successful. In hind sight I would strongly encourage those that are early in their career, to do a better job of balancing the two. I am sure you could still be successful.
Deanne: Any suggestions in that arena?
Michelle: You really have to decide that you are going to do that. Certainly that is the place that I am in today. Once you decide that you can do both, you clearly can. You prioritize better, you focus on the key issues, and you just decide that you are going to do that and it turns out it is perfectly fine to do that versus always thinking that you have to be completely focused on only your career to be successful. You can do both.
Deanne: Good advice. So what has caused you to make the switch? You have been in the automobile arena for many years, 15 at least, 15 years right?
Michelle: Yeah. It was actually a little bit more than that and it was one of those things. I was at a crossroads in my career and decided that I am either going to stay in automotive for the duration or I am going to branch out. As a marketer I thought it was important to really balance it out. It turns out as I moved on to other industries, the skills and the discipline in marketing that I learned applies across industries. So, looking back it turns out I was a marketer who happened to be in the automotive industry. I love the fact that I have been able to stay in a franchise system. Automotive is a franchise system and I am in a franchise system right now with the UPS Store. As you mentioned, I lead marketing for over four thousand three hundred retail locations and they are all independently owned through our franchise system. So a lot of transferability and learning I got from the automotive industry that I can use today.
Deanne: So tell us a little bit about this current role of VP with Marketing at the UPS Store Franchises.
Michelle: Yeah. It is great. I lead all of the advertising, public relations, communications, product development and certainly the on-line space. We have an opportunity to really help grow the business for each of our retail locations, handle all of the communications and advertising across the nation, also work independently with the co-ops and co-op advertising groups that our franchise groups participate in, and do a lot to get feedback from them. Last week I was out at some network meetings talking to our franchisees and this past week our marketing advisory committee was in town and again, a lot of learning and insights from them which is a great way for us to really expand our business and grow.
Deanne: Wow. So, what are some of the learnings in your path that you have been taking that other women can learn from?
Michelle: Well you certainly want to stay disciplined. What I find a lot of time is that people will base decisions on personal opinion and really it doesn't work that way. Over the past 2 years for example, we have done a lot of research with small business owners. We have done focus groups. We have done ethnography research, which you know you basically follow a small business owner around a day in the life. We have done surveys. Small business owners have done journals for us so that we can understand how their daily lives are. So, I would say, work to be extremely fact based and really garner insight. For us to really be able to fill the needs of the small business owner, we need to understand what they are going through and what their pain points are and what their passions are. I have found a lot of time, people will just base their work on personal opinions and that is not the way that it works.
Deanne: Okay, so based upon your experience, maybe some of our listeners out there are sitting there going I would like to be a small business owner or be part of a franchise. How do they know if they are a good fit?
Michelle: You really have to dig into it and do some homework. Really look at what your skill base is, what you are good at, what your passion points are. We have found that there are really 2 types of small business owners, those who get into business in an area that they are really interested in. You know, someone loves flowers, they open up a flower shop. Then we find that there is another type of business owner who really is in the business to be in business. Have a good understanding of which one you are. We really have resources to help you with either one. If you are an independent business owner and you got passion points, we have some great resources on our website. We do blogs to provide insights in different areas. We have partners with some vendors to get you some discounts, and then on the other side if you are in the business to be in business, we offer franchises as well, which is an area where it is more disciplined where you get the benefit of being part of a network where tools are supplied for you, whether it is advertising or help with your accounting. So you really have to differentiate what type of small business owner you are.
Deanne: Time wise, I think that you probably have to evaluate how much time you really want to spend before you go down the path of being a small business owner as well, correct?
Michelle: Oh, absolutely. Growing up, my parents actually owned a business so I had the pleasure of being an employee in their business, and being a small business owner is really challenging. We have also learned that from our research. I have really the passion and compassion for small business owners. It really is a challenging place to be and that is why we work so hard and why I work so hard to support them in any way we can. Certainly the recent recession really changed the flavor of what it means to be a small business owner. We are finding that a lot of them want to do business locally in their community to support each other and I think that is one of the benefits of really our network and the fact that they are locally owned and operated.
Deanne: That is very interesting. I think people think they are going to quit their job and become an entrepreneur and I don't think people really spend the time to really think that through before you make that leap and it sounds like you definitely need to do that.
Michelle: Yeah, absolutely. You should be putting together a disciplined business plan just like any other business would do, and know that there are resources out there for you. There is organizations like SCORE that help with small business education and mentorship. We have got a link on our website to SCORE as well. They provide, really professional mentors, individuals who have been out in the business world and they will mentor you and help you from start to finish.
Deanne: Yeah. It sounds like you have a lot of resources on your website. We will have to get that after the break. We are coming up to a break here pretty soon. So we will make sure that we get that information out to everybody. So, what are you most passionate about in your current role?
Michelle: Well I love the fact that I am able to help small business owners. We have worked hard, like I mentioned, to assist them and then again on our website we have vendor offers that really you cannot get anywhere else. We have exclusive offers, for example, with DotComGuy. We learned that technology and IT is one of the biggest challenges for small business owners. For example, DotComGuy is offering 50% off of their services through our website. So, we partnered with organizations and businesses that really overcome some of the major pain points that small business owners have.
Deanne: Very interesting. We are going to take a short break here and then we are going to come back. This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women and we are talking to Michelle Van Slyke from the UPS Stores.
Deanne: This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women and we are talking to Michelle Van Slyke who is the Vice President of Marketing and Small Business Solutions for the UPS Stores. Michelle, just before break we were talking about the entrepreneur and I would like to dive a little bit deeper into this ring a little bit more. Let's talk about women and being an entrepreneurial ship for women. Is that a possibility and are there any challenges around that? What are your thoughts on that?
Michelle: Yeah, absolutely. This has been a major focal point for us over the last several years. We have actually been the sponsor of the Entrepreneur of the Year Award that ______ Magazine puts out. This is our 6th year participating in it, and it really is an opportunity for really 3 types of entrepreneurs to be recognized. There is an award for established business. There is an award for an emerging entrepreneur and also a college entrepreneur, which is really an exciting award that goes on. I would strongly encourage anyone who is budding and getting their business started to enter this contest. The contest entry runs through June of this year. The past winners, we have had 2 female winners these past years and I think it is really a recognition point for an entrepreneur. You get featured on the magazine, there is press involved with it, and there has been some very notable winners. I think everybody is familiar with Kind Bars right now. Their distribution has been quite large and they are a past winner, for example. I would strongly encourage anyone who is starting to get involved and enter so that they can get the recognition and really the exposure I think is a lot of what is needed today when you are getting started.
Deanne: So it is very interesting. So people can enter this if they are still in college?
Michelle: Yeah. There is one for a college entrepreneur. It is for an undergraduate or a graduate student and if they have a promising business plan, and it is really just an idea at this point, they can enter as well. Part of the contest is that they create a video on what their idea is, nothing more of a homegrown video and look, and they can enter as well. It is really great exposure and it is really a wonderful learning experience for a college student to get engaged.'
Deanne: That is very interesting. So it is not just to be an entrepreneur at the UPS Stores, but an entrepreneur period.
Michelle: That is right, yeah. The ideas run, oh gosh, they just run a gamete of ideas. Our past winner, the college winner, was fabulous. The young man had an idea about advertising on toilet paper, so they went through their research and they found a very specific ink and they found a supplier and they are in process right now of really trying to expand their distribution. My point is, it can be any idea and I will tell you what, this young man is very passionate about expanding the notion of advertising in toilet paper and his thought was, you know, you could put it in bars and restaurants and in your neighborhood and really get the word out. It is a lot of fun.
Deanne: And UPS sponsors this?
Michelle: We have, yes. Like I mentioned, this is our 6th year of sponsorship. In addition to sort of the entries and the exposure that you get in the online space, there is an award event every year. This past year it was in Dallas, and coming up it will be in New Orleans. We have about 800 people who attend. It is free to attend to anyone that wants to basically enroll and attend the event. Most of the people attending are budding small business owners as well. We have guest speakers and we have training sessions and there are classroom discussions and it is really just a wonderful way to pull together individuals who are either looking to start or expand their small business.
Deanne: Well that is, I am really impressed. That is just really wonderful. It is a true outreach, a business outreach way beyond the boundaries of UPS.
Michelle: It is. Every year when we hold the event the speakers are great. Barbara Corcoran was our speaker this past year and she is inspiring. She talks about how she started her business way back when in the real estate business, which is no easy task again for a female to start a real estate business in New York City. She went through all of her challenges and how she persevered and her creativity and her ideas and she was just truly an inspiration for all of the individuals in attendance. Like I said, this is free. We sponsor the entire event so anybody that would like to attend can basically attend the event. They just enroll and they show up. At the event, there are all kinds of sessions with experts in different areas to provide insight and some training again for budding entrepreneurs.
Deanne: I am just really impressed with that. I think that is really wonderful. So is there more men that are entrepreneurs than women?
Michelle: We certainly do find a predominance, at least at the attendance that we have. There definitely are a lot of men there, but you know what, you find women just getting engaged more and more. Like I said, our last 2 years we have had female winners. The winner from this past year, a woman who has a company called Adafruit Industries. She went to MIT and she has a business in Manhattan where she basically sells, I would call them small technology kits. They are kits that you can buy and do little experiments in the light in the area of technology. So again, a little bit of a really nice way for other young women to see someone who is engaged in the technology side and be very successful.
Deanne: Are there any tips that you would offer women who want to go down this path in particular?
Michelle: Yeah. You really have to get out and talk with people and learn. You can't do it at home. I love people. You know, everybody wants to stay home and be on their laptops and be on their tablets and the like. You really have to get out and talk to others. You can learn a ton about what has been successful, what hasn't been successful, tips and ideas that would help you to sort of get to where you want to be faster. I think that is the beauty of it. Whether it is the entrepreneur event, it is the beauty of you know, going on our website and reading our blogs. Even on our website with our blogs, if you have got an idea, because you are a more seasoned small business owner we are happy to have you as a guest blog. You can go on our website. It is smallbiz.theupsstore.com and you can also be a guest blogger on our site. So get that level of exposure, learn a lot, and also contribute to others.
Deanne: Could you just give us that website again?
Michelle: It is smallbiz.theupsstore.com.
Deanne: So smallbiz.theupsstore.com?
Michelle: Correct. There is a lot of information on there. Like I said, we have blog information on various topics. We have several exclusive partners that offer discounts. I mentioned DotComGuy already. We have partnerships with Chase Paymentech, with Easy Print, Web.com, Reception HQ, and we will have even more this year. They have exclusive offers through our website for small business owners. Again, these we understand are the major pain points of small business owners are experiencing. We wanted to make sure that as we are looking to be a comprehensive small business solution, this is a way for us to assist in that area. So I strongly encourage if you have needs in this area, to visit our website, as well as the blog information runs the gamete in terms of topics.
Deanne: That is really useful information. You know, as a small business owner I am always looking for assistance with everything from helping with my corporate taxes to helping me set up a new website to you name it, printing, and I did not know that the UPS Stores now offer printing solutions in some of the franchise stores.
Michelle: Oh, absolutely. You know our small business owners within our store environment can assist you with everything from your business cards, if you want to make a brochure, if you have a proposal. A lot of our stores do wide format printing. We can offer just a breath of services. I think one of the services that we offer that small business owners may not know about is, we do have mailboxes in our stores, and the beauty of having a mailbox at the UPS store, is you get a real street address. So a lot of small businesses operate out of their home and it is just not as professional to be using your home address. So when you have a mailbox at our store, you are actually using a store address, so it just come across as more professional. Also, it is more convenient when you get mail or packages. Our store will either text you, e-mail you or call you to let you know that it is there so you can...you don't have to be home to accept packages. So we can do that on your behalf.
Deanne: Excellent. So before we break away here, what is some tips that you would offer women who want to get into the marketing and advertising world? Any tips that you would have for them?
Michelle: Yeah, I would definitely say start with the basics. You really from a disciplined perspective, get some training. I talked about the Marketing 101 class that I attended. Understand the disciplines of marketing and then work to really start at the bottom. When I started I started by talking to customers and getting engaged with them, and I think that is the most important piece. The core at what you do in the marketing arena is really to build relationships and get a good understanding of individuals and really how you can help them with their needs and wants. Learning it as a discipline and understanding and different elements is key. You know, in today's environment the number of tools that you have to reach individuals are broad, certainly in the social media space, the online space, it is pretty broad-based. You have a lot of tools and avenues in order to reach and engage with individuals but understanding what you are doing, how you are going to fulfill their needs, how to build that relationship is really what you can do to start and to get a good foundation and exactly what that means.
Deanne: Wonderful. So you have told us a lot about the UPS Store and a lot of the services that you offer for the entrepreneur. Is there anything that is new that is coming up?
Michelle: You know, we are constantly working to improve our systems. Moving forward, we are going to have a lot of activity in our on-line space in the print arena and make it easier for individuals to engage with us. We have a partnership with HP right now, with HP e-print where you can download their app and you can send files to our stores through their system. We will certainly look to expand that part of our business. People are on the go and you need to do things as you are out traveling and working so we want to make that more convenient. We have done a lot to be more mobile friendly and we will continue to expand in that arena as well.
Deanne: Wow. Well we are, I can't believe that we are just right out of time. Tell us one more time the best way for people to find UPS information. Would that be on the website that you just gave us?
Michelle: It would. Yeah our main website is theupsstore.com and then there is a small business solutions section that they can dive into to learn more.
Deanne: Well Michelle thank you very much for being here today on Today's Inspiring Women. Wow. I can't believe how fast time has flown. You have just been a very engaging guest. Thank you very much.
Michelle: Oh it is my pleasure. Thank you very much.
Deanne: Well, we are going to be taking a short break. Michelle again, thank you very much for being on Today's Inspiring Women. Stay tuned. After the break we are going to be learning about the introverted leader in the power of quiet influence. This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women. We will be right back.
Deanne: Welcome back. This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women. We are going to be speaking with Dr. Jennifer Kahnweiler, who is going to be talking about the Introverted Leader and Quiet Influence. Jennifer is an international speaker and has worked with clients such as General Electric, AT&T, National Center for Disease Control, NASA, and she has published two very interesting books. The first one is called The Introverted Leader: Building on Your Quiet Strength, which is actually a fantastic book. I have actually read that book. That book has sold over 20,000 copies and has just finished a new book called Quiet Influence: The Introverts Guide to Making a Difference, and it shows how introverts can harness their innate tendencies to make a real difference. Jennifer, welcome to Today's Inspiring Women.
Jennifer: Oh, I am so pleased to be here Deanne. Thank you for having me.
Deanne: I am just so fascinated. One of the things that came to mind immediately when I started reading your book is that you started doing research around the introverted leader. What drew you to this study of studying introverts?
Jennifer: Well you know, it was a number of different things, Deanne. I started back in early 2000 and noticed that a lot of the technology companies that I was working in had a very large proportion of introverts, quieter folks, and I had been familiar with the Myers Briggs, also always attracted to quieter folks. I married one. So I started putting my observing hat on, I guess you would say my introvert hat on, and I noticed that often times introverts were overlooked, they were ignored, they were misunderstood, even passed over for promotions. So I became very intrigued with what could I do to help facilitate introverts getting more of a voice in organizations and that is what led to a really exciting journey as I wrote The Introverted Leader and now as you mentioned, the latest book Quiet Influence.
Deanne: I would like to learn more about your research in this area. First of all, how does a woman know she is an introvert?
Jennifer: Well you know, there is a lot of ways to figure that out. What I go by is the Carl Young, Myers, Briggs type of orientation. One of the things that is the main differentiator is where you get your energy from. Are you internally focused? Do you think before you talk, you process things, you are careful in responding and you are in your head quite a bit. Versus the extroverted person who is more stimulated and their energy comes from outside themselves, you know more people, places, things. Of course there is a scale which we all know. So some of us there is even the term ambivert right, if we are sort of in the middle, but we are usually parked on one side or the other. So those are a couple of the differentiators between the introvert and the extravert.
Many people who you think are not introverts really are. They have learned to adapt and I would certainly say women, since your show is about women, that is one thing that women have from an early age we have learned to be very sociable and friendly and so we put that smile on our face. It has been amazing to me how many women I have worked with in both coaching and in speaking and training where they really are truly introverts but they have learned to put that smile on and be out there and be conversational.
Deanne: Tell us a little bit more about this Quiet Influence. What is that?
Jennifer: Well you know it is interesting. The Introverted Leader came out in 2009 and as you mentioned I was very fortunate to have a real good response from people being intrigued by the notion of leadership and how we can lead from an introverted or quieter side and recognizing that, yes, introverts are leaders and leaders are introverts. The focus of the first book was really a lot about how do you develop those strengths but how do you sort of fit into the extroverted world, how do you ramp up some of your skills? Well as I was out there talking with people and in groups and discussing the book, and a lot of reactions I got, people also wanted to know how do they make a difference across an organization, not necessarily even in a corporate setting, you know, non-profit, hospitals, schools, librarians, people at all levels of an organization who would, you wouldn't say in the traditional sense are necessarily going on a leadership track, although one could argue they do have leadership qualities. They wanted to know how do I influence when I don't necessarily have the authority? So, Quiet Influence, had me on a journey of looking at well what do introverts do so effectively? So I boiled that down to 6 strengths that I found from interviews and research that I did.
Deanne: Could you share those 6 strengths?
Jennifer: I am happy to. Well the 6 key strengths, Deanne, that I found were the following. The first one was taking quiet time and I started in my Quiet Influence process, or the model that I sort of put together based on this. Taking quiet time introverts really crave that solitude. In fact, if they don't have it, they can really go a little crazy. They prioritize that. They take advantage or it by scheduling on a calendar and that gives them the energy and the source of their innovation and of their really well-crafted ideas. So taking quiet time is one of the key strengths. Then building on that, once the quiet time is taken, what they tend to do is really prepare. That is being very strategic, you know, about how they are going to anticipate objections, whether they are in sales or in project management, or whatever they are in. They also do the research and they prepare answers that really show that they are the person at the meeting who isn't necessarily winging it. That is typically your introvert because they prepare it. Am I right? Have you noticed that?
Deanne: Sure.
Jennifer: By the way, managers who know that will give and teammates will give introverts the time they need not to throw things at them at the last minute. So the second thing was carefully preparing. I found that to be constant. The third strength was engaged listening or being really attentive and taking in information. It allows the introverts when they are trying to influence others, to really be a person, to go to person, the person who folks share things with, to establish report and gain mutual understanding. It really was amazing to me how often times I would find that the introverted or kind influencers were not the loudest in the room of course, but you know they certainly often times had the most impact. You know, who said the loudest idea is the best idea right?
Deanne: Yeah.
Jennifer: We know we have all see that. You and I have worked together in some settings and we certainly know that is true right?
Deanne: Right.
Jennifer: Then the fourth one after taking quiet time and preparation, they build on that with engaged listening. Then what I noticed is they go out into the world and share their well-crafted ideas and the self assessment they have done and they engage in some really purpose driven, one on one conversations. By the way, introverts do prefer that. It is not necessarily the large group discussions and the active talkative brainstorming that we are used to but it is the one on one small, really engaged thoughtful conversations that happen.
Deanne: Yeah right and they have a lot of strength there because I think they engage better one on one.
Jennifer: Absolutely. You and I, we both taught and we still do some seminars and I notice that you have probably seen the same thing, that you know, you can ask a group of introverts a question and there is like basically dead silence right? Then you might ask another one. Still dead silence. But then you say okay well talk to a few people about it or talk to one other person and the energy in the room just rises substantially doesn't it?
Deanne: Yeah, very much so.
Jennifer: So that is just a little tip if you are running a group like that, certainly to do that, but focusing the conversation is clearly what they do very well, particularly the quiet influencers who I interviewed and I saw making a huge difference in different settings that they work in. Then writing, the fifth one, is writing. Writing it down. Introverts really think through. We all do well when we set back and we are not even sure. We have got a lot in our head but we get pen to paper and all of a sudden those thoughts come out. There is one technique that I latched onto when I was writing the book called Free Writing that I learned from some of my quieter colleagues and that is you basically sit down for 10 minutes, you set the timer and you just keep writing on a topic and from all of that you write, usually an idea or two will bubble up and then you can go with that. So writing is so essential, not only for us just to clarify where we are at, but also to persuade others. So I always laugh because I can tell if people are introverted sometimes if I get a longer e-mail from them rather than the blip blip blip.
Deanne: Oh, sure.
Jennifer: Right? You say okay well that person might be....that is always a good clue because they clarify things very well. Then the sixth area is purposely using social media. This is one that I get a lot of push back from, from the quiet or the introverts that I work with, like I don't want to do anything. They turn their back on social media and that is really not what we need to be doing now. Social media is here to stay. In fact, it is a wonderful tool to develop report and understand what is going on on landscape in a certain field if you are trying to influence your manager or your clients or your customers. It is all about understanding and a lot of that you do through social media, but the key thing that I saw that introverts do very well is they think about what is the platform? What is my purpose? How and I going to use this more strategically than just be randomly posting on Facebook every time it pops up on my smart phone?
Deanne: It sounds the way you are talking about the 6 strengths of the introvert, you know, I am an extrovert, and I am sitting her going, man I think I would really benefit if I used some of these strengths.
Jennifer: Absolutely. That is what is so exciting about all of this. We have this Deanne, within both of them. Both of these sets of personality traits, you know, the good things about extroverts, there is certainly a lot. We also benefit when we tap into that, that other side of ourselves. I found in writing the book I had to constantly rely on these strengths and it made me I think, a better person for it, you know, taking quiet time. As you know you don't get writing done if you are constantly talking. The fun part for me was the interviews but then I had to really have the discipline to block off days and weeks at a time to do writing and to work with editors and to put pen to paper. So that is something where I tapped into my quiet introverted side and I took my quiet times to figure out the creative approach that I was going to use, and not struggling with how to position something in the book. So absolutely. So which one are you going to try? Which one appeals to you right now?
Deanne: Well I will tell you, this whole concept of focused conversations just lit up a big light in my head because my husband is an introvert and I am sitting there going he has these very in depth focused conversations with folks.
Jennifer: Yes.
Deanne: And more so, than I do. Then you mentioned it and I am going that is something that I really need to pay attention to.
Jennifer: And it might help if you do that with him right? I find with my husband, Bill, I have got to make sure that we make appointments to have these conversations. If we didn't do that I would be standing there running and looking at my watch saying okay get on with it and that is part of the problem with us who are the more extroverted folks just to slow down and smell the roses a little bit. Take that pause because it is very irritating to introverts when we are constantly interrupting them, onto the next thing, finishing their sentences, which we know we are unfortunately guilty of.
Deanne: Well talk about taking a pause, we have got to take a pause. We are going to take a short break. Stay tuned. We will be right back to Today's Inspiring Women.
Deanne: Welcome back. This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women. We are speaking with Jennifer Kahnweiler who is talking about quiet influence and the introverted leader. Jennifer just before break we were talking about the strengths of the introverted leader or the introvert. What are some of the challenges or challenges for women if they are introverts?
Jennifer: Oh, thank you for that question. Women I always feel a little sense of, I don't know if the word is sadness, but real empathy when I come across women in organizations who say to me they just feel that they have the double whammy. They are an introvert but they also are in a male dominated environment where they just can't get their voice heard. So a couple of the challenges they have and the I would like to suggest some solutions to that.
Deanne: That would be wonderful.
Jennifer: Yeah sure. One of them is lack of visibility. The numbers certainly as I mentioned are not in their favor. Women are just, as Sheryl Sandberg wrote in her book and took statistics you know there are only fourteen percent of executive officers and only twenty one of the fortune 500 CEO's are women. So when women introverts look around, you know, they are in the sea of male colleagues. They don't really see a lot of role models. So it is really essential even more so for women that they get these mentors and women who can sponsor them and advocate, not just women but also men who can tell them how to navigate their careers and be supportive. So lack of visibility is a real challenge for women. There is also this discomfort that introverted women have with the schmoozing and the networking which I totally understand, but if we go back to what I had mentioned earlier about having these one on one focused conversations, the purposefully using social media, you can play to your strengths as an introverted quiet woman and use those tools to start establishing one on one relationships.
I will give you an example. There is a woman who ran a program I was in yesterday. She is extremely introverted. She is very competent in what she does. She reached out to me several times and we had some one on one conversations and I was so impressed with the depth of her commitment to learning about this particular topic because she showed initiative and she told me how shy and introverted she is. She really did demonstrate ______ I would say in that arena because she was driven by her need to have more visibility and to learn more. Another one is negative impressions. Introverted women, people have bias against introverts in general. I wrote a lot about that in the last book in Introverted Leader that there is something called the perception gap, you know, what we put out there isn't what people are seeing a lot of the time. With women, as I mentioned earlier, we are supposed to be all friendly and smiley and women get.....what do you think people say about women who are quieter? What do you think that adjective is that they use?
Deanne: That they are a mouse or.....
Jennifer: No I haven't heard that one yet, but that could very well be said. Right and also that they are stuck up.
Deanne: Oh, that would be another one.
Jennifer: Yeah and also other women will say that about that. You know, what is wrong with them? There is a lot of suspicion when somebody doesn't show a lot on their face and what is called facial gymnastics as we describe it. They are not expressing everything that they are thinking and feeling, so what people do is they paint these negative perceptions on them. So the way around that is to again build on those one on one relationships, but also to just adapt in very small ways. I had a client who said that she just walked in everyday to her office and kind of made a bee line, so we discussed the advantage of smiling at one or two people or making eye contact. She said that just those two small things, she didn't have to smile all the time, but she made a few eye contact connections. She said that made a huge difference. People started responding to her different. She said that was the only thing that she changed. So you know, some of these things are just not huge.
I would say the third thing that women deal with is, because of that isolation they just don't have other women to talk to and so I think it is really important. Like Sheryl Sandburg said in there, we have to start talking about this, we have to reach out to each other, you know, in her book. I totally agree with that. I think these organizations that are more structured like the society of women engineers for instance, where they really put a lot of focus on structured mentoring and networking circles, the women's forums that you and I have spoken in numerous times in organizations, right, those used to be just sort of fly by night, but now the leadership, senior leadership luckily and fortunately are starting to pay more attention and even give them a little bit of a budget and let them not have to meet after hours and let them meet during the work day. The little things like that from an organizational perspective are helping women.
Deanne: Sure. Right.
Jennifer: But, it is still a big challenge for women who are quieter, but I think if they take some of those steps then, it really does make it a little easier to be seen and to be heard and to contribute and again, not to change who they are. That is a really important message, not to change your personality, but just to expand the repertoire.
Deanne: Who has been some really successful women introverts?
Jennifer: There have been a number of them. I mean, within political arenas, women like certainly Hilary Clinton is one that I think of or Condoleezza Rice. There have been women in technology. There is a women named Waley Dye who is an incredibly successful billionaire in the Silicone Valley. Andrea Young who is on the board of a number of organizations who is CEO of Avon, until recently. So, you know, there is a long list, in every field. We are just now becoming even more aware of women introverted leaders and they are stepping up more. I had a woman who is president of one of our technical universities, Lisa Rossbacher, and she is an introverted geologist by training, PhD, and she is speaking out now in her blog to encourage women in the stem fields, you know the science technology engineering and math, to really come out and she claims herself. I wrote about her in the book as well. She uses her blog as a platform to influence other women and young girls and it gives them a lot of stories about what it is like. It is really interesting.
Deanne: How do people get a hold of you?
Jennifer: Oh, well that is pretty easy. I guess it is pretty easy if you know how to spell my name. That is always the challenge right? It is Jenniferkahnweiler.com. I do a lot on Twitter, so people should follow me because I post on there a lot of different information. That is Jennifer kahnweiler, and we have a wonderful quick survey that people can do. They don't even need to sign up for it. Just go onto my website, Jenniferkahnweiler.com to determine if they are a quiet influencer or an expressive influencer and then get some resources on how to address those. So the book is Quiet Influence and we just re-released by the way the new, The Introverted Leader. We did a re-issue of it, Deanne, with a wonderful forward by Doug Conan, who is the CEO, former CEO of Campbell's Soup Company.
Deanne: Wow. We need to close. Jennifer, thank you very much for being on Today's Inspiring Women. Time has just flown here.
Jennifer: You have inspired me. Thank you Deanne.
Deanne: Well thank you. Our premiere sponsor is Breaking Boundaries International. Breaking Boundaries provides personalized coaching, and services for business professionals and organizations. Breaking Boundaries International won national recognition from Training Magazines Top 100 for the manager, coaching, clinic program. Those services provide executive and personal coaching, corporate training for managers and they can be reached at www.breaking-boundaries.com, or at 866-91COACH.
Today I want to wrap up with a quote from Ellen Degeneres. She says, “When I was younger, I thought success was something different. I thought when I grow up I want to be famous. I want to be a star. I want to be in movies. When I grow up I want to see the world, drive nice cars. I want to have groupies. But, my ideas of success have changed for today. For me, the most important thing in life is to live your life with integrity and not give in, into some peer pressure to try to be something that you are not, to live your life as an honest compassionate person, to contribute in some way.” So you have been listening to Today's Inspiring Women. I am your host Deanne DeMarco and each week we try to address relevant topics for women to spark your career and life. Thank you for turning in today. I am your host Deanne DeMarco. Have a wonderful day.
Guests: Michelle Van Slyke, VP of UPS Stores
Jennifer Kahweiller, Author
Air Date: April 25, 2013
Station Intro Welcome to Today's Inspiring Women, with your host Deanne DeMarco. On today's program, you will meet the next business and entrepreneurial rising star. You will learn from their successes, challenges and life lessons to find out what has made them recognized in their fields. Now here is your host Deanne DeMarco.
Deanne: Welcome to Today's Inspiring Women. I am your host Deanne DeMarco. If you are interested in becoming a sponsor for this show, give us a call at 708-836-0118. If you are ready to take the next steps to become empowered, motivated and better equipped for success, then stay tuned. My first guest today is Michelle Van Slyke, Vice President of Marketing and Small Business Solutions at the UPS Store. She is in charge of leading advertising, PR, communications and product development for over four thousand three hundred at the UPS Store locations. At the helm, she has led a brand repositioning to focus and developing products and services designed to meet the needs of small business owners. Michelle has spent her career in the world of advertising, either at the helm of the Chief Marketing Office or for such companies as Ford Motor Company, Jaguar, Mercedes Benz, Jacuzzi. So we are going to learn a lot from her today. Michelle welcome to Today's Inspiring Women.
Michelle: Oh, it is my pleasure to be with you.
Deanne: I am reading over your background. You have a lot that we can learn from you. Tell me, how did you get started down this path?
Michelle: I have been so fortunate. You know, you talk about mentors and I have had my share of mentors along the way. It certainly started at the University of Southern California. I had one professor from my Marketing 101 class as you could imagine, Professor _______ got me excited about marketing and I have been in it ever since.
Deanne: So that is how you started getting into marketing and advertising. How did you get into tthat first? I mean, you started out in the automobile industry, so how did you get started down that path?
Michelle: Yeah, it was great. I went to Notre Dame for graduate school and Ford Motor Company recruited out of obviously Notre Dame and really just a wonderful way to start a career. Ford is so customer focused, I actually started in the customer call center talking to customers. So, as a marketer it has been extremely valuable throughout my career to be a good listener with what the customers needs are, what their concerns are, what they love, so I started early in my career at Ford and learned a lot.
Deanne: Now the automobile industry is a really male dominated field right?
Michelle: Yeah it is. It is like anything else. So many industries are male dominated and you go in and you focus on doing your job really well. I always tried to make sure that I was contributing. I find so often, sometimes that women get into roles, or men for that matter, and they focus on getting things done but it necessarily doesn't impact your business. So, I always focused on how am I contributing to growing the business and the rest is really it from there, but I also had great mentors. In the automotive industry men can be great mentors.
Deanne: What were some of the challenges that you had to face and how did you overcome them?
Michelle: You know it is a lot of working with the teams, you know, bringing a product to market can be very complicated. So, you ended up working in teams and most of the teams were all male and you just tried to work with them, focus on what the problems and issues were, be crystal clear on what they were and then look to really solve those. You know, it is a balance between doing your job and sort of getting along with others, learning who they are and understanding what their issues are and seeking to overcome those.
Deanne: Wow. So was there anything as far as having to bolster your credibility in working with men or any issues like that, that you had to work through?
Michelle: You know, sometimes I felt like I needed to be the overachiever and do things either better, or do more of them. As a result, I would say early in my career, not always a good balance between work and life. I found that my work clearly dominated my life. So where I am today is more a balance. I think it should go on and be able to be successful. You are able to balance that out better.
Deanne: So it sounds like in the beginning there were some of those real balance issues with family.
Michelle: Oh, absolutely. Yeah. I got married for the first time, I keep joking, about 3 years ago, so I just completely focused on my career early on and felt that it was really necessary to be successful. In hind sight I would strongly encourage those that are early in their career, to do a better job of balancing the two. I am sure you could still be successful.
Deanne: Any suggestions in that arena?
Michelle: You really have to decide that you are going to do that. Certainly that is the place that I am in today. Once you decide that you can do both, you clearly can. You prioritize better, you focus on the key issues, and you just decide that you are going to do that and it turns out it is perfectly fine to do that versus always thinking that you have to be completely focused on only your career to be successful. You can do both.
Deanne: Good advice. So what has caused you to make the switch? You have been in the automobile arena for many years, 15 at least, 15 years right?
Michelle: Yeah. It was actually a little bit more than that and it was one of those things. I was at a crossroads in my career and decided that I am either going to stay in automotive for the duration or I am going to branch out. As a marketer I thought it was important to really balance it out. It turns out as I moved on to other industries, the skills and the discipline in marketing that I learned applies across industries. So, looking back it turns out I was a marketer who happened to be in the automotive industry. I love the fact that I have been able to stay in a franchise system. Automotive is a franchise system and I am in a franchise system right now with the UPS Store. As you mentioned, I lead marketing for over four thousand three hundred retail locations and they are all independently owned through our franchise system. So a lot of transferability and learning I got from the automotive industry that I can use today.
Deanne: So tell us a little bit about this current role of VP with Marketing at the UPS Store Franchises.
Michelle: Yeah. It is great. I lead all of the advertising, public relations, communications, product development and certainly the on-line space. We have an opportunity to really help grow the business for each of our retail locations, handle all of the communications and advertising across the nation, also work independently with the co-ops and co-op advertising groups that our franchise groups participate in, and do a lot to get feedback from them. Last week I was out at some network meetings talking to our franchisees and this past week our marketing advisory committee was in town and again, a lot of learning and insights from them which is a great way for us to really expand our business and grow.
Deanne: Wow. So, what are some of the learnings in your path that you have been taking that other women can learn from?
Michelle: Well you certainly want to stay disciplined. What I find a lot of time is that people will base decisions on personal opinion and really it doesn't work that way. Over the past 2 years for example, we have done a lot of research with small business owners. We have done focus groups. We have done ethnography research, which you know you basically follow a small business owner around a day in the life. We have done surveys. Small business owners have done journals for us so that we can understand how their daily lives are. So, I would say, work to be extremely fact based and really garner insight. For us to really be able to fill the needs of the small business owner, we need to understand what they are going through and what their pain points are and what their passions are. I have found a lot of time, people will just base their work on personal opinions and that is not the way that it works.
Deanne: Okay, so based upon your experience, maybe some of our listeners out there are sitting there going I would like to be a small business owner or be part of a franchise. How do they know if they are a good fit?
Michelle: You really have to dig into it and do some homework. Really look at what your skill base is, what you are good at, what your passion points are. We have found that there are really 2 types of small business owners, those who get into business in an area that they are really interested in. You know, someone loves flowers, they open up a flower shop. Then we find that there is another type of business owner who really is in the business to be in business. Have a good understanding of which one you are. We really have resources to help you with either one. If you are an independent business owner and you got passion points, we have some great resources on our website. We do blogs to provide insights in different areas. We have partners with some vendors to get you some discounts, and then on the other side if you are in the business to be in business, we offer franchises as well, which is an area where it is more disciplined where you get the benefit of being part of a network where tools are supplied for you, whether it is advertising or help with your accounting. So you really have to differentiate what type of small business owner you are.
Deanne: Time wise, I think that you probably have to evaluate how much time you really want to spend before you go down the path of being a small business owner as well, correct?
Michelle: Oh, absolutely. Growing up, my parents actually owned a business so I had the pleasure of being an employee in their business, and being a small business owner is really challenging. We have also learned that from our research. I have really the passion and compassion for small business owners. It really is a challenging place to be and that is why we work so hard and why I work so hard to support them in any way we can. Certainly the recent recession really changed the flavor of what it means to be a small business owner. We are finding that a lot of them want to do business locally in their community to support each other and I think that is one of the benefits of really our network and the fact that they are locally owned and operated.
Deanne: That is very interesting. I think people think they are going to quit their job and become an entrepreneur and I don't think people really spend the time to really think that through before you make that leap and it sounds like you definitely need to do that.
Michelle: Yeah, absolutely. You should be putting together a disciplined business plan just like any other business would do, and know that there are resources out there for you. There is organizations like SCORE that help with small business education and mentorship. We have got a link on our website to SCORE as well. They provide, really professional mentors, individuals who have been out in the business world and they will mentor you and help you from start to finish.
Deanne: Yeah. It sounds like you have a lot of resources on your website. We will have to get that after the break. We are coming up to a break here pretty soon. So we will make sure that we get that information out to everybody. So, what are you most passionate about in your current role?
Michelle: Well I love the fact that I am able to help small business owners. We have worked hard, like I mentioned, to assist them and then again on our website we have vendor offers that really you cannot get anywhere else. We have exclusive offers, for example, with DotComGuy. We learned that technology and IT is one of the biggest challenges for small business owners. For example, DotComGuy is offering 50% off of their services through our website. So, we partnered with organizations and businesses that really overcome some of the major pain points that small business owners have.
Deanne: Very interesting. We are going to take a short break here and then we are going to come back. This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women and we are talking to Michelle Van Slyke from the UPS Stores.
Deanne: This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women and we are talking to Michelle Van Slyke who is the Vice President of Marketing and Small Business Solutions for the UPS Stores. Michelle, just before break we were talking about the entrepreneur and I would like to dive a little bit deeper into this ring a little bit more. Let's talk about women and being an entrepreneurial ship for women. Is that a possibility and are there any challenges around that? What are your thoughts on that?
Michelle: Yeah, absolutely. This has been a major focal point for us over the last several years. We have actually been the sponsor of the Entrepreneur of the Year Award that ______ Magazine puts out. This is our 6th year participating in it, and it really is an opportunity for really 3 types of entrepreneurs to be recognized. There is an award for established business. There is an award for an emerging entrepreneur and also a college entrepreneur, which is really an exciting award that goes on. I would strongly encourage anyone who is budding and getting their business started to enter this contest. The contest entry runs through June of this year. The past winners, we have had 2 female winners these past years and I think it is really a recognition point for an entrepreneur. You get featured on the magazine, there is press involved with it, and there has been some very notable winners. I think everybody is familiar with Kind Bars right now. Their distribution has been quite large and they are a past winner, for example. I would strongly encourage anyone who is starting to get involved and enter so that they can get the recognition and really the exposure I think is a lot of what is needed today when you are getting started.
Deanne: So it is very interesting. So people can enter this if they are still in college?
Michelle: Yeah. There is one for a college entrepreneur. It is for an undergraduate or a graduate student and if they have a promising business plan, and it is really just an idea at this point, they can enter as well. Part of the contest is that they create a video on what their idea is, nothing more of a homegrown video and look, and they can enter as well. It is really great exposure and it is really a wonderful learning experience for a college student to get engaged.'
Deanne: That is very interesting. So it is not just to be an entrepreneur at the UPS Stores, but an entrepreneur period.
Michelle: That is right, yeah. The ideas run, oh gosh, they just run a gamete of ideas. Our past winner, the college winner, was fabulous. The young man had an idea about advertising on toilet paper, so they went through their research and they found a very specific ink and they found a supplier and they are in process right now of really trying to expand their distribution. My point is, it can be any idea and I will tell you what, this young man is very passionate about expanding the notion of advertising in toilet paper and his thought was, you know, you could put it in bars and restaurants and in your neighborhood and really get the word out. It is a lot of fun.
Deanne: And UPS sponsors this?
Michelle: We have, yes. Like I mentioned, this is our 6th year of sponsorship. In addition to sort of the entries and the exposure that you get in the online space, there is an award event every year. This past year it was in Dallas, and coming up it will be in New Orleans. We have about 800 people who attend. It is free to attend to anyone that wants to basically enroll and attend the event. Most of the people attending are budding small business owners as well. We have guest speakers and we have training sessions and there are classroom discussions and it is really just a wonderful way to pull together individuals who are either looking to start or expand their small business.
Deanne: Well that is, I am really impressed. That is just really wonderful. It is a true outreach, a business outreach way beyond the boundaries of UPS.
Michelle: It is. Every year when we hold the event the speakers are great. Barbara Corcoran was our speaker this past year and she is inspiring. She talks about how she started her business way back when in the real estate business, which is no easy task again for a female to start a real estate business in New York City. She went through all of her challenges and how she persevered and her creativity and her ideas and she was just truly an inspiration for all of the individuals in attendance. Like I said, this is free. We sponsor the entire event so anybody that would like to attend can basically attend the event. They just enroll and they show up. At the event, there are all kinds of sessions with experts in different areas to provide insight and some training again for budding entrepreneurs.
Deanne: I am just really impressed with that. I think that is really wonderful. So is there more men that are entrepreneurs than women?
Michelle: We certainly do find a predominance, at least at the attendance that we have. There definitely are a lot of men there, but you know what, you find women just getting engaged more and more. Like I said, our last 2 years we have had female winners. The winner from this past year, a woman who has a company called Adafruit Industries. She went to MIT and she has a business in Manhattan where she basically sells, I would call them small technology kits. They are kits that you can buy and do little experiments in the light in the area of technology. So again, a little bit of a really nice way for other young women to see someone who is engaged in the technology side and be very successful.
Deanne: Are there any tips that you would offer women who want to go down this path in particular?
Michelle: Yeah. You really have to get out and talk with people and learn. You can't do it at home. I love people. You know, everybody wants to stay home and be on their laptops and be on their tablets and the like. You really have to get out and talk to others. You can learn a ton about what has been successful, what hasn't been successful, tips and ideas that would help you to sort of get to where you want to be faster. I think that is the beauty of it. Whether it is the entrepreneur event, it is the beauty of you know, going on our website and reading our blogs. Even on our website with our blogs, if you have got an idea, because you are a more seasoned small business owner we are happy to have you as a guest blog. You can go on our website. It is smallbiz.theupsstore.com and you can also be a guest blogger on our site. So get that level of exposure, learn a lot, and also contribute to others.
Deanne: Could you just give us that website again?
Michelle: It is smallbiz.theupsstore.com.
Deanne: So smallbiz.theupsstore.com?
Michelle: Correct. There is a lot of information on there. Like I said, we have blog information on various topics. We have several exclusive partners that offer discounts. I mentioned DotComGuy already. We have partnerships with Chase Paymentech, with Easy Print, Web.com, Reception HQ, and we will have even more this year. They have exclusive offers through our website for small business owners. Again, these we understand are the major pain points of small business owners are experiencing. We wanted to make sure that as we are looking to be a comprehensive small business solution, this is a way for us to assist in that area. So I strongly encourage if you have needs in this area, to visit our website, as well as the blog information runs the gamete in terms of topics.
Deanne: That is really useful information. You know, as a small business owner I am always looking for assistance with everything from helping with my corporate taxes to helping me set up a new website to you name it, printing, and I did not know that the UPS Stores now offer printing solutions in some of the franchise stores.
Michelle: Oh, absolutely. You know our small business owners within our store environment can assist you with everything from your business cards, if you want to make a brochure, if you have a proposal. A lot of our stores do wide format printing. We can offer just a breath of services. I think one of the services that we offer that small business owners may not know about is, we do have mailboxes in our stores, and the beauty of having a mailbox at the UPS store, is you get a real street address. So a lot of small businesses operate out of their home and it is just not as professional to be using your home address. So when you have a mailbox at our store, you are actually using a store address, so it just come across as more professional. Also, it is more convenient when you get mail or packages. Our store will either text you, e-mail you or call you to let you know that it is there so you can...you don't have to be home to accept packages. So we can do that on your behalf.
Deanne: Excellent. So before we break away here, what is some tips that you would offer women who want to get into the marketing and advertising world? Any tips that you would have for them?
Michelle: Yeah, I would definitely say start with the basics. You really from a disciplined perspective, get some training. I talked about the Marketing 101 class that I attended. Understand the disciplines of marketing and then work to really start at the bottom. When I started I started by talking to customers and getting engaged with them, and I think that is the most important piece. The core at what you do in the marketing arena is really to build relationships and get a good understanding of individuals and really how you can help them with their needs and wants. Learning it as a discipline and understanding and different elements is key. You know, in today's environment the number of tools that you have to reach individuals are broad, certainly in the social media space, the online space, it is pretty broad-based. You have a lot of tools and avenues in order to reach and engage with individuals but understanding what you are doing, how you are going to fulfill their needs, how to build that relationship is really what you can do to start and to get a good foundation and exactly what that means.
Deanne: Wonderful. So you have told us a lot about the UPS Store and a lot of the services that you offer for the entrepreneur. Is there anything that is new that is coming up?
Michelle: You know, we are constantly working to improve our systems. Moving forward, we are going to have a lot of activity in our on-line space in the print arena and make it easier for individuals to engage with us. We have a partnership with HP right now, with HP e-print where you can download their app and you can send files to our stores through their system. We will certainly look to expand that part of our business. People are on the go and you need to do things as you are out traveling and working so we want to make that more convenient. We have done a lot to be more mobile friendly and we will continue to expand in that arena as well.
Deanne: Wow. Well we are, I can't believe that we are just right out of time. Tell us one more time the best way for people to find UPS information. Would that be on the website that you just gave us?
Michelle: It would. Yeah our main website is theupsstore.com and then there is a small business solutions section that they can dive into to learn more.
Deanne: Well Michelle thank you very much for being here today on Today's Inspiring Women. Wow. I can't believe how fast time has flown. You have just been a very engaging guest. Thank you very much.
Michelle: Oh it is my pleasure. Thank you very much.
Deanne: Well, we are going to be taking a short break. Michelle again, thank you very much for being on Today's Inspiring Women. Stay tuned. After the break we are going to be learning about the introverted leader in the power of quiet influence. This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women. We will be right back.
Deanne: Welcome back. This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women. We are going to be speaking with Dr. Jennifer Kahnweiler, who is going to be talking about the Introverted Leader and Quiet Influence. Jennifer is an international speaker and has worked with clients such as General Electric, AT&T, National Center for Disease Control, NASA, and she has published two very interesting books. The first one is called The Introverted Leader: Building on Your Quiet Strength, which is actually a fantastic book. I have actually read that book. That book has sold over 20,000 copies and has just finished a new book called Quiet Influence: The Introverts Guide to Making a Difference, and it shows how introverts can harness their innate tendencies to make a real difference. Jennifer, welcome to Today's Inspiring Women.
Jennifer: Oh, I am so pleased to be here Deanne. Thank you for having me.
Deanne: I am just so fascinated. One of the things that came to mind immediately when I started reading your book is that you started doing research around the introverted leader. What drew you to this study of studying introverts?
Jennifer: Well you know, it was a number of different things, Deanne. I started back in early 2000 and noticed that a lot of the technology companies that I was working in had a very large proportion of introverts, quieter folks, and I had been familiar with the Myers Briggs, also always attracted to quieter folks. I married one. So I started putting my observing hat on, I guess you would say my introvert hat on, and I noticed that often times introverts were overlooked, they were ignored, they were misunderstood, even passed over for promotions. So I became very intrigued with what could I do to help facilitate introverts getting more of a voice in organizations and that is what led to a really exciting journey as I wrote The Introverted Leader and now as you mentioned, the latest book Quiet Influence.
Deanne: I would like to learn more about your research in this area. First of all, how does a woman know she is an introvert?
Jennifer: Well you know, there is a lot of ways to figure that out. What I go by is the Carl Young, Myers, Briggs type of orientation. One of the things that is the main differentiator is where you get your energy from. Are you internally focused? Do you think before you talk, you process things, you are careful in responding and you are in your head quite a bit. Versus the extroverted person who is more stimulated and their energy comes from outside themselves, you know more people, places, things. Of course there is a scale which we all know. So some of us there is even the term ambivert right, if we are sort of in the middle, but we are usually parked on one side or the other. So those are a couple of the differentiators between the introvert and the extravert.
Many people who you think are not introverts really are. They have learned to adapt and I would certainly say women, since your show is about women, that is one thing that women have from an early age we have learned to be very sociable and friendly and so we put that smile on our face. It has been amazing to me how many women I have worked with in both coaching and in speaking and training where they really are truly introverts but they have learned to put that smile on and be out there and be conversational.
Deanne: Tell us a little bit more about this Quiet Influence. What is that?
Jennifer: Well you know it is interesting. The Introverted Leader came out in 2009 and as you mentioned I was very fortunate to have a real good response from people being intrigued by the notion of leadership and how we can lead from an introverted or quieter side and recognizing that, yes, introverts are leaders and leaders are introverts. The focus of the first book was really a lot about how do you develop those strengths but how do you sort of fit into the extroverted world, how do you ramp up some of your skills? Well as I was out there talking with people and in groups and discussing the book, and a lot of reactions I got, people also wanted to know how do they make a difference across an organization, not necessarily even in a corporate setting, you know, non-profit, hospitals, schools, librarians, people at all levels of an organization who would, you wouldn't say in the traditional sense are necessarily going on a leadership track, although one could argue they do have leadership qualities. They wanted to know how do I influence when I don't necessarily have the authority? So, Quiet Influence, had me on a journey of looking at well what do introverts do so effectively? So I boiled that down to 6 strengths that I found from interviews and research that I did.
Deanne: Could you share those 6 strengths?
Jennifer: I am happy to. Well the 6 key strengths, Deanne, that I found were the following. The first one was taking quiet time and I started in my Quiet Influence process, or the model that I sort of put together based on this. Taking quiet time introverts really crave that solitude. In fact, if they don't have it, they can really go a little crazy. They prioritize that. They take advantage or it by scheduling on a calendar and that gives them the energy and the source of their innovation and of their really well-crafted ideas. So taking quiet time is one of the key strengths. Then building on that, once the quiet time is taken, what they tend to do is really prepare. That is being very strategic, you know, about how they are going to anticipate objections, whether they are in sales or in project management, or whatever they are in. They also do the research and they prepare answers that really show that they are the person at the meeting who isn't necessarily winging it. That is typically your introvert because they prepare it. Am I right? Have you noticed that?
Deanne: Sure.
Jennifer: By the way, managers who know that will give and teammates will give introverts the time they need not to throw things at them at the last minute. So the second thing was carefully preparing. I found that to be constant. The third strength was engaged listening or being really attentive and taking in information. It allows the introverts when they are trying to influence others, to really be a person, to go to person, the person who folks share things with, to establish report and gain mutual understanding. It really was amazing to me how often times I would find that the introverted or kind influencers were not the loudest in the room of course, but you know they certainly often times had the most impact. You know, who said the loudest idea is the best idea right?
Deanne: Yeah.
Jennifer: We know we have all see that. You and I have worked together in some settings and we certainly know that is true right?
Deanne: Right.
Jennifer: Then the fourth one after taking quiet time and preparation, they build on that with engaged listening. Then what I noticed is they go out into the world and share their well-crafted ideas and the self assessment they have done and they engage in some really purpose driven, one on one conversations. By the way, introverts do prefer that. It is not necessarily the large group discussions and the active talkative brainstorming that we are used to but it is the one on one small, really engaged thoughtful conversations that happen.
Deanne: Yeah right and they have a lot of strength there because I think they engage better one on one.
Jennifer: Absolutely. You and I, we both taught and we still do some seminars and I notice that you have probably seen the same thing, that you know, you can ask a group of introverts a question and there is like basically dead silence right? Then you might ask another one. Still dead silence. But then you say okay well talk to a few people about it or talk to one other person and the energy in the room just rises substantially doesn't it?
Deanne: Yeah, very much so.
Jennifer: So that is just a little tip if you are running a group like that, certainly to do that, but focusing the conversation is clearly what they do very well, particularly the quiet influencers who I interviewed and I saw making a huge difference in different settings that they work in. Then writing, the fifth one, is writing. Writing it down. Introverts really think through. We all do well when we set back and we are not even sure. We have got a lot in our head but we get pen to paper and all of a sudden those thoughts come out. There is one technique that I latched onto when I was writing the book called Free Writing that I learned from some of my quieter colleagues and that is you basically sit down for 10 minutes, you set the timer and you just keep writing on a topic and from all of that you write, usually an idea or two will bubble up and then you can go with that. So writing is so essential, not only for us just to clarify where we are at, but also to persuade others. So I always laugh because I can tell if people are introverted sometimes if I get a longer e-mail from them rather than the blip blip blip.
Deanne: Oh, sure.
Jennifer: Right? You say okay well that person might be....that is always a good clue because they clarify things very well. Then the sixth area is purposely using social media. This is one that I get a lot of push back from, from the quiet or the introverts that I work with, like I don't want to do anything. They turn their back on social media and that is really not what we need to be doing now. Social media is here to stay. In fact, it is a wonderful tool to develop report and understand what is going on on landscape in a certain field if you are trying to influence your manager or your clients or your customers. It is all about understanding and a lot of that you do through social media, but the key thing that I saw that introverts do very well is they think about what is the platform? What is my purpose? How and I going to use this more strategically than just be randomly posting on Facebook every time it pops up on my smart phone?
Deanne: It sounds the way you are talking about the 6 strengths of the introvert, you know, I am an extrovert, and I am sitting her going, man I think I would really benefit if I used some of these strengths.
Jennifer: Absolutely. That is what is so exciting about all of this. We have this Deanne, within both of them. Both of these sets of personality traits, you know, the good things about extroverts, there is certainly a lot. We also benefit when we tap into that, that other side of ourselves. I found in writing the book I had to constantly rely on these strengths and it made me I think, a better person for it, you know, taking quiet time. As you know you don't get writing done if you are constantly talking. The fun part for me was the interviews but then I had to really have the discipline to block off days and weeks at a time to do writing and to work with editors and to put pen to paper. So that is something where I tapped into my quiet introverted side and I took my quiet times to figure out the creative approach that I was going to use, and not struggling with how to position something in the book. So absolutely. So which one are you going to try? Which one appeals to you right now?
Deanne: Well I will tell you, this whole concept of focused conversations just lit up a big light in my head because my husband is an introvert and I am sitting there going he has these very in depth focused conversations with folks.
Jennifer: Yes.
Deanne: And more so, than I do. Then you mentioned it and I am going that is something that I really need to pay attention to.
Jennifer: And it might help if you do that with him right? I find with my husband, Bill, I have got to make sure that we make appointments to have these conversations. If we didn't do that I would be standing there running and looking at my watch saying okay get on with it and that is part of the problem with us who are the more extroverted folks just to slow down and smell the roses a little bit. Take that pause because it is very irritating to introverts when we are constantly interrupting them, onto the next thing, finishing their sentences, which we know we are unfortunately guilty of.
Deanne: Well talk about taking a pause, we have got to take a pause. We are going to take a short break. Stay tuned. We will be right back to Today's Inspiring Women.
Deanne: Welcome back. This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women. We are speaking with Jennifer Kahnweiler who is talking about quiet influence and the introverted leader. Jennifer just before break we were talking about the strengths of the introverted leader or the introvert. What are some of the challenges or challenges for women if they are introverts?
Jennifer: Oh, thank you for that question. Women I always feel a little sense of, I don't know if the word is sadness, but real empathy when I come across women in organizations who say to me they just feel that they have the double whammy. They are an introvert but they also are in a male dominated environment where they just can't get their voice heard. So a couple of the challenges they have and the I would like to suggest some solutions to that.
Deanne: That would be wonderful.
Jennifer: Yeah sure. One of them is lack of visibility. The numbers certainly as I mentioned are not in their favor. Women are just, as Sheryl Sandberg wrote in her book and took statistics you know there are only fourteen percent of executive officers and only twenty one of the fortune 500 CEO's are women. So when women introverts look around, you know, they are in the sea of male colleagues. They don't really see a lot of role models. So it is really essential even more so for women that they get these mentors and women who can sponsor them and advocate, not just women but also men who can tell them how to navigate their careers and be supportive. So lack of visibility is a real challenge for women. There is also this discomfort that introverted women have with the schmoozing and the networking which I totally understand, but if we go back to what I had mentioned earlier about having these one on one focused conversations, the purposefully using social media, you can play to your strengths as an introverted quiet woman and use those tools to start establishing one on one relationships.
I will give you an example. There is a woman who ran a program I was in yesterday. She is extremely introverted. She is very competent in what she does. She reached out to me several times and we had some one on one conversations and I was so impressed with the depth of her commitment to learning about this particular topic because she showed initiative and she told me how shy and introverted she is. She really did demonstrate ______ I would say in that arena because she was driven by her need to have more visibility and to learn more. Another one is negative impressions. Introverted women, people have bias against introverts in general. I wrote a lot about that in the last book in Introverted Leader that there is something called the perception gap, you know, what we put out there isn't what people are seeing a lot of the time. With women, as I mentioned earlier, we are supposed to be all friendly and smiley and women get.....what do you think people say about women who are quieter? What do you think that adjective is that they use?
Deanne: That they are a mouse or.....
Jennifer: No I haven't heard that one yet, but that could very well be said. Right and also that they are stuck up.
Deanne: Oh, that would be another one.
Jennifer: Yeah and also other women will say that about that. You know, what is wrong with them? There is a lot of suspicion when somebody doesn't show a lot on their face and what is called facial gymnastics as we describe it. They are not expressing everything that they are thinking and feeling, so what people do is they paint these negative perceptions on them. So the way around that is to again build on those one on one relationships, but also to just adapt in very small ways. I had a client who said that she just walked in everyday to her office and kind of made a bee line, so we discussed the advantage of smiling at one or two people or making eye contact. She said that just those two small things, she didn't have to smile all the time, but she made a few eye contact connections. She said that made a huge difference. People started responding to her different. She said that was the only thing that she changed. So you know, some of these things are just not huge.
I would say the third thing that women deal with is, because of that isolation they just don't have other women to talk to and so I think it is really important. Like Sheryl Sandburg said in there, we have to start talking about this, we have to reach out to each other, you know, in her book. I totally agree with that. I think these organizations that are more structured like the society of women engineers for instance, where they really put a lot of focus on structured mentoring and networking circles, the women's forums that you and I have spoken in numerous times in organizations, right, those used to be just sort of fly by night, but now the leadership, senior leadership luckily and fortunately are starting to pay more attention and even give them a little bit of a budget and let them not have to meet after hours and let them meet during the work day. The little things like that from an organizational perspective are helping women.
Deanne: Sure. Right.
Jennifer: But, it is still a big challenge for women who are quieter, but I think if they take some of those steps then, it really does make it a little easier to be seen and to be heard and to contribute and again, not to change who they are. That is a really important message, not to change your personality, but just to expand the repertoire.
Deanne: Who has been some really successful women introverts?
Jennifer: There have been a number of them. I mean, within political arenas, women like certainly Hilary Clinton is one that I think of or Condoleezza Rice. There have been women in technology. There is a women named Waley Dye who is an incredibly successful billionaire in the Silicone Valley. Andrea Young who is on the board of a number of organizations who is CEO of Avon, until recently. So, you know, there is a long list, in every field. We are just now becoming even more aware of women introverted leaders and they are stepping up more. I had a woman who is president of one of our technical universities, Lisa Rossbacher, and she is an introverted geologist by training, PhD, and she is speaking out now in her blog to encourage women in the stem fields, you know the science technology engineering and math, to really come out and she claims herself. I wrote about her in the book as well. She uses her blog as a platform to influence other women and young girls and it gives them a lot of stories about what it is like. It is really interesting.
Deanne: How do people get a hold of you?
Jennifer: Oh, well that is pretty easy. I guess it is pretty easy if you know how to spell my name. That is always the challenge right? It is Jenniferkahnweiler.com. I do a lot on Twitter, so people should follow me because I post on there a lot of different information. That is Jennifer kahnweiler, and we have a wonderful quick survey that people can do. They don't even need to sign up for it. Just go onto my website, Jenniferkahnweiler.com to determine if they are a quiet influencer or an expressive influencer and then get some resources on how to address those. So the book is Quiet Influence and we just re-released by the way the new, The Introverted Leader. We did a re-issue of it, Deanne, with a wonderful forward by Doug Conan, who is the CEO, former CEO of Campbell's Soup Company.
Deanne: Wow. We need to close. Jennifer, thank you very much for being on Today's Inspiring Women. Time has just flown here.
Jennifer: You have inspired me. Thank you Deanne.
Deanne: Well thank you. Our premiere sponsor is Breaking Boundaries International. Breaking Boundaries provides personalized coaching, and services for business professionals and organizations. Breaking Boundaries International won national recognition from Training Magazines Top 100 for the manager, coaching, clinic program. Those services provide executive and personal coaching, corporate training for managers and they can be reached at www.breaking-boundaries.com, or at 866-91COACH.
Today I want to wrap up with a quote from Ellen Degeneres. She says, “When I was younger, I thought success was something different. I thought when I grow up I want to be famous. I want to be a star. I want to be in movies. When I grow up I want to see the world, drive nice cars. I want to have groupies. But, my ideas of success have changed for today. For me, the most important thing in life is to live your life with integrity and not give in, into some peer pressure to try to be something that you are not, to live your life as an honest compassionate person, to contribute in some way.” So you have been listening to Today's Inspiring Women. I am your host Deanne DeMarco and each week we try to address relevant topics for women to spark your career and life. Thank you for turning in today. I am your host Deanne DeMarco. Have a wonderful day.
Jennifer Simonetti- Bryan: Master of Wine
Stephanie Skaggs
Master of Wine and How to Finance your Small Business without going to the bank!
Host: Deanne DeMarco
Guests: Jennifer Simonetti-Bryan - Master of Wine
Stephanie Skaggs – Small Business Expert
Air Date: 5/9/13
Deanne: Welcome to Today’s Inspiring Women. I’m your host Deanne DeMarco. If you are interested in becoming a sponsor for this show, give us at 708-836-0118. That’s 708-836-0118. We have sponsorship packages that will fit all budgets.
If you are ready to take the next steps to becoming empowered, motivated and better equipped for success, then stay tuned. My first guest today is Jennifer Simonetti-Bryan, who is a master of wine. Jennifer is fast rising as one of the go-to experts on wine. She holds the world’s top title, Master of Wine, has trained thousands in the industry and judges in international wine and spirits competitions.
Jennifer is the fourth woman among only 30 people in the United States to ever attain the international title of Master of Wine, which is the highest wine title to achieve in the world. She was also honored with an international tasting trophy for her palate and hosts an additional five leading wine and spirits certifications. Jennifer, welcome to Today’s Inspiring Women.
Jennifer: Thank you very much for having me. I’m very excited.
Deanne: First, what is a Master of Wine?
Jennifer: A Master of Wine is an international title. It’s funny. My family thought it was like going for a business degree except in wine. It’s not. It’s not a degree. It’s a title. It’s kind of like the Olympics of wine. It’s a 4-day exam, which is administered by the Institute of Masters of Wine in the UK. It started in 1955. Since 1955, there are only 300 of us around the entire globe. I mean, some of us are dying out now, so I think there are less than 300 now. But there are only 300 of us in the world.
The exam includes four days of grueling essays on topics of winemaking, viticulture, the global business aspects, as well as philosophical issues and political issues. We are also tested on our palates. So we have to identify 36 wines. They gave you the glass, and they’d say, “Tell us what grape varieties are in it. Tell us how it was made. Tell us the vintage. Tell us the price and the quality of this wine.” Just by tasting it. No other information.
Deanne: Just by tasting it? No other information?
Jennifer: Right. So it was one of the greatest undertakings. Fortune magazine had done a feature on me, and I remember them asking me how many wines I’d tasted. I had to do the calculations. From the time I began wine to the time that I obtained the Master of Wine and studied for it, I probably tasted about 10,000 wines.
And I guess if you do anything 10,000 times, I guess you’re an
expert at something.
Deanne: That’s incredible. I think my tongue would go numb. I think what’s really interesting is that you came from a financial background, six-figure salary, and you left career number one, which was a very successful career, to go to career number two, which is your passion of wine. Tell us a little bit about that.
Jennifer: I used to work for Citicorp in London. I was in investment banking. This is much more fun. But when I was working there, I was a management associate at the time, and I was in what you would call “job jail.” There’s only so many times you can wake up in the morning and say, Can I call in sick again?”
Deanne: Wow.
Jennifer: I loved the intellectual stimulation of the job. And, let’s be honest, I loved the money. But I didn’t actually like the job itself and the hours were so horrendous. I was working well over 100 hours a week, so I had literally no time at all. When you do something over 100 hours per week that you don’t enjoy, you really start to wonder what you’re doing.
It was actually a business lunch that completely changed my life. This was in London in the executive dining room facilities for Citicorp. We were doing a presentation for a client. It was Bridgestone Corporation I remember. We were doing an Optimal Capital Structuring presentation. And I don’t know whether it was sleep deprivation or whatever, but we were just so exciting to be leaving the office even if it was to go to the executive dining room.
During the presentation, we were served lunch. Because we were in the UK, they served wine. In New York, you generally don’t see that a lot. You ask for iced tea or diet coke. But we had an herb crusted salmon and a Savennieres. Do you know what a Savenneires is?
Deanne: No clue.
Jennifer: Savenneires is a white wine from the Loire Valley in France made with Simone Blanc. I know this is foreign, and I had no idea back then. I didn’t know anything about wine at all. It wasn’t that the wine was so amazing. It was just the combination of these two things together totally blew me away.
I mean I know this now. Salmon is a very fatty fish, and it coats your tongue in kind of an oil. It’s kind of a rich, oily fish. And when you taste the Sauvignon Blanc, the Savenneires, the high acid from this wine cuts through the fat and creates this cleansing sensation.
It was so refreshing. It made you feel like you were eating healthier. It was a wonderful experience and with the complimenting of flavors, I thought, wow. The chef in the back didn’t just throw this together. It was a conscious decision to put these two things together.
So I thought, you know what? For one hour a week, I owe it to myself to go pursue something new. That was kind of the epiphany that I had. Actually a week later I was working really, really late and someone said to me, Jennifer, don’t worry. In about ten years, you’ll have paid your dues. And I started thinking, Good Lord, I cannot spend the next ten years doing this.
So it was kind of a catalyst to pursue something new. And that’s what really started me on my wine journey. I just had this epiphany. So I thought, let me take some classes. But I didn’t jump to the new career right away. Just because you have something that may be a hobby doesn’t necessarily mean that you want to change careers. But it was a great catalyst.
Deanne: Let’s take that a little bit further. So how did you make that transition from the corporate into the wine world? You said you took some classes, but there are huge risks there.
Jennifer: Yea. There are enormous risks. I think when you’re starting to think about a new career, what I realize now. Back then, I didn’t know what I was doing, but what I realize now is that I created a platform. What I mean by a platform is that you have to create the platform from where you can jump where you want to go. In order to do that, you need the knowledge. So going to for classes and things of that sort. You need to find out more information.
After that, you need to network. So create a networking platform. I did a lot of informational interviews. This was way before Facebook, way before all the Linked In and all the things we have today that are so beneficial and useful for all the listeners out there, but I didn’t have any of that.
So I just picked up the phone and called people. I said, you know, I’m thinking about going into this industry. Would you give me five minutes to tell me about your experience? I found that most people were willing to give you at least five to ten minutes of their time if they found that you had a lot of enthusiasm for their field or their job.
So not only classes and networking, but I also needed to create a financial platform on which to jump. So creating that little nest egg. You have to think about those things before you leap. Otherwise, you can be going downstream without a paddle.
So I had to create that little nest egg because I figured, I’m kind of behind. I was going down a path of finance and knew nothing about wine. So I needed to ramp up in knowledge, which meant taking more classes. I was probably going to go way below where my salary was because I was making six figures in banking. And in the Windows on the World Wine School, I had been told no one makes money in the wine industry. So he actually tried to dissuade me from going into the wine industry.
Deanne: Really?
Jennifer: Yea. Because he said, you’ll never make the money that you’re making. The running joke in the wine industry is, “How do you make a small fortune in the wine industry? You start with a large fortune.” People end up losing money. People do it for passion. They do it for the love of wine. They don’t do it for money. But I ignored him, and I ended up looking in the New York Times, and I found a job at a wine store called The Burgundy Wine Company in New York.
I left banking to go work at this wine store. My family thought I had lost my mind. The job that I had was the person who was showing that Savenneires to the executive dining room facility. So I thought this was the best job on the planet.
Deanne: Sure.
Jennifer: Kevin as he was talking to me, he ended up becoming a big mentor. So it’s always good to find and latch on to anyone who is willing to give you advice. When I called to tell him that I got this new job in the industry, he said, Jennifer, you’re going to call me in six months and say you want to get out of there. I told him,
you’re wrong. I’m going to love it.
Well, it took 10 months, not six months. And so Kevin said, Okay, let me introduce you to a few people. Just interview with them. Don’t bring your resume. Just ask them questions. From there, the person who interviewed me was a wine reporter from Cobrand Corporation. Within 30 minutes of talking with her, even though I didn’t even bring my resume, I was hired.
When I went into that interview, I was scared to death because I had less than a year experience in the wine industry. So I thought I have to build parallels to things I had done in banking to whatever I could think of with this new job. So for example, for large banking meetings, I would organize hundreds of banks together for particular deal. The person who interviewed me saw that as an opportunity for their management. There was a parallel there.
So even if you don’t have a direct connection in the industry, you can draw parallels for someone to say, Oh wow, you don’t have those skills. I can still use you even though you don’t have years of experience in the industry itself.
Deanne: It sounds like they were using transferable skills.
Jennifer: Yes. And identifying what those transferable skills were. That’s important to know.
Deanne: For our audience who may be interested in maybe switching careers, maybe looking at what skills they have that they can transfer over to a new career they may be looking at. Is that what I’m hearing you say?
Jennifer: Exactly. And I also realized in the wine industry, there weren’t that many people with credentials. There weren’t that many credentialing schools or organizations. But whatever there was, I found them and told myself I’d get at least a basic credential. I found that after two years, I had more than most people in the industry had.
So taking those classes, not only for the knowledge, but also to be able to enroll in them and show them on your resume. That shows that you have initiative and that you’re working toward building your knowledge in the industry. It can help tremendously.
Deanne: Interesting. I’ve heard five things from you already as far as going into a new career. One, start out with a networking platform. You’ve got to mentor. Get those transferable skills that you can use in a second career. Get educated. I’m hearing you say over and over again that you’ve got to get the education for the direction you want to go. Also to investigate those 5-minute interviews with people just to find out more about the career you’re thinking of going into.
Jennifer: Yea. That’s right.
Deanne: I’m also hearing you say to not be afraid to move forward.
Jennifer: Well, there is fear all along the way. You’ve got to kind of feel the fear and do it anyway. One of the things that helped me tremendously was that when I entered the Masters of Wine program and I was studying for it, I had interviewed another candidate as well. So when I was interviewing her, in an offhand way, I say, I don’t know if I’ll ever do it. And she looked me and said, don’t you ever say that. I never want to hear you say that again. You need a vision.
She was a woman who had always been so kind and gentle with me. And the power of emotion behind what she was saying struck me and got my attention. She said, you need vision. You need to see yourself as a Master of Wine. You need to see yourself in that position. You’ve got to be aggressive with it. I don’t care if you write your name down with the letters MW after it every day until you get it, but you need to see yourself in that fashion.
I guess that is part of the faith of moving forward. You have to have that faith in order to combat the fear that will always be there. There was a period of time that I thought, what am I doing? I went to a third of my salary the first two years, so of course you’re scared. But having that vision and that constant reminder of why you’re doing it needs to be in the forefront.
Whether you create a vision board or you write your name with the credentials after it. Something. It has to be visually stimulating.
Deanne: Those are all good tips. We’re going to take a short break here. Stay tuned. We’ll be right back on Today’s Inspiring Women.
Welcome back. This is Deanne Demarco with Today’s Inspiring Women. We are talking today with Jennifer Simonetti-Bryan, who is a Master of Wine. In this segment, she is going to be telling us a little bit more about what women can do in following their passion.
Jennifer, welcome back. We’ve learned from you so far some really great advice about coming up with a networking plan, finding a mentor, identifying your transferable skills, investigating this new career and also to definitely get educated. You wrapped up the last section with a strong vision and really see yourself as whatever it is you want to be doing and to be aggressive in that belief.
Jennifer: Yes. You need to have that confidence because there are going to be times when it’s hard. They tell you it takes five no’s to get to your yes. A lot of people feel so rejected after that first “no” that they may give up.
Deanne: You went from a six figure income in the banking industry. It sounds like you’ve been able to make it now following your passion.
Jennifer: Absolutely. It took a while. It probably took the better part of a decade, but now I’m making more money than I ever did when I was in banking. I never look back because now I’m happy. And it was worth those ten years.
Deanne: I think that is important for people to hear. That you can see those returns, but you have to be willing to put the time in to make it happen.
Jennifer: Right. I told myself in the beginning I would rather be really uncomfortable. I told myself that I was going to be really uncomfortable for probably about five years. But it was a time investment I was willing to make because now I’m happier than ever. And actually it’s a common practice in marketing and certain companies. In the wine world, everybody knows the champagne houses are Creteil.
That’s exactly what they did. Back in the 1990s, nobody knew who they were. And they said, you know, for five years we are going to be in the red, but we are going to advertise and we are going to do a whole marketing plan. But they knew they were going to be in the red for five years. Now they are the most popular champagne house in the world.
It’s similar to the concept of total quality management. If you pay attention to the quality of the product, which is you, and the quality of your life and what you want, eventually the money will come.
But many people say, I don’t know what I want to do. I know I’m miserable, but I don’t know what I want to do. To them, I would say that I believe in the law of attraction. If you’re interested in something, go seek it out.
Chances are the gravitational pull of that interest planet that is going to pull you even more to the point where you say, you know what? This is what I want to do. Sometimes it doesn’t happen that way, but we look around to see which interest planet is going to suck you in. But you can’t know until you start moving towards it.
Deanne: That’s really good information. I want to go back to your Master of Wine. Do women need to know about wine in business?
Jennifer: I think they really do. I mean, 75 percent of the wine purchased is by women. Yet, when you go to business centers or if you’re conducting business with clients at a steakhouse, that wine list acts like a hot potato between people. Nobody wants to choose the wine. They’re all terrified. So it’s a huge opportunity for women to take that list, take charge and be impressive.
Wine is a very non-intrusive topic for women to talk about. You can talk about wine in a very casual manner. It’s not going to cause tremendous amounts of controversy. And you can make yourself look impressive. So I think women should definitely know about wine, not only from a personal perspective, but from a business perspective as well.
Deanne: That’s really great information. That wine list comes and nobody wants to pay attention to it because nobody knows one wine from another, let alone what everybody is eating. I thought it was interesting when at the very start of our show today, you talked about how you were drawn when you were in England with having a salmon lunch with a wine pairing. And how that wine complemented what you were eating, which made that whole eating experience enjoyable.
Jennifer: Oh yes. If you create that experience, people remember you.
Deanne: To me, that was my little “aha” moment. I think that’s really interesting. Now you have a couple of books out. One is “Pairing with the Masters: A Definitive Guide to Food and Wine.” The other one is “The other is “The One-Minute Wine Master: Discover Ten Wines You Like In 60 Seconds or Less.” Would one of those books help people like me in trying to find a wine quickly?
Jennifer: Absolutely. “The One-Minute Wine Master” is for you. Everyone has done a Cosmo quiz, right? Well, this is kind of done in a similar way. There eleven questions. After the eleven questions, you get placed into a seasonal category for your palate. So are you a winter? Are you a fall? Or are you a summer or spring?
So in the winter, you’d want full-bodied, rich red wines and old red wines. So it kind of sounds like what your palate would describe. You don’t need any knowledge about wine to answer the questions. So one of the questions is, “How do you take your coffee in the morning?” Anybody could answer that. You could even answer that you don’t take coffee in the morning.
The questions have seemingly nothing to do with wine, but it tells me a lot about your palate. So in less than a minute you can find recommendations for ten wines that you’ll probably like.
Deanne: How about when you are having a guest? Where can I go to get help in trying to figure out the correct wine pairing with what I’m serving?
Jennifer: The book that I created with a master chef called “Pairing with the Masters” is actually a culinary textbook for CIA and Cordon Bleu, so I think for beginners, that’s probably not going to be the first place to go. There is a great book called “What to Drink with What You Eat.” That is a really book. It is kind of a list of wines under particular food categories, so that might be a good place to start.
Deanne: That is really good information. What’s next for you?
Jennifer: I’m doing some more books. I’m going to be doing some more DVD series for The Great Courses, which used to be called The Teaching Company. We did four series on wine and one on spirits and cocktails. So we’ll be working on more DVDs there, and I’m a senior partner in a firm that is going to be launching soon that I am very excited about. I can’t tell you more than that now, but I’m really excited. It’s something you’ll be hearing a lot about in the future.
Deanne: How can people get in touch with you or follow you to find out what is in store? What is the best way?
Jennifer: Well, anyone can find me on Linked In, which is great because we’re talking networking and connecting. So you can find me on Linked In. You can also find me on by web site, Jennifersimonetti.com. I’m on Twitter as well. You may laugh at my Twitter handle: Jedi Wine Master.
Deanne: That’s cute. So when you are ready to launch your new business, it will show up on Twitter?
Jennifer: That’s right. And on Linked in.
Deanne: The time has just been flowing. It’s been really exciting talking to you. We’re going to be taking another short break. I’d like to thank Jennifer Simonetti-Bryan, our wine master, for being on Today’s Inspiring Women. Thank you very much, Jennifer.
Jennifer: Thank you very much the opportunity. There are so many women out there who need inspiration. I’m happy to help.
Deanne: I don’t know about anybody else, but I’m going to go get that book, “The One-Minute Wine Master.” I’m assuming that is on Amazon.
Jennifer: That’s right. It’s everywhere.
Deanne: Stay tuned. After the break, we’ll be talking about how to finance
your entrepreneurial venture.
Second Guest:
Deanne: Welcome back. This is Deanne DeMarco with Today’s Inspiring Women. Right now we have Stephanie Skaggs on the line. Stephanie is an entrepreneur, business owner and financing specialist. She has started eleven companies or has partnered with other people over the last 16 years.
She is the president of Asset Financing Group and specializes in small business financing and commercial mortgages. Her expertise includes all things financial, both personal and professional. She has helped over 150 business owners and entrepreneurs get financing. Welcome Stephanie.
Stephanie: Good morning. How are you?
Deanne: I’m going wonderful. Thank you. I think your expertise is something many of our listeners need to hear about. That is how do you go about financing? I’ve been hearing that small business loans are really hard to get these days. Is that correct?
Stephanie: It is still correct. What’s going on is kind of a double-edged sword. Banks do have a lot of money right now, but they’re tight to let it loose, so to speak. There’s two things going on. The regulators are saying that you have to loan only to good people, but a lot of business owners are having trouble showing that they have the business strength to get a business loan.
So it’s difficult to just walk down to the local bank and say, I need a business loan. Can you loan money? There are other opportunities out there besides business loans, and that’s what my business focuses on.
Deanne: Outside of going on “Shark Tank” to try and get a loan [laughter], what are some of the things entrepreneurs can do to try to get financing?
Stephanie: I think there are a few things that people who are entrepreneurs need to do before they even seek financing. Really, they need to evaluate what their market is. Because unfortunately what I see a lot of is an entrepreneur who maybe has a great idea, but they’Ve forgotten to ask whether there is a market for whatever product or service they have.
Sometimes that question is answered differently depending on the way you ask it. So, is my product or service really needed in the market? That may get a different answer than asking is this a product I want to sell? That does make sense?
Deanne: Sure.
Stephanie: So really understanding what your market is, whether you have a potential to really have your product or service as a scalable type of venture. Because that would dictate what kind of financing you need. Is it something you need all at once? Or is it something you could maybe get incrementally over time? That’s really going to dictate the type of financing you seek.
The other thing is what is the situation you’re going into in terms of do you need debt? Or do you need equity? There’s really a difference between those two types of financing in terms of the sources that somebody would seek. So that is the other question someone needs to ask if they’re starting an entrepreneurial venture.
So there are a number of questions an entrepreneur needs to ask before they even seek financing. Those are just a couple of them to get people thinking.
Deanne: What are those four steps that a person should be taking before they even think about filling out a loan application?
Stephanie: I think the best thing is to do again is to really look at your situation specifically. So step #1 would be to take a personal inventory, and that would be to prepare a personal financial statement. That is really a breakdown of what your assets are, what your liabilities are and the potential income sources that you have. So the first step is to take a personal inventory.
The second step would be to know what your scores are before you even seek financing. Your scores are your credit scores, what your net worth is, what your debt to income ratios are. So know your numbers before you seek financing because that will determine the kind of financing you can than seek.
The next step is to have a business plan, so even if you’re lender or your financing source doesn’t require a business plan, you should always have a business plan. And a business plan is not a document that has to be a huge, multi-page document, but it does have to be something you’ve thought about it really understand what your break-even point is. How much money should you be generating through your business just to break even?
The next step would be to identify the correct sources of financing. Those really are dependent on what your credit is, which is why step #2 is to know what your credit scores are. Also what kind of collateral? That’s step #1, identifying what your assets are. So those are really the four steps somebody needs to take before they even fill out an application.
Deanne: I can see how that would really be helpful. Also with your product, you might have a product that you think, you know, the world really needs this. However, the world may not know they need this.
Stephanie: Yea. That certainly has to do with how you go about marketing your project and, in some cases, it’s educating the marketplace that they need this product. So that certainly is part of your marketing scheme. And that is really part of your business plan.
Deanne: When the I-Pad first came out, I remember thinking, why do I need this?
Stephanie: Yes. Now you can’t live without it, right?
Deanne: I can’t live without it, but when it first came out, I thought, okay, you say I need this product, but I don’t understand it. I was just thinking that’s true for other companies and other entrepreneurs as well. They may have a product that they think the world really needs, but I just need to educate the world or my customers that they really do need it. So that’s part of that whole business plan.
Stephanie: Exactly. That’s exactly right.
Deanne: And being really truthful.
Stephanie: Yea. You’ve got to come up with your idea, but you also need to think about how you’re going to market it and how you’re going to educate the market about it.
Deanne: Excellent. Are there some financial strategies that are more tailored to women?
Stephanie: It’s interesting because women have been starting businesses like crazy over recent years. Some statistics show they are actually starting businesses at a higher rate than men are. And despite that statistic, women-owned businesses are still categorized as minority-owned businesses. So if there are special programs tailored toward minority-owned businesses, a lot of times women can qualify or get special treatment for those kinds of businesses.
A couple places where if you’re a women-owned business, you can check. There are certain economic development programs in local areas that tailor programs specifically for women-owned businesses. And the Small Business Administration actually has an on-line directory that people can go to and check for economic development programs in specific areas. So there are local or regional area, like certain states, have them. The Small Business Administration web site does have an on-line directory for those.
Similarly, there are certain grant programs that are tailored specifically to women or minority businesses. Again, the Small Business Administration web site does have a directory of grant programs. One thing I want to caution people about when they’re talking about grants. Perhaps you’ve even gotten these e-mails where they say for $100, you can buy a directory for all the grants that are out there.
I wouldn’t pay for that myself. There are sources, such as on the Small Business Administration web site, where you can get that information for free. So don’t flush that $100 down the toilet by buying those kinds of directories. That is available for free.
Deanne: Now with grants, you don’t have to pay that money back?
Stephanie: That is correct. So that is basically something that you don’t have to pay back. It’s something that is awarded specifically for a project. They are somewhat difficult to get and they’re usually very tailor-made for a specific industry or area of concern. So look around. And some private companies offer grants as well. Sometimes the criteria for getting the grant is you have to be a minority or a women-owned business.
Deanne: What are a couple of sources where entrepreneurs can go to get funding?
Stephanie: There are some really interesting sources that over the last five to seven years have really blossomed because of the Internet age. One of them is what we call peer-to-peer lending. Even though banks aren’t out lending money, there is still a lot of money out there that would like to be put to work. And peer-to-peering lending, and there are web sites you can go to on the Internet, where they match individuals who have money with entrepreneurs who are seeking money.
This is done on a loan basis. Lendingclub.com is one. Prosper.com is another one where you can basically post your project or your loan request. Then either an individual or someone who is knowledgable in the industry who has money would agree to then fund that project on a loan basis. So that’s peer-to-peer funding.
Another one that is similar is called Crowd Funding. Perhaps you’ve heard of that. There are some web sites like Kickstarter.com and RocketHub.com and Indiegogo.com, where you can post a project. This is really done on a donation basis. Essentially you get a number of people funding small amounts of money on a daily donation basis to fund a particular project.
These are good for start-up type businesses because you don’t necessarily have to have a track record because this is money you don’t have to pay back. It’s a donation to get that project going. So that’s another way to fund a business right now.
The other would be angel networks. This is really for equity more than for loans and donations. But there are angel networks you can find on the Internet. Essentially, these are either high net worth individuals who want to fund a particular venture and they would get equity or shares in the new company. That would be another way that has blossomed in the last 5 to 7 years for especially start-up type of businesses to get funding.
Deanne: So just to recap, there is crowd funding, angel networking and what was the first one?
Stephanie: Peer to peer lending.
Deanne: That is very interesting. We’re going to take a short break. Stay tuned. We’re talking to Stephanie Skaggs. This is Today’s Inspiring Women.
Welcome back to Today’s Inspiring Women. We are speaking with Stephanie Skaggs, who is a financial expert for entrepreneurs and how to get your business started. Just before the break, we talked about the steps you need to take before filling out that loan application. We talked about some strategies for women entrepreneurs. What I’d like to go into in this segment, Stephanie, is some of crucial things that lenders look at to evaluate whether or not they’re going to give you money.
Stephanie: Sure. There are really four things lenders look at when determining whether a loan application is going to get a stamp of approval. Those four things are character, collateral, credit and cash flow. Let me go into each one of those. Character really has to do with whether you know what you are doing.
Do you have a background in the business you’re trying to get money for? If it is a start-up business, maybe you worked for somebody else doing the same type of thing. What is your character is terms of do you have what it takes to run a business? Do you have the education or the experience to do that? So you’re really selling your character.
The next thing would be collateral. For loans, typically they want some sort of collateral. Because bankers are pessimists. They think right off the bat that you’re going to default on the loan. So they need to know based on if you default on the loan, how are they going to get their money back.
So they want some sort of collateral. You need to be able to provide to them information about what your collateral is. In some cases, it might just be your character. So it’s your signature if it’s an unsecured business loan.
The third thing is your credit. Of course, everybody hears about FICO scores or credit scores. So that gives a lender an idea about whether you pay your bills back. The higher the score on a scale of 300 to 800, the better credit you have and the more likely you’d be to pay your bills back. The higher your scores, the more likely you are to get better interest rates on loans and also to get a better approval rating on loans.
The fourth thing lenders look at is cash flow. They want to know whether you have the cash coming in to yourself personally or to the business that you are going to be able to make the payments on the business loan. That might be your personal income. That might be revenue generated from the business in order to pay that loan back.
So it’s character, collateral, credit and cash flow. Those are the four things a lender looks at to make a determination on the business loan application.
Deanne: I think it is very noteworthy that the first thing on your list was character. I also thought that it was interesting that character was mentioned as part of your collateral that you can see as your collateral holding a significant amount of weight as to whether or not you get that loan.
Stephanie: Sure. That has to do with your experience, as well as your education, as well as how you portray yourself in the industry. All those kinds of things.
Deanne: I know one time I was starting a bakery business, and I walked into a bank, had my business plan and it was a hand shake deal for $40,000. No contracts were drawn up or anything, so it must have been the character element. I didn’t think of that until just now.
Stephanie: Yea. Character is certainly a thing that a lot of people don’t think about. They forget about that part of it. Even today, where it is very hard to get business loans just by walking into your local bank, it is still an aspect of relationship business. The numbers speak for themselves, but also that character aspect of it does influence whether you get the approval or not.
Deanne: What advice would you give listeners who may be thinking about starting a business?
Stephanie: First and foremost, have a clear understanding of why you want to start a business. Starting a business is not the easiest thing, so you have to have a big, big reason why you want to do it. In a lot of cases, you’re going to have to give things up, whether it’s monetary things, whether it’s time, whether it’s the security of having a job.
Really understanding why you want to do it. You need to have that answered very firmly in your mind. Because when the going gets rough, if you don’t have a big why about the reasons you’re doing it, then people give up. And they give up sometimes before a business really has a chance to take off and be profitable. So really understand the why.
I think the next thing is to be realistic about the time that it takes to get financing or funding. Realistically, it probably it takes as much as 100 hours spread over time to get the capital raising process under way. And the time is spent perfecting your business plan, understanding your business and your market, and your break-even analysis and all those things, as well as getting a targeted list of perspective funding sources.
Because right now a lot of entrepreneurs are having to piece together funding packages. It used to be that if you needed $500,000 you could go down to your local bank and get a business loan for that. But now that may not be the case. You may need a business loan for $100,000. You may need four credit cards with $25,000 limits. You see what I mean? You might need to piece things together to get the funding that you need.
The next thing is to really put a good team in place. Even if you’re a solo entrepreneur, realize that you can’t do it all on your own. Be willing to hire people to help you and to outsource tasks that would really be suited for an expert in a different area, whether that is a lawyer or an accountant or a web site designer or a bookkeeper to prepare invoices. So just make sure that you have a good team.
Deanne: What are some of the services that you provide for anyone interested?
Stephanie: Sure. My business really focuses on consulting to business owners or entrepreneurs who are either starting a business or who have started a business and are seeking financing. I help prepare them in those four steps we talked about that really need to happen before you fill out the loan application. In some cases, entrepreneurs don’t really have the financial background in order to even be able to take those four steps themselves.
I help them do that. I help them do that personal assessment, develop a personal statement, help them to get their credit analyzed. Maybe they need some help in addressing some credit flaws. I help them do that. That’s a process that sometimes take a little bit of time and they need some hand holding in order to do that. But the crucial step of what I do is to really assess from a business standpoint the best possible sources that a person can realistically get financing from.
Deanne: Okay.
Stephanie: It’s not as easy as it used to because there are so many different potential sources of financing. I have a list of over 30 different financing sources. If you tried to get financing from all those different sources, it would take so much time, you would probably never get the financing.
Deanne: How do people get in touch with you?
Stephanie: I have a great web site with lots of free information. That is www.toptenfinancing.com. And that’s the number ten. There’s a contact area there. But like I said, there’s lots of free information just in terms of education and gaining knowledge about it. You can also seek my services for consulting there. So there’s a lot of information on my web site.
Deanne: Well, Stephanie, we have to wrap this up. I’d like to thank you for being on Today’s Inspiring Women. Breaking Boundaries is the sponsor for Today’s Inspiring Women. Breaking Boundaries provides personalized coaching and corporate training services to businesses, professionals and organizations. If you’re looking to break through your personal boundaries and roadblocks, Breaking Boundaries International can help. They can be reached at www.breaking-boundaries.com or phone them at 866-91-coach.
The quote today is from Oprah Winfrey. “Be more splendid, more extraordinary. Use every moment to fill yourself up.” With that, this is Deanne Demarco from Today’s Inspiring Women. Have a wonderful day.
Guests: Jennifer Simonetti-Bryan - Master of Wine
Stephanie Skaggs – Small Business Expert
Air Date: 5/9/13
Deanne: Welcome to Today’s Inspiring Women. I’m your host Deanne DeMarco. If you are interested in becoming a sponsor for this show, give us at 708-836-0118. That’s 708-836-0118. We have sponsorship packages that will fit all budgets.
If you are ready to take the next steps to becoming empowered, motivated and better equipped for success, then stay tuned. My first guest today is Jennifer Simonetti-Bryan, who is a master of wine. Jennifer is fast rising as one of the go-to experts on wine. She holds the world’s top title, Master of Wine, has trained thousands in the industry and judges in international wine and spirits competitions.
Jennifer is the fourth woman among only 30 people in the United States to ever attain the international title of Master of Wine, which is the highest wine title to achieve in the world. She was also honored with an international tasting trophy for her palate and hosts an additional five leading wine and spirits certifications. Jennifer, welcome to Today’s Inspiring Women.
Jennifer: Thank you very much for having me. I’m very excited.
Deanne: First, what is a Master of Wine?
Jennifer: A Master of Wine is an international title. It’s funny. My family thought it was like going for a business degree except in wine. It’s not. It’s not a degree. It’s a title. It’s kind of like the Olympics of wine. It’s a 4-day exam, which is administered by the Institute of Masters of Wine in the UK. It started in 1955. Since 1955, there are only 300 of us around the entire globe. I mean, some of us are dying out now, so I think there are less than 300 now. But there are only 300 of us in the world.
The exam includes four days of grueling essays on topics of winemaking, viticulture, the global business aspects, as well as philosophical issues and political issues. We are also tested on our palates. So we have to identify 36 wines. They gave you the glass, and they’d say, “Tell us what grape varieties are in it. Tell us how it was made. Tell us the vintage. Tell us the price and the quality of this wine.” Just by tasting it. No other information.
Deanne: Just by tasting it? No other information?
Jennifer: Right. So it was one of the greatest undertakings. Fortune magazine had done a feature on me, and I remember them asking me how many wines I’d tasted. I had to do the calculations. From the time I began wine to the time that I obtained the Master of Wine and studied for it, I probably tasted about 10,000 wines.
And I guess if you do anything 10,000 times, I guess you’re an
expert at something.
Deanne: That’s incredible. I think my tongue would go numb. I think what’s really interesting is that you came from a financial background, six-figure salary, and you left career number one, which was a very successful career, to go to career number two, which is your passion of wine. Tell us a little bit about that.
Jennifer: I used to work for Citicorp in London. I was in investment banking. This is much more fun. But when I was working there, I was a management associate at the time, and I was in what you would call “job jail.” There’s only so many times you can wake up in the morning and say, Can I call in sick again?”
Deanne: Wow.
Jennifer: I loved the intellectual stimulation of the job. And, let’s be honest, I loved the money. But I didn’t actually like the job itself and the hours were so horrendous. I was working well over 100 hours a week, so I had literally no time at all. When you do something over 100 hours per week that you don’t enjoy, you really start to wonder what you’re doing.
It was actually a business lunch that completely changed my life. This was in London in the executive dining room facilities for Citicorp. We were doing a presentation for a client. It was Bridgestone Corporation I remember. We were doing an Optimal Capital Structuring presentation. And I don’t know whether it was sleep deprivation or whatever, but we were just so exciting to be leaving the office even if it was to go to the executive dining room.
During the presentation, we were served lunch. Because we were in the UK, they served wine. In New York, you generally don’t see that a lot. You ask for iced tea or diet coke. But we had an herb crusted salmon and a Savennieres. Do you know what a Savenneires is?
Deanne: No clue.
Jennifer: Savenneires is a white wine from the Loire Valley in France made with Simone Blanc. I know this is foreign, and I had no idea back then. I didn’t know anything about wine at all. It wasn’t that the wine was so amazing. It was just the combination of these two things together totally blew me away.
I mean I know this now. Salmon is a very fatty fish, and it coats your tongue in kind of an oil. It’s kind of a rich, oily fish. And when you taste the Sauvignon Blanc, the Savenneires, the high acid from this wine cuts through the fat and creates this cleansing sensation.
It was so refreshing. It made you feel like you were eating healthier. It was a wonderful experience and with the complimenting of flavors, I thought, wow. The chef in the back didn’t just throw this together. It was a conscious decision to put these two things together.
So I thought, you know what? For one hour a week, I owe it to myself to go pursue something new. That was kind of the epiphany that I had. Actually a week later I was working really, really late and someone said to me, Jennifer, don’t worry. In about ten years, you’ll have paid your dues. And I started thinking, Good Lord, I cannot spend the next ten years doing this.
So it was kind of a catalyst to pursue something new. And that’s what really started me on my wine journey. I just had this epiphany. So I thought, let me take some classes. But I didn’t jump to the new career right away. Just because you have something that may be a hobby doesn’t necessarily mean that you want to change careers. But it was a great catalyst.
Deanne: Let’s take that a little bit further. So how did you make that transition from the corporate into the wine world? You said you took some classes, but there are huge risks there.
Jennifer: Yea. There are enormous risks. I think when you’re starting to think about a new career, what I realize now. Back then, I didn’t know what I was doing, but what I realize now is that I created a platform. What I mean by a platform is that you have to create the platform from where you can jump where you want to go. In order to do that, you need the knowledge. So going to for classes and things of that sort. You need to find out more information.
After that, you need to network. So create a networking platform. I did a lot of informational interviews. This was way before Facebook, way before all the Linked In and all the things we have today that are so beneficial and useful for all the listeners out there, but I didn’t have any of that.
So I just picked up the phone and called people. I said, you know, I’m thinking about going into this industry. Would you give me five minutes to tell me about your experience? I found that most people were willing to give you at least five to ten minutes of their time if they found that you had a lot of enthusiasm for their field or their job.
So not only classes and networking, but I also needed to create a financial platform on which to jump. So creating that little nest egg. You have to think about those things before you leap. Otherwise, you can be going downstream without a paddle.
So I had to create that little nest egg because I figured, I’m kind of behind. I was going down a path of finance and knew nothing about wine. So I needed to ramp up in knowledge, which meant taking more classes. I was probably going to go way below where my salary was because I was making six figures in banking. And in the Windows on the World Wine School, I had been told no one makes money in the wine industry. So he actually tried to dissuade me from going into the wine industry.
Deanne: Really?
Jennifer: Yea. Because he said, you’ll never make the money that you’re making. The running joke in the wine industry is, “How do you make a small fortune in the wine industry? You start with a large fortune.” People end up losing money. People do it for passion. They do it for the love of wine. They don’t do it for money. But I ignored him, and I ended up looking in the New York Times, and I found a job at a wine store called The Burgundy Wine Company in New York.
I left banking to go work at this wine store. My family thought I had lost my mind. The job that I had was the person who was showing that Savenneires to the executive dining room facility. So I thought this was the best job on the planet.
Deanne: Sure.
Jennifer: Kevin as he was talking to me, he ended up becoming a big mentor. So it’s always good to find and latch on to anyone who is willing to give you advice. When I called to tell him that I got this new job in the industry, he said, Jennifer, you’re going to call me in six months and say you want to get out of there. I told him,
you’re wrong. I’m going to love it.
Well, it took 10 months, not six months. And so Kevin said, Okay, let me introduce you to a few people. Just interview with them. Don’t bring your resume. Just ask them questions. From there, the person who interviewed me was a wine reporter from Cobrand Corporation. Within 30 minutes of talking with her, even though I didn’t even bring my resume, I was hired.
When I went into that interview, I was scared to death because I had less than a year experience in the wine industry. So I thought I have to build parallels to things I had done in banking to whatever I could think of with this new job. So for example, for large banking meetings, I would organize hundreds of banks together for particular deal. The person who interviewed me saw that as an opportunity for their management. There was a parallel there.
So even if you don’t have a direct connection in the industry, you can draw parallels for someone to say, Oh wow, you don’t have those skills. I can still use you even though you don’t have years of experience in the industry itself.
Deanne: It sounds like they were using transferable skills.
Jennifer: Yes. And identifying what those transferable skills were. That’s important to know.
Deanne: For our audience who may be interested in maybe switching careers, maybe looking at what skills they have that they can transfer over to a new career they may be looking at. Is that what I’m hearing you say?
Jennifer: Exactly. And I also realized in the wine industry, there weren’t that many people with credentials. There weren’t that many credentialing schools or organizations. But whatever there was, I found them and told myself I’d get at least a basic credential. I found that after two years, I had more than most people in the industry had.
So taking those classes, not only for the knowledge, but also to be able to enroll in them and show them on your resume. That shows that you have initiative and that you’re working toward building your knowledge in the industry. It can help tremendously.
Deanne: Interesting. I’ve heard five things from you already as far as going into a new career. One, start out with a networking platform. You’ve got to mentor. Get those transferable skills that you can use in a second career. Get educated. I’m hearing you say over and over again that you’ve got to get the education for the direction you want to go. Also to investigate those 5-minute interviews with people just to find out more about the career you’re thinking of going into.
Jennifer: Yea. That’s right.
Deanne: I’m also hearing you say to not be afraid to move forward.
Jennifer: Well, there is fear all along the way. You’ve got to kind of feel the fear and do it anyway. One of the things that helped me tremendously was that when I entered the Masters of Wine program and I was studying for it, I had interviewed another candidate as well. So when I was interviewing her, in an offhand way, I say, I don’t know if I’ll ever do it. And she looked me and said, don’t you ever say that. I never want to hear you say that again. You need a vision.
She was a woman who had always been so kind and gentle with me. And the power of emotion behind what she was saying struck me and got my attention. She said, you need vision. You need to see yourself as a Master of Wine. You need to see yourself in that position. You’ve got to be aggressive with it. I don’t care if you write your name down with the letters MW after it every day until you get it, but you need to see yourself in that fashion.
I guess that is part of the faith of moving forward. You have to have that faith in order to combat the fear that will always be there. There was a period of time that I thought, what am I doing? I went to a third of my salary the first two years, so of course you’re scared. But having that vision and that constant reminder of why you’re doing it needs to be in the forefront.
Whether you create a vision board or you write your name with the credentials after it. Something. It has to be visually stimulating.
Deanne: Those are all good tips. We’re going to take a short break here. Stay tuned. We’ll be right back on Today’s Inspiring Women.
Welcome back. This is Deanne Demarco with Today’s Inspiring Women. We are talking today with Jennifer Simonetti-Bryan, who is a Master of Wine. In this segment, she is going to be telling us a little bit more about what women can do in following their passion.
Jennifer, welcome back. We’ve learned from you so far some really great advice about coming up with a networking plan, finding a mentor, identifying your transferable skills, investigating this new career and also to definitely get educated. You wrapped up the last section with a strong vision and really see yourself as whatever it is you want to be doing and to be aggressive in that belief.
Jennifer: Yes. You need to have that confidence because there are going to be times when it’s hard. They tell you it takes five no’s to get to your yes. A lot of people feel so rejected after that first “no” that they may give up.
Deanne: You went from a six figure income in the banking industry. It sounds like you’ve been able to make it now following your passion.
Jennifer: Absolutely. It took a while. It probably took the better part of a decade, but now I’m making more money than I ever did when I was in banking. I never look back because now I’m happy. And it was worth those ten years.
Deanne: I think that is important for people to hear. That you can see those returns, but you have to be willing to put the time in to make it happen.
Jennifer: Right. I told myself in the beginning I would rather be really uncomfortable. I told myself that I was going to be really uncomfortable for probably about five years. But it was a time investment I was willing to make because now I’m happier than ever. And actually it’s a common practice in marketing and certain companies. In the wine world, everybody knows the champagne houses are Creteil.
That’s exactly what they did. Back in the 1990s, nobody knew who they were. And they said, you know, for five years we are going to be in the red, but we are going to advertise and we are going to do a whole marketing plan. But they knew they were going to be in the red for five years. Now they are the most popular champagne house in the world.
It’s similar to the concept of total quality management. If you pay attention to the quality of the product, which is you, and the quality of your life and what you want, eventually the money will come.
But many people say, I don’t know what I want to do. I know I’m miserable, but I don’t know what I want to do. To them, I would say that I believe in the law of attraction. If you’re interested in something, go seek it out.
Chances are the gravitational pull of that interest planet that is going to pull you even more to the point where you say, you know what? This is what I want to do. Sometimes it doesn’t happen that way, but we look around to see which interest planet is going to suck you in. But you can’t know until you start moving towards it.
Deanne: That’s really good information. I want to go back to your Master of Wine. Do women need to know about wine in business?
Jennifer: I think they really do. I mean, 75 percent of the wine purchased is by women. Yet, when you go to business centers or if you’re conducting business with clients at a steakhouse, that wine list acts like a hot potato between people. Nobody wants to choose the wine. They’re all terrified. So it’s a huge opportunity for women to take that list, take charge and be impressive.
Wine is a very non-intrusive topic for women to talk about. You can talk about wine in a very casual manner. It’s not going to cause tremendous amounts of controversy. And you can make yourself look impressive. So I think women should definitely know about wine, not only from a personal perspective, but from a business perspective as well.
Deanne: That’s really great information. That wine list comes and nobody wants to pay attention to it because nobody knows one wine from another, let alone what everybody is eating. I thought it was interesting when at the very start of our show today, you talked about how you were drawn when you were in England with having a salmon lunch with a wine pairing. And how that wine complemented what you were eating, which made that whole eating experience enjoyable.
Jennifer: Oh yes. If you create that experience, people remember you.
Deanne: To me, that was my little “aha” moment. I think that’s really interesting. Now you have a couple of books out. One is “Pairing with the Masters: A Definitive Guide to Food and Wine.” The other one is “The other is “The One-Minute Wine Master: Discover Ten Wines You Like In 60 Seconds or Less.” Would one of those books help people like me in trying to find a wine quickly?
Jennifer: Absolutely. “The One-Minute Wine Master” is for you. Everyone has done a Cosmo quiz, right? Well, this is kind of done in a similar way. There eleven questions. After the eleven questions, you get placed into a seasonal category for your palate. So are you a winter? Are you a fall? Or are you a summer or spring?
So in the winter, you’d want full-bodied, rich red wines and old red wines. So it kind of sounds like what your palate would describe. You don’t need any knowledge about wine to answer the questions. So one of the questions is, “How do you take your coffee in the morning?” Anybody could answer that. You could even answer that you don’t take coffee in the morning.
The questions have seemingly nothing to do with wine, but it tells me a lot about your palate. So in less than a minute you can find recommendations for ten wines that you’ll probably like.
Deanne: How about when you are having a guest? Where can I go to get help in trying to figure out the correct wine pairing with what I’m serving?
Jennifer: The book that I created with a master chef called “Pairing with the Masters” is actually a culinary textbook for CIA and Cordon Bleu, so I think for beginners, that’s probably not going to be the first place to go. There is a great book called “What to Drink with What You Eat.” That is a really book. It is kind of a list of wines under particular food categories, so that might be a good place to start.
Deanne: That is really good information. What’s next for you?
Jennifer: I’m doing some more books. I’m going to be doing some more DVD series for The Great Courses, which used to be called The Teaching Company. We did four series on wine and one on spirits and cocktails. So we’ll be working on more DVDs there, and I’m a senior partner in a firm that is going to be launching soon that I am very excited about. I can’t tell you more than that now, but I’m really excited. It’s something you’ll be hearing a lot about in the future.
Deanne: How can people get in touch with you or follow you to find out what is in store? What is the best way?
Jennifer: Well, anyone can find me on Linked In, which is great because we’re talking networking and connecting. So you can find me on Linked In. You can also find me on by web site, Jennifersimonetti.com. I’m on Twitter as well. You may laugh at my Twitter handle: Jedi Wine Master.
Deanne: That’s cute. So when you are ready to launch your new business, it will show up on Twitter?
Jennifer: That’s right. And on Linked in.
Deanne: The time has just been flowing. It’s been really exciting talking to you. We’re going to be taking another short break. I’d like to thank Jennifer Simonetti-Bryan, our wine master, for being on Today’s Inspiring Women. Thank you very much, Jennifer.
Jennifer: Thank you very much the opportunity. There are so many women out there who need inspiration. I’m happy to help.
Deanne: I don’t know about anybody else, but I’m going to go get that book, “The One-Minute Wine Master.” I’m assuming that is on Amazon.
Jennifer: That’s right. It’s everywhere.
Deanne: Stay tuned. After the break, we’ll be talking about how to finance
your entrepreneurial venture.
Second Guest:
Deanne: Welcome back. This is Deanne DeMarco with Today’s Inspiring Women. Right now we have Stephanie Skaggs on the line. Stephanie is an entrepreneur, business owner and financing specialist. She has started eleven companies or has partnered with other people over the last 16 years.
She is the president of Asset Financing Group and specializes in small business financing and commercial mortgages. Her expertise includes all things financial, both personal and professional. She has helped over 150 business owners and entrepreneurs get financing. Welcome Stephanie.
Stephanie: Good morning. How are you?
Deanne: I’m going wonderful. Thank you. I think your expertise is something many of our listeners need to hear about. That is how do you go about financing? I’ve been hearing that small business loans are really hard to get these days. Is that correct?
Stephanie: It is still correct. What’s going on is kind of a double-edged sword. Banks do have a lot of money right now, but they’re tight to let it loose, so to speak. There’s two things going on. The regulators are saying that you have to loan only to good people, but a lot of business owners are having trouble showing that they have the business strength to get a business loan.
So it’s difficult to just walk down to the local bank and say, I need a business loan. Can you loan money? There are other opportunities out there besides business loans, and that’s what my business focuses on.
Deanne: Outside of going on “Shark Tank” to try and get a loan [laughter], what are some of the things entrepreneurs can do to try to get financing?
Stephanie: I think there are a few things that people who are entrepreneurs need to do before they even seek financing. Really, they need to evaluate what their market is. Because unfortunately what I see a lot of is an entrepreneur who maybe has a great idea, but they’Ve forgotten to ask whether there is a market for whatever product or service they have.
Sometimes that question is answered differently depending on the way you ask it. So, is my product or service really needed in the market? That may get a different answer than asking is this a product I want to sell? That does make sense?
Deanne: Sure.
Stephanie: So really understanding what your market is, whether you have a potential to really have your product or service as a scalable type of venture. Because that would dictate what kind of financing you need. Is it something you need all at once? Or is it something you could maybe get incrementally over time? That’s really going to dictate the type of financing you seek.
The other thing is what is the situation you’re going into in terms of do you need debt? Or do you need equity? There’s really a difference between those two types of financing in terms of the sources that somebody would seek. So that is the other question someone needs to ask if they’re starting an entrepreneurial venture.
So there are a number of questions an entrepreneur needs to ask before they even seek financing. Those are just a couple of them to get people thinking.
Deanne: What are those four steps that a person should be taking before they even think about filling out a loan application?
Stephanie: I think the best thing is to do again is to really look at your situation specifically. So step #1 would be to take a personal inventory, and that would be to prepare a personal financial statement. That is really a breakdown of what your assets are, what your liabilities are and the potential income sources that you have. So the first step is to take a personal inventory.
The second step would be to know what your scores are before you even seek financing. Your scores are your credit scores, what your net worth is, what your debt to income ratios are. So know your numbers before you seek financing because that will determine the kind of financing you can than seek.
The next step is to have a business plan, so even if you’re lender or your financing source doesn’t require a business plan, you should always have a business plan. And a business plan is not a document that has to be a huge, multi-page document, but it does have to be something you’ve thought about it really understand what your break-even point is. How much money should you be generating through your business just to break even?
The next step would be to identify the correct sources of financing. Those really are dependent on what your credit is, which is why step #2 is to know what your credit scores are. Also what kind of collateral? That’s step #1, identifying what your assets are. So those are really the four steps somebody needs to take before they even fill out an application.
Deanne: I can see how that would really be helpful. Also with your product, you might have a product that you think, you know, the world really needs this. However, the world may not know they need this.
Stephanie: Yea. That certainly has to do with how you go about marketing your project and, in some cases, it’s educating the marketplace that they need this product. So that certainly is part of your marketing scheme. And that is really part of your business plan.
Deanne: When the I-Pad first came out, I remember thinking, why do I need this?
Stephanie: Yes. Now you can’t live without it, right?
Deanne: I can’t live without it, but when it first came out, I thought, okay, you say I need this product, but I don’t understand it. I was just thinking that’s true for other companies and other entrepreneurs as well. They may have a product that they think the world really needs, but I just need to educate the world or my customers that they really do need it. So that’s part of that whole business plan.
Stephanie: Exactly. That’s exactly right.
Deanne: And being really truthful.
Stephanie: Yea. You’ve got to come up with your idea, but you also need to think about how you’re going to market it and how you’re going to educate the market about it.
Deanne: Excellent. Are there some financial strategies that are more tailored to women?
Stephanie: It’s interesting because women have been starting businesses like crazy over recent years. Some statistics show they are actually starting businesses at a higher rate than men are. And despite that statistic, women-owned businesses are still categorized as minority-owned businesses. So if there are special programs tailored toward minority-owned businesses, a lot of times women can qualify or get special treatment for those kinds of businesses.
A couple places where if you’re a women-owned business, you can check. There are certain economic development programs in local areas that tailor programs specifically for women-owned businesses. And the Small Business Administration actually has an on-line directory that people can go to and check for economic development programs in specific areas. So there are local or regional area, like certain states, have them. The Small Business Administration web site does have an on-line directory for those.
Similarly, there are certain grant programs that are tailored specifically to women or minority businesses. Again, the Small Business Administration web site does have a directory of grant programs. One thing I want to caution people about when they’re talking about grants. Perhaps you’ve even gotten these e-mails where they say for $100, you can buy a directory for all the grants that are out there.
I wouldn’t pay for that myself. There are sources, such as on the Small Business Administration web site, where you can get that information for free. So don’t flush that $100 down the toilet by buying those kinds of directories. That is available for free.
Deanne: Now with grants, you don’t have to pay that money back?
Stephanie: That is correct. So that is basically something that you don’t have to pay back. It’s something that is awarded specifically for a project. They are somewhat difficult to get and they’re usually very tailor-made for a specific industry or area of concern. So look around. And some private companies offer grants as well. Sometimes the criteria for getting the grant is you have to be a minority or a women-owned business.
Deanne: What are a couple of sources where entrepreneurs can go to get funding?
Stephanie: There are some really interesting sources that over the last five to seven years have really blossomed because of the Internet age. One of them is what we call peer-to-peer lending. Even though banks aren’t out lending money, there is still a lot of money out there that would like to be put to work. And peer-to-peering lending, and there are web sites you can go to on the Internet, where they match individuals who have money with entrepreneurs who are seeking money.
This is done on a loan basis. Lendingclub.com is one. Prosper.com is another one where you can basically post your project or your loan request. Then either an individual or someone who is knowledgable in the industry who has money would agree to then fund that project on a loan basis. So that’s peer-to-peer funding.
Another one that is similar is called Crowd Funding. Perhaps you’ve heard of that. There are some web sites like Kickstarter.com and RocketHub.com and Indiegogo.com, where you can post a project. This is really done on a donation basis. Essentially you get a number of people funding small amounts of money on a daily donation basis to fund a particular project.
These are good for start-up type businesses because you don’t necessarily have to have a track record because this is money you don’t have to pay back. It’s a donation to get that project going. So that’s another way to fund a business right now.
The other would be angel networks. This is really for equity more than for loans and donations. But there are angel networks you can find on the Internet. Essentially, these are either high net worth individuals who want to fund a particular venture and they would get equity or shares in the new company. That would be another way that has blossomed in the last 5 to 7 years for especially start-up type of businesses to get funding.
Deanne: So just to recap, there is crowd funding, angel networking and what was the first one?
Stephanie: Peer to peer lending.
Deanne: That is very interesting. We’re going to take a short break. Stay tuned. We’re talking to Stephanie Skaggs. This is Today’s Inspiring Women.
Welcome back to Today’s Inspiring Women. We are speaking with Stephanie Skaggs, who is a financial expert for entrepreneurs and how to get your business started. Just before the break, we talked about the steps you need to take before filling out that loan application. We talked about some strategies for women entrepreneurs. What I’d like to go into in this segment, Stephanie, is some of crucial things that lenders look at to evaluate whether or not they’re going to give you money.
Stephanie: Sure. There are really four things lenders look at when determining whether a loan application is going to get a stamp of approval. Those four things are character, collateral, credit and cash flow. Let me go into each one of those. Character really has to do with whether you know what you are doing.
Do you have a background in the business you’re trying to get money for? If it is a start-up business, maybe you worked for somebody else doing the same type of thing. What is your character is terms of do you have what it takes to run a business? Do you have the education or the experience to do that? So you’re really selling your character.
The next thing would be collateral. For loans, typically they want some sort of collateral. Because bankers are pessimists. They think right off the bat that you’re going to default on the loan. So they need to know based on if you default on the loan, how are they going to get their money back.
So they want some sort of collateral. You need to be able to provide to them information about what your collateral is. In some cases, it might just be your character. So it’s your signature if it’s an unsecured business loan.
The third thing is your credit. Of course, everybody hears about FICO scores or credit scores. So that gives a lender an idea about whether you pay your bills back. The higher the score on a scale of 300 to 800, the better credit you have and the more likely you’d be to pay your bills back. The higher your scores, the more likely you are to get better interest rates on loans and also to get a better approval rating on loans.
The fourth thing lenders look at is cash flow. They want to know whether you have the cash coming in to yourself personally or to the business that you are going to be able to make the payments on the business loan. That might be your personal income. That might be revenue generated from the business in order to pay that loan back.
So it’s character, collateral, credit and cash flow. Those are the four things a lender looks at to make a determination on the business loan application.
Deanne: I think it is very noteworthy that the first thing on your list was character. I also thought that it was interesting that character was mentioned as part of your collateral that you can see as your collateral holding a significant amount of weight as to whether or not you get that loan.
Stephanie: Sure. That has to do with your experience, as well as your education, as well as how you portray yourself in the industry. All those kinds of things.
Deanne: I know one time I was starting a bakery business, and I walked into a bank, had my business plan and it was a hand shake deal for $40,000. No contracts were drawn up or anything, so it must have been the character element. I didn’t think of that until just now.
Stephanie: Yea. Character is certainly a thing that a lot of people don’t think about. They forget about that part of it. Even today, where it is very hard to get business loans just by walking into your local bank, it is still an aspect of relationship business. The numbers speak for themselves, but also that character aspect of it does influence whether you get the approval or not.
Deanne: What advice would you give listeners who may be thinking about starting a business?
Stephanie: First and foremost, have a clear understanding of why you want to start a business. Starting a business is not the easiest thing, so you have to have a big, big reason why you want to do it. In a lot of cases, you’re going to have to give things up, whether it’s monetary things, whether it’s time, whether it’s the security of having a job.
Really understanding why you want to do it. You need to have that answered very firmly in your mind. Because when the going gets rough, if you don’t have a big why about the reasons you’re doing it, then people give up. And they give up sometimes before a business really has a chance to take off and be profitable. So really understand the why.
I think the next thing is to be realistic about the time that it takes to get financing or funding. Realistically, it probably it takes as much as 100 hours spread over time to get the capital raising process under way. And the time is spent perfecting your business plan, understanding your business and your market, and your break-even analysis and all those things, as well as getting a targeted list of perspective funding sources.
Because right now a lot of entrepreneurs are having to piece together funding packages. It used to be that if you needed $500,000 you could go down to your local bank and get a business loan for that. But now that may not be the case. You may need a business loan for $100,000. You may need four credit cards with $25,000 limits. You see what I mean? You might need to piece things together to get the funding that you need.
The next thing is to really put a good team in place. Even if you’re a solo entrepreneur, realize that you can’t do it all on your own. Be willing to hire people to help you and to outsource tasks that would really be suited for an expert in a different area, whether that is a lawyer or an accountant or a web site designer or a bookkeeper to prepare invoices. So just make sure that you have a good team.
Deanne: What are some of the services that you provide for anyone interested?
Stephanie: Sure. My business really focuses on consulting to business owners or entrepreneurs who are either starting a business or who have started a business and are seeking financing. I help prepare them in those four steps we talked about that really need to happen before you fill out the loan application. In some cases, entrepreneurs don’t really have the financial background in order to even be able to take those four steps themselves.
I help them do that. I help them do that personal assessment, develop a personal statement, help them to get their credit analyzed. Maybe they need some help in addressing some credit flaws. I help them do that. That’s a process that sometimes take a little bit of time and they need some hand holding in order to do that. But the crucial step of what I do is to really assess from a business standpoint the best possible sources that a person can realistically get financing from.
Deanne: Okay.
Stephanie: It’s not as easy as it used to because there are so many different potential sources of financing. I have a list of over 30 different financing sources. If you tried to get financing from all those different sources, it would take so much time, you would probably never get the financing.
Deanne: How do people get in touch with you?
Stephanie: I have a great web site with lots of free information. That is www.toptenfinancing.com. And that’s the number ten. There’s a contact area there. But like I said, there’s lots of free information just in terms of education and gaining knowledge about it. You can also seek my services for consulting there. So there’s a lot of information on my web site.
Deanne: Well, Stephanie, we have to wrap this up. I’d like to thank you for being on Today’s Inspiring Women. Breaking Boundaries is the sponsor for Today’s Inspiring Women. Breaking Boundaries provides personalized coaching and corporate training services to businesses, professionals and organizations. If you’re looking to break through your personal boundaries and roadblocks, Breaking Boundaries International can help. They can be reached at www.breaking-boundaries.com or phone them at 866-91-coach.
The quote today is from Oprah Winfrey. “Be more splendid, more extraordinary. Use every moment to fill yourself up.” With that, this is Deanne Demarco from Today’s Inspiring Women. Have a wonderful day.
Vonda White, CEO Collegiate Risk Management
Karen Moulder, CEo, Claim Check Bulling service, Author of Burning Barriers..
From Rags to Riches and First Female Firefighter
Host: Deanne De Marco
Guests: Vonda White, CEO, Collegiate Risk Management
Karen Moulder, Owner/Billing Manager at Claim Check Billing Service. Author; Burning Barriers.
Deanne: Welcome to Today’s Inspiring Women. I’m your host Deanne DeMarco. If you’re interested in becoming a sponsor for this show give us a call at 708-836-0118. We have a number of sponsorship opportunities that will fit all budgets.
If you’re ready to take the next steps to become empowered, motivated, and better equipped for success, then stay tuned.
Today, my first guest is Vonda White. Vonda is an entrepreneur and author. Vonda White will be sharing her remarkable life story from her days as a food stamp child.
Vonda’s life today is a far cry from her childhood, raised by a divorced mom who had to accept welfare and food stamps. Young Vonda’s contribution to the family finances was collecting, and redeeming empty soda cans.
As a teenager, her third attempt she won the Idaho state beauty pageant. The triumph came with college tuition and the beginning of a new life, which led her into a record-setting insurance sales career. And the launch of her own business, while being six months pregnant.
Vonda White, founder and CEO of Collegiate Risk Management. A company providing health, and accident insurance to thousands of students nationwide.
She has received numerous awards for her business achievements. She is author of Success Against the Odds. We‘d like to welcome Vonda to Today’s Inspiring Women. Welcome Vonda.
Vonda: Thank you. I’m glad to be on your show.
Deanne: You have just got a remarkable background. From being raised on food stamps to a millionaire. Please share with us some of those steps that you took, and how you became successful.
Vonda: When I was a kid I knew that; especially when I was in college, I felt that there was this person inside that wanted to get out, and knew that I could be successful.
It’s funny like, if you ever watch TV, and you see all these shows on about real estate or different things that make people rich. I would watch them and think, that could be me. I think I’d have that in me.
What I really did that made a difference in my life is that I allowed myself first to take risk. I allowed myself to dream.
A lot of people when you don’t have a lot, they think they don’t deserve it or they can’t get it. So, they basically believe that this is their life. They’ll just accept it. With me I didn’t do.
I decided, for example; when I was 14, I wanted to enter a teen pageant. That year I entered, I didn’t win anything at all. There were 50 girls. I had the desire to someday hold that title. Because I really admired the girls that was the past queen. Then the new one they nominated and picked.
I wanted to be like them. So I set goals. So, what does it take to win this title? What are they looking for? I knew I had to improve my grades. Be in leadership positions. Run for different offices. Really build a resume, and be the best person that I could be.
So, for the next year that’s what I worked on. On a really daily basis. Getting involved in community service work etcetera. Then from doing all of that I reentered the next year. I became second runner-up. Which was a huge accomplishment, but there was less girls that were competing that year. Second place still wasn’t good enough.
A lot of times what people do is, like what we talked about people give up. They quit when they get discouraged, and they get so close. Because you could do worse. That’s scary too thinking, this year I got second. The next year; I might try again, and maybe I won’t place at all.
But I decided the very next day, what were my weaknesses. What could I have done better? I was always looking at constructive criticism, and things that I could improve upon.
For the next two years that what I did. I improved upon those areas. I tried again my third, and last time that I could actually compete in the pageant, because of my age. That year I ended up winning it. There was like 52 girls competing.
I really didn’t think I could. I remember that day I broke down in the lobby. There’s was family I babysat for that believed in me. And helped, encouraged me to believe in myself. They helped me to get the sponsors, and everything. They came to see me.
I remember I was just crying. Then I said, I want this so bad. I’ve worked four years of my life to win this. Now with all these girls. They’re really strong competitors. I don’t think I can win it.
Jim said, “Vonda. This is a stepping stone to bigger and the better things. You go out there, and you believe you’ve already won that title. You go out with confidence and act like it. Whatever happens, happens, but you’ve got a good of a chance or better than anyone. You need to believe that you’ve already won it.”
So, that’s what I did. Then I ended winning the title. It literally changed my life.
Deanne: That’s every interesting. I think you said a couple of really important things here. One is that you looked at your weakness. Then you took action on those to improve.
Vonda: Yes. I do that to this day. I think we all should that.
Deanne: I couldn’t agree more. I think that there are so many people who want to just brush their weakness underneath the carpet. Like cover it up, and pretend they are not there.
Vonda: Right.
Deanne: I think; it’s tough to get that criticism that says, you need to improve in these areas.
Vonda: Right. The other thing is a lot of times people will make excuse for their weaknesses. And act like, well I can’t change it. That’s just who I am, either accept it or not. But the truth is we all have the possibility to improve our lives, to change.
And really to create the life that we want to live. We’re in control, instead of it controlling us. That mind frame helps to change who you are, and your circumstances.
Deanne: I absolutely believe that 100%. I think that was an important piece that you just made a comment on. The second one is that you were given advice to believe. To believe like you had already won it. I think, another important piece is to really believe that you can do it.
Vonda: It’s like sometimes you read about, they say dress for success. Like dress for the look, and behave the way that you want to be seen. Then it might seem foreign in that person and you might feel like actor, but pretty soon that becomes you are.
So, you act your way into something. If it’s not what you’re comfortable with or it’s different. So, for example; someone who’s a waitress, who’s never been in a professional environment. But they want to be a professional.
You start dressing part of being a professional person. Wear your hair, makeup, dress and create that you’re professional. People will start believing, looking, and embracing that you‘re a professional. Just things like that make a big difference in how we’re perceived, and also our own self confidence.
Deanne: I have to believe that a lot. The other thing that I thought was interesting is that man. Was it Jim you said?
Vonda: Yes, Jim Halley.
Deanne: He also said that no matter what, this will be a stepping stone for you.
Vonda: Right. The lesson with that is, no failure, is not a failure. It’s not something to be ashamed of. Or to think, oh I’m so embarrassed. Look how bad I did. It more; look what I did do and embrace it. Realize it’s a stepping stone to bigger, and better things.
It’s just like anybody who’s gotten great success. I mean if you look at a Donald Trump. He’s been bankrupt. He lost a lot of money at times. But he still allowed himself to take the risk and do things.
The same with Babe Ruth or any athlete, they’ve had more strikeouts than home runs. But if you keep hitting for the home you can still do world records, even though your strikeouts are more.
So you, anybody who‘s successful had failures, but they let the failures define them. They allow the failures to be the stepping stones to help them to be better, to learn from, and to move forward.
Deanne: I think that’s an excellent advice. I think it’s interesting when you go out college. You went into the insurance industry right in sales?
Vonda: Right in south. I was president. I ran for President for the Student Government at college in my junior year. I became president for two years in college. That allowed me to work on the other side of an insurance company.
When I graduated I had my foot in the door in order to get an interview with them. When they gave the interview, it didn’t go so well. There were two owners. One was really positive. One was really negative. He wouldn’t let me answer any questions and different things. When I left, I thought I’m not sure I want to work for me at all.
Then I went home to Idaho. This is in Florida where I interviewed. I went home to Idaho and no one was knocking on my door to give me a job. So, three months, which I know is really late, but I wrote them a thank you letter. I answered all the questions that Mr. Parker had asked me. That he didn’t let me answer.
I told him, I graduated with honors from college. I financially put myself through college. I did all these stuff with good grades etcetera, while holding a lot of leadership positions.
Then I said, I know I can be the best saleswoman your company has ever had, if you give the opportunity, and I believe in it so much, that I‘ll work for free for six months to prove it to you.
Why they hired is because I had the gumption to get their attention which I learned from a book I read from Norman Vincent Peale about, in the Depression, when jobs are so hard to come by.
There’s was job opening at the movie theatre. So the guy at the very end of the line had sent a note up that said, don’t hire anyone until you’ve interviewed me. I thought, I need to do something like that to grab their attention.
So, by offering to work for free showed I was serious, and would do my best. If it didn’t work, they could fire me and no harm, no foul. Actually that got my foot in the door.
When I got the job, I really worked my tail off to show them that they had made a good decision. They didn’t make me work for free. They gave me a good starting income, a car allowance. I never would’ve got that job if I hadn’t made that offer.
Deanne: And then, you set the sales records right?
Vonda: Yes. I became the second top sales person in the company. At the age of 27, I was promoted to Vice President of the company and Vice President of Sales. I had done really well at a young age. I was making really good money.
When I was like 30, either 30 or 31, and I’ve gotten married. I decided to resign, give up this great career with my savings, and 401, all the safety nets basically.
But I wasn’t happy in the environment. So I decided to quit and start my own company competing. I took a risk which was a huge risk, because, I could’ve failed, and not done well on my own. Have a hard time ever getting a job as good as I had.
But I knew that if I could work hard for someone, how much harder could I work for myself. I decided to take the risk. I did it. Within a year I knew I had made the right decision.
Deanne: That is great. I’d like to hear more. We have to take a break away, for a short break now. When we come back I want to talk a little bit more about your whole model, persistence and self image in goal setting.
But right now we need to take a break. So, stay tuned. After the break we’ll come back with Vonda White. This is Deanne De Marco with Today’s Aspiring Women.
Welcome back. This is Deanne De Marco. We’re talking with Vonda White, who’s gone from food stamps to millionaire.
Just before our break we talked a little bit about being persistent in your dreams, and about self image. We did touch a little bit about goal setting. Could you tell us little bit more about your personal models around persistence, self imaging and goal setting?
Vonda: The first thing I think that’s really important is to have written goals. A lot of people say that they have goals. But they don’t have it written down on paper. If you ask them, what are your goals? What are your specific goals? They wouldn’t be able to tell you.
In life; if you really have a goal, it’s something that you know that you’re working on. You’re working on it usually every day, a little bit. And it’s something that you see progress. You have deadline of when you want to get that accomplished.
So with my life, that’s what’s I’ve always done. Every year I set my goals. I’m working towards them, and by the end of the year I can see what goals I have accomplished. Which ones I need to spend a little bit more time on to get finished and get accomplished.
But through that you really do start accumulating your accomplishments. You realize that you can do so much. But most of us we have dreams in our head. There are things that we want to do, but they are not written. We don’t have the game plan how we’re going to get to it.
So, we really don’t get it accomplished or it takes a lot longer. You are all over the place. Sometimes you’re going after one thing. Then you get sidetracked.
You’re more focused if you’ve written goals. You have it done to where you know what you steps are each week, each month. That’s going to move you closer to getting that goal accomplished.
Deanne: So that would sound to me like; you are writing goals, and making sure that those goals are attainable goals.
Vonda: Yeah. A lot of time when you set a goal you hope that, and you think it’s attainable. But sometimes you’ll doubt, well maybe I can’t do this. But it’s okay to have goals that are lofty.
Like for example; would I ever have thought that I could run a very successful business and do what I do. I probably wouldn’t have thought that back then. But I decided that I’m going to start a company, and do this for myself. So, that was one goal.
But a lot of times, its okay to push yourself, and be bigger than you think you are able to do. At the same time you have to break it down. Like for example, if they want to lose 100 pounds. Then you’ve got to figure out, okay how many is that a week and a month realistically that you could honestly lose.
Because, if you say I’m going to lose 100 pounds in one month, you’re going to be disappointed. Because nobody’s going to be able to lose 100 pounds in one month. They need to be realistic, that it’s something that you actually can do if you put the time effort and focus on it.
But at the same time; like you take Debbie Fields who I featured in my book, from Mrs. Field Cookies. She just wanted to open a little cookie store and sell her cookies because she loved baking. But she ended up owning 3,600 franchises.
She franchised it; but at the beginning she wasn’t looking to be that big. You’ve got to allow yourself some time to think. It could be more than just one store, but right now I’m only going to just focus on doing one store.
Deanne: Then measure your success around that it is a goal that’s actually attainable at that time.
Vonda: Right. Once you hit the one, if I ‘m trying to lose 10 pound in a week. Which is possibly, depending on how much you have to lose etcetera that could be achievable. Then you hit that mark. Then you move to the next mark for the month or the next week.
Deanne: Excellent. I think that’s really good advice. I kind of think that the whole written goals is really important to making sure, that goal that you’re written down is attainable for right here and now.
I mean losing 100 pounds is great, but it wouldn’t be realistic to try to do that in one month. So be realistic about it. Break that down in smaller pieces. So, that you can actually measure your success.
Vonda: Right it’s kind of like Robert Schuller of the Crystal Cathedral Church in California. He always says, inch by inch, anything is a cinch. That’s true. No matter what your goal, if you break that big goal down to little steps. So, you’re accomplishing little things first. It is attainable.
Like even with me, starting a business, I didn’t know what was all included in starting your own business. When I started it every day I need to do something to move myself closer to have a successful company. The first thing is like contacting a lawyer.
The second thing is getting a logo made. The third thing is getting stationary and marketing pieces and on and on. As you’re doing each little step. Once you accomplish each little thing. In a few months you realize you’ve got a company and a business. Something that’s really doable and can be successful.
That you do one little step instead of, some people they look at it and they would say, oh, to start a business you’d have to have money. Know how to market. Know how to do this and that. That you’ll get overwhelmed, and say, I can’t do it.
But if you just, what can I do today to move forward to the potential long goal that you’re trying to achieve. Then breaking it down inch by inch.
Deanne: I like that. What can I do today to move forward? I like that. That would be a good model. Some of our female audiences maybe struggling with their self image, and even in getting started with what their dreams are. What advice would you have for them?
Vonda: I say, you’ve got to search your heart, and allow yourself, like get a blank piece of paper, and write on it different things like, what would I like to accomplish. If there weren’t any obstacles like money, or age, or whatever you feel like I can’t do this because of that.
Take away all those obstacles, and just write the different things that would be something that you’d like. Whether it’s a successful marriage, or getting married, or having family, or getting so much in a paycheck. Whatever it is just write them down.
Once you do that, kind of like whole dream sheet page. Then you can kind of mark through the ones; cross off the ones that, this might be something that I’ll do later. But right now what do I really want to focus on. What’s important to me for this year. I like to look at 12 months. What do I want to accomplish in the next year.
So, then you focus on the couple of things; maybe three, four things that you really want to accomplish in the next 12 months. Is it attainable in the next 12 months? Even, maybe it’s a five year goal, but there’s something you can do in the next 12 months, to move yourself to that five year long time goal, and that what you’re working on.
It can be, I always break it down into the six categories of; it could be finances or education or business, your family, your social life and your health. Taking care of yourself and the relationships.
Deanne: I think that’s a really a good approach. I think this would also work for women who are trying to regroup and rebuild their lives just like you had to do? You know in having to start over again?
Vonda: Like for me, when I started my own company yes. I had to start all over again. But at the same time when I was a kid, I had parents. Not that they were bad or anything. They just weren’t great at wanting to be parents.
So, I had a mom who was not engaged and had her issues that she was dealing with. Then I had dad that was far way. He was an alcoholic and different things going on in his life. It gave me something to look at and say, I don’t want t o be like this.
So, I would pick out role models of the kind of people I did want to be. That’s what I would look at. Then that’s what I would try to start working on to be more like this type of a person.
I’m one of those people that I don’t believe that, the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree and you have to become what you’re accustomed to. Kind of like even if you were abused as a child that you’re abuser as an adult. I don’t believe that.
I believe we have the power to decide, either to learn from those kinds of things and change our lives. Or the easiest thing is just to duplicate what you’re used to, and not change. And kind of be lazy about it. But we do have the power to be able to change things.
Deanne: I think that’s really important. Excellent advice. I believe that strongly. Do you want to talk a little bit about your book? Your book is called the Success Against the Odds. Talk a little bit more about that?
Vonda: My book, I had radio show that was called Let’s Talk Success. Though that I got to interview a lot of very successful people that have gone from rags to riches. It was something that I’ve always admired in people. I like to learn from others how they achieve success. What made them successful.
So, from doing that radio show, I was able to meet a lot of interesting people, taking their stories, and incorporate them into my book. Which basically dealt with like risks, believing in yourself, dreaming big, having goals; written goals, the importance or written goals. Managing your money. Seizing the opportunity. Being kind to others and flip it, meaning taking a negative, and turning it into a positive.
Basically, kind of the secrets and the principles; that helped these people that I interviewed be successful. And have great lives professionally, and personally. It was something that I wanted to share with other people especially women and teens.
I believe you can’t have it all. You can’t find a way to balance and have successful career to choose and family life. And live the life that you want. Instead, taking the cards that you’re dealt, and making the best of it. And feeling that’s the best that it can be.
Deanne: I believe that. I mean I forget; who are some of the people that you interviewed through your book?
Vonda: I interviewed Mrs. Field for Mrs. Field Cookies, Rebecca Matthias, from Motherwork. She’s the founder. She owns the world’s largest maternity stores, to maternity works, and to motherhood. Her story was interesting because e she was an architect.
She got pregnant and couldn’t find any professional clothes to wear. So, designed a business suit for pregnant women, and decided to take an Ad out in the back of magazine.
She started with $7,000 in house and made a closet of clothes and got someone to sew for her things that she cut out. Now, she owns the world’s latest in maternity clothing store in the world.
So, here’s someone who saw a need that needed to be filled. Then just took it from one little suit, and kept building on it.
Deanne: Interesting. So, how do people get your book?
Vonda: You can go to www.SucessAgainsTheOdds.com, and order the book on there.
Deanne: Excellent. So, www.SucessAgainsTheOdds.com. I can’t believe that our time just bought up here. I would like to thank for coming on Today’s Aspiring Women
Vonda: Thank you for having me. I’ve enjoyed it. I hope that women do get inspired, and realize that there are capable of so much. That they have the opportunities that we’re lucky to have so much available to us.
Sometimes, even when you’re struggling, if you look at the positive, and realize you’ve got great strength inside of you. You can change your life. You can make your life the life that you want it to be. It won’t be easy but at the same time it’s possible. You can definitely have the life that you want.
Deanne: That’s excellent. Well, stay tuned we’re going to take a short break. After the short break we’ll been learning more about who to burn barriers. This is Deanne de Marco in Today’s Inspiring Women. Talk to you in a few minutes.
Second Guest: Karen Moulder
Welcome back. You’re listening to Deanne DeMarco with Today’s Inspiring Women. My guest this second half is Karen Moulder.
Karen entered a man’s world when few women did so. A lifetime of breaking personal, and professional barriers was epitomized by getting hired in 1983, as the first female member of the Brownsville, Texas Fire Department.
She says that her tom boyish nature and her single mother’s status led her to this fascinating, and dangerous career which lasted 10 years. A serious car accident brought Karen’s life as a firefighter to an end, but launched her into a whole new direction.
She went back to college, and majored in business. After college, she managed a physician’s office, and obtained her certification in medical billing.
After that, she moved to Massachusetts and started her own medical billing company. Karen wrote the book Burning Barriers to share her life story and encourage other women to pursue their dreams.
Welcome Karen to Today’s Inspiring Women.
Karen: Thank you for having me.
Deanne: I’m just fascinated that you were a firefighter. What made you decide to become a firefighter?
Karen: Well it’s not something that I had a lifelong dream of doing. Basically I found myself being a single mother and needing a job. Like you said my tom boyish nature, they had an ad in the paper that said, they were looking for women to come into this department.
So I said I’m going to give it a try, because it offered great hours and great pay. I’d be able to have more time to spend with my kids. Of course I really didn’t think about the dangers that were involved.
Deanne: The training had to be grueling?
Karen: Yeah. It’s funny because the trainees go through quite a bit of training when they become a firefighter. Being that I was the first female, I actually got a lot more training than most men.
I didn’t find that out actually until I got on shift when they were like, we didn’t get to do that. I just counted my blessings that I was better trained than they were.
Deanne: Trained in what way?
Karen: They trained us in oil pit fires and gas tank fires. They trained us on the Jaws of Life. That one was very demanding, because it’s a very big heavy piece of equipment. I was able to do it, hold it up and tear off the door. I got through that. We went through water rescue and repelling for a rescue. It was a lot I went through.
Deanne: What are some of the obstacles that you encountered by being the only woman in an all male fire department?
Karen: When I first came on, when I first was hired they told me, you’re going to be the first. There’s going to be all this press coverage. There was going to be changes that were going to be made. Actually I was going to go through a lot more than most people would.
They said, they were going to make changes and some of the changes they said that would be made would be more privacy, because it was a 24 hour shift.
Pretty much the only thing they did, and I don't think they did it until the day I showed up on shift work, was to put locks on the bathroom door.
They said they were going to issue us t-shirts, and shorts to wear, when we stayed overnight. That never happened. There was that and having to deal with the attitude, I think was the biggest obstacle.
Deanne: I would think that there would be a lot of almost animosity.
Karen: Yes. I live in South Texas, close to the Mexico border. The attitude down there is that a woman doing the same macho male job that they’re doing, it’s a threat to their manhood. To say that a woman could actually do that type of work.
Deanne: So what were some of the funniest moments in your career as a firefighter?
Karen: I think the funniest time in my career was, I was a driver at the time and we were going to a house fire. When I arrived at the scene I couldn’t park the truck. There was police office that got there before us and he parked his police vehicle right in the way which deterred us from doing our job.
I parked my truck, got off. He was nowhere to be found. The keys were still in the car, so I got in the car, I pulled the car around the corner of the street and left it over there. Then I pulled the truck up and we started working.
I tell you the look on that officer’s face when he came walking around and not seeing his police car, was priceless. His police car was gone. It was really funny.
Deanne: Was it supposed to be there?
Karen: No it wasn’t. They’re supposed to show up for crowd control and stuff like that. When they show up to a scene and they are interfering with our job it makes it difficult.
Deanne: Sure. What about the scariest moment in your career as a firefighter?
Karen: Scariest moment would have to be a 4th of July fire. Apparently somebody was doing fireworks out by the Port of Brownsville, which caught a warehouse on fire. This warehouse was housing a tanker truck, a fuel tanker truck inside of it.
We were first on the scene and basically I was standing about 20, 25 feet away from it putting water on it to keep it cool while they tried to get it out. Apparently they had been working on the brakes, so they were having difficulty getting it out.
They blocked out the highway a mile in each direction just in case it exploded. I’m sitting here 25 feet away. At first I’m doing my job. Then my mind starts thinking about it; if this thing blows up, they’re not going to find my body.
It was a pretty scary moment, but yet it was also kind of funny too because I’m not saying anything about marines or anything like this. But we had an ex marine firefighter, who basically was climbing the fence saying we’re all going to die.
Deanne: Oh my goodness.
Karen: That’s how scary it was.
Deanne: Oh my goodness. I don't think I’d like to hear that.
Karen: There are some pretty scary moments.
Deanne: I would think, when we spoke earlier, you made a mention about your accident that you were in. Since you had your experience as a firefighter, and then you were in this accident, you almost knew too much, I think, right?
Karen: Yeah.
Deanne: Tell our audience about that accident.
Karen: Yeah, it’s totally different. You have a totally different perspective. I was basically, you know how they say most accidents happen within a block from your house? Well, I was turning on my street, from a busy street.
A delivery truck was trying to pass me at the same time. I was turning left and he was trying to pass me at the same time. He was going about 50 miles an hour on the street. I had my two youngest children with me.
We collided twice. My car ended up in the ditch his ended up going over the ditch between two trees. He was lucky he landed between two trees and probably about five feet from hitting a house.
It was pretty scary to know that I’m in this car, in this accident with my kids, trying to figure out how to get them out. You’re in pain. It’s scary.
Deanne: You had to be rescued, right?
Karen: Yeah. Actually the fire department came. They helped me and the kids out, which we ended up going to the hospital. Later on found out that I had a ruptured disk in my back. The car I was driving was a standard. So I had my foot on the brake and the clutch. It ruptured my disk in my back. That basically ended my career as a firefighter.
Deanne: I would think, with all that experience, to actually now be the person who has to be rescued rather than the person who is rescuing others. I think my head would just go through all these different scenarios of what could be wrong and what I need to do.
Karen: Well, you know it’s funny because you would think that that would be the case. Honestly you’re in a place of just any other person. That you’ve just been in an accident, you’re confused.
You’re not really thinking about too much of the rescue part of it. You’re just thinking about my kids. Are they okay? Are we okay? How am I going to get out?
Deanne: To me it was just devastating when you were talking about that. I was just thinking how scary that would be.
Karen: Yeah it is. It is scary to be in a car accident. I think you’re right, it is a little scarier; because of the accidents that I had to go to while I was a firefighter. I think I’ve seen more than my share of deaths and injuries that will last a lifetime.
Deanne: You know we’re going to have to take a quick break here. When we return we’re going to be taking a little bit more about Burning Barriers. I want to hear a little bit more about your book, and other advice that you might give to women who want to enter a traditionally male job.
Karen: Okay.
Deanne: All right. So when we return, we’ll talk a little bit more. This is Deanna DeMarco with Today’s Inspiring Women hang on we’ll be right back.
Welcome back this is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women. We are talking to Karen Moulder, one of the first firefighter in Texas.
Karen tells us a little bit more about what advice you might give women who want to enter a profession, that’s traditionally a male type of profession like you did?
Karen: I’m going to say that my advice is one, be sure you can handle it. No matter how much we advance, there is always going to be some man out there who is not accepting a women doing that type of job. Or that same type of job that they’re doing.
First of all you need to be aware that, that would come up and whether you could handle it or not. Second, if that’s what you want to do, I say go for it.
Deanne: So when you say handle it, I think your meaning both emotionally as well as physically?
Karen: Yeah. Most people think firefighting as a really strenuous job which it is. If you are a very good problem solver you can get away or you can get around not having to use so much physical strength if you’re smarter.
Take for instance when I came in, they gave me a hard time, because on the truck they have these big huge heavy suction hoses that are like positioned very high on the truck.
They were giving me a hard time saying, oh you can't get that down if we had to use it. I’m like, really? Watch me. I climb up on the truck, I unclamped it, kicked it off with my feet. Got down off the truck, dragged it over to the truck and connected it.
I don't have to be tall muscled strong person to pull that thing down off of the truck, I use my intelligent part of my brain and problem solving, and did it that way.
It’s that and you can expect some harassment as well. I went though harassment while I was in there. I think that is probably the more difficult thing to handle. Over the physical is the harassment you will receive.
Deanne: Even though we have the laws in place, I still think it’s probably going to happen. How did you deal with that?
Karen: It’s hard because the fire department is set up like a military style. Basically you have to follow orders, whether there are unjust or not and then file a grievance. That’s the way they handle it.
Now there were sometimes that they would order me to do things that to me endangered lives or endangered my life. I refused to do it, and then I would handle it.
When you’re in a fire truck, whether you’re driving to a scene or back from a scene, you have to follow the laws of the street. The lights and everything. On the way over there, you can go through the lights as long as the traffic gives you the right of way. On the way back you have to follow the laws just like anyone else.
Sometimes we would get calls late at night and they would say, just drive though the lights, I’m like, no. What is a car come speeding through and I didn’t see it, I went through the light.
Deanne: Sure.
Karen: There are things that and they would tell me to go aganist the law that I wouldn’t do.
Deanne: So you really have to be on your toes?
Karen: Yeah. You have to know when to pick you battles too. There’re just plenty of battles going into a job where it’s all male. You have to pick. I just wanted to go to work like everybody else and just do my job, because I enjoyed it. To have to deal with somebody who’s making your life miserable, it’s tough.
Deanne: Some of the toughness I think that you’ve got as a firefighter, because I think that probably sets you up in a mindset of being able to just accomplish almost anything that you’ve put your mind to.
Karen: Yeah that’s got to be part of your nature too, is wanting to accomplish your goals and not let anything get to you. Although it will get to you at times. You just have to set your mind to it.
I think it did shape me as a person in how to handle things in life. Women being a little bit more emotional than men, we tend to tear up a little easier than men do. I was accused multiple times of crying to get my way. I had to learn how to turn my tears off, not to cry.
Deanne: It’s really meant for toughness.
Karen: It is tough. Especially when you’re in emotional situations. When you’re at an accident scene and you’re seeing people injured it’s tough.
Deanne: Yeah. With that background is that what led you to open up your own? You did jump from firefighting into being an entrepreneur and opening up your own medical billing company.
Karen: Yeah, I went to college and I got my business degree. A friend to mine was married to a doctor. I went in to just start helping them, and I’m a very organized person. It just kind of like went one thing to another. I got into managing the doctor’s office and I got my certification in medical billing.
I eventually moved up to Massachusetts, because my daughter is up here. After several jobs I ended up opening my own business. I set my mind to doing it, and I think I set my mind to doing it. Within six months I had my first client.
Deanne: Wow! I just think that’s exciting. I would like to talk a little bit about your book Burning Barriers. What made you decide to write that book?
Karen: Basically when people would find out that I was fire fighter and I would tell them stories. Sometimes not just stories about the firefighting, but things that happen in my life; people would just tell me all the time, you’ve got to write a book. Sit down and write these things down.
I never thought that I could sit down and write a whole book. I found a girl that helped me with it and get it structured. It took me about three years to do it.
It’s not an easy thing sitting down and writing a book. You hear somebody; they’re sitting down and popping out a book every year. I don't know honestly how they do that. It’s very tough, of course I have a full time job and I have five kids. They’re not all at home, but I still have a life and not just writing books.
Deanne: Sure. So who do you think your book will appeal to?
Karen: I think it will appeal to a lot of people. Mainly women who are looking into that, getting into that type of job. The book also talks about the situations that I got into. Becoming pregnant in the fire department, and losing my job.
The resources are out there. I was so naïve I didn’t know what resources I could get, when I got myself in that situation. I think the book is really helpful in that sense to younger women who don't know where to look and what to do.
It would also, I would guess, appeal to women who might want to pursue a job in a traditionally male role. Then again there could be the people who are just interested in what it takes to become a firefighter.
Deanne: Right. I think your book really could help people, not only if they’re looking for a career in firefighting, but also in looking at a career in a male dominated or traditional male job.
Karen: Yeah, it does and it helps them see what kind of things could happen. How you could handle it when that does happen.
Deanne: I think that’s just really very interesting. What are some the resources that would be available for women?
Karen: They have now, for women firefighters, there is an online website. Honestly I can't think of it right now, but there is one for women firefighters. I think its international association for women firefighters. I think that’s what it is; I’m not 100% sure, if you want to do that.
My book talks about going and getting assistance from the government, when you find yourself in a situation where you need help. It talks about paying an attorney, because I did have to file with EOC because of the harassment that I got. It talks about all that stuff. What your rights are and where to go find help and everything. It covers a lot of that kind of things.
Deanne: It sounds like a good resource book as well. Very interesting story as well.
Karen: Yes.
Deanne: How do people get hold of your book?
Karen: You can find it on Amazon; you can find it on BarnesandNoble.com and Author House. I’m assuming that any other bookstore if you request it they can get it for you.
Karen: Wonderful. How do people contact you?
Deanne: Basically I’m more on Facebook, but I do have a website BurningBarries.com. I also have Facebook page for Burning Barriers. I’ll answer any questions there.
Deanne: The thing that’s really interesting is if the audience goes to your Burning Barriers website, they will actually see you in full firemen garment holding a hose putting out a fire.
Karen: Yes. That was a major fire too. That was a major fire, three story building burnt to the ground.
Deanne: I just happen to like that photo.
Karen: That’s one of my favorites.
Deanne: Well our time is just about up here. Karen I’d like to thank you for being on Today's Inspiring Women.
Karen: Thank you for having me.
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Today I’d like to leave you with a quote from George Bernard Shaw. George Bernard Shaw says, you see things; and you say, 'Why?' But I dream things that never were; and I say, ‘Why not?’ Which I think fits our session today perfectly.
This is Deanne DeMarco, until next time, have a wonderful week
Guests: Vonda White, CEO, Collegiate Risk Management
Karen Moulder, Owner/Billing Manager at Claim Check Billing Service. Author; Burning Barriers.
Deanne: Welcome to Today’s Inspiring Women. I’m your host Deanne DeMarco. If you’re interested in becoming a sponsor for this show give us a call at 708-836-0118. We have a number of sponsorship opportunities that will fit all budgets.
If you’re ready to take the next steps to become empowered, motivated, and better equipped for success, then stay tuned.
Today, my first guest is Vonda White. Vonda is an entrepreneur and author. Vonda White will be sharing her remarkable life story from her days as a food stamp child.
Vonda’s life today is a far cry from her childhood, raised by a divorced mom who had to accept welfare and food stamps. Young Vonda’s contribution to the family finances was collecting, and redeeming empty soda cans.
As a teenager, her third attempt she won the Idaho state beauty pageant. The triumph came with college tuition and the beginning of a new life, which led her into a record-setting insurance sales career. And the launch of her own business, while being six months pregnant.
Vonda White, founder and CEO of Collegiate Risk Management. A company providing health, and accident insurance to thousands of students nationwide.
She has received numerous awards for her business achievements. She is author of Success Against the Odds. We‘d like to welcome Vonda to Today’s Inspiring Women. Welcome Vonda.
Vonda: Thank you. I’m glad to be on your show.
Deanne: You have just got a remarkable background. From being raised on food stamps to a millionaire. Please share with us some of those steps that you took, and how you became successful.
Vonda: When I was a kid I knew that; especially when I was in college, I felt that there was this person inside that wanted to get out, and knew that I could be successful.
It’s funny like, if you ever watch TV, and you see all these shows on about real estate or different things that make people rich. I would watch them and think, that could be me. I think I’d have that in me.
What I really did that made a difference in my life is that I allowed myself first to take risk. I allowed myself to dream.
A lot of people when you don’t have a lot, they think they don’t deserve it or they can’t get it. So, they basically believe that this is their life. They’ll just accept it. With me I didn’t do.
I decided, for example; when I was 14, I wanted to enter a teen pageant. That year I entered, I didn’t win anything at all. There were 50 girls. I had the desire to someday hold that title. Because I really admired the girls that was the past queen. Then the new one they nominated and picked.
I wanted to be like them. So I set goals. So, what does it take to win this title? What are they looking for? I knew I had to improve my grades. Be in leadership positions. Run for different offices. Really build a resume, and be the best person that I could be.
So, for the next year that’s what I worked on. On a really daily basis. Getting involved in community service work etcetera. Then from doing all of that I reentered the next year. I became second runner-up. Which was a huge accomplishment, but there was less girls that were competing that year. Second place still wasn’t good enough.
A lot of times what people do is, like what we talked about people give up. They quit when they get discouraged, and they get so close. Because you could do worse. That’s scary too thinking, this year I got second. The next year; I might try again, and maybe I won’t place at all.
But I decided the very next day, what were my weaknesses. What could I have done better? I was always looking at constructive criticism, and things that I could improve upon.
For the next two years that what I did. I improved upon those areas. I tried again my third, and last time that I could actually compete in the pageant, because of my age. That year I ended up winning it. There was like 52 girls competing.
I really didn’t think I could. I remember that day I broke down in the lobby. There’s was family I babysat for that believed in me. And helped, encouraged me to believe in myself. They helped me to get the sponsors, and everything. They came to see me.
I remember I was just crying. Then I said, I want this so bad. I’ve worked four years of my life to win this. Now with all these girls. They’re really strong competitors. I don’t think I can win it.
Jim said, “Vonda. This is a stepping stone to bigger and the better things. You go out there, and you believe you’ve already won that title. You go out with confidence and act like it. Whatever happens, happens, but you’ve got a good of a chance or better than anyone. You need to believe that you’ve already won it.”
So, that’s what I did. Then I ended winning the title. It literally changed my life.
Deanne: That’s every interesting. I think you said a couple of really important things here. One is that you looked at your weakness. Then you took action on those to improve.
Vonda: Yes. I do that to this day. I think we all should that.
Deanne: I couldn’t agree more. I think that there are so many people who want to just brush their weakness underneath the carpet. Like cover it up, and pretend they are not there.
Vonda: Right.
Deanne: I think; it’s tough to get that criticism that says, you need to improve in these areas.
Vonda: Right. The other thing is a lot of times people will make excuse for their weaknesses. And act like, well I can’t change it. That’s just who I am, either accept it or not. But the truth is we all have the possibility to improve our lives, to change.
And really to create the life that we want to live. We’re in control, instead of it controlling us. That mind frame helps to change who you are, and your circumstances.
Deanne: I absolutely believe that 100%. I think that was an important piece that you just made a comment on. The second one is that you were given advice to believe. To believe like you had already won it. I think, another important piece is to really believe that you can do it.
Vonda: It’s like sometimes you read about, they say dress for success. Like dress for the look, and behave the way that you want to be seen. Then it might seem foreign in that person and you might feel like actor, but pretty soon that becomes you are.
So, you act your way into something. If it’s not what you’re comfortable with or it’s different. So, for example; someone who’s a waitress, who’s never been in a professional environment. But they want to be a professional.
You start dressing part of being a professional person. Wear your hair, makeup, dress and create that you’re professional. People will start believing, looking, and embracing that you‘re a professional. Just things like that make a big difference in how we’re perceived, and also our own self confidence.
Deanne: I have to believe that a lot. The other thing that I thought was interesting is that man. Was it Jim you said?
Vonda: Yes, Jim Halley.
Deanne: He also said that no matter what, this will be a stepping stone for you.
Vonda: Right. The lesson with that is, no failure, is not a failure. It’s not something to be ashamed of. Or to think, oh I’m so embarrassed. Look how bad I did. It more; look what I did do and embrace it. Realize it’s a stepping stone to bigger, and better things.
It’s just like anybody who’s gotten great success. I mean if you look at a Donald Trump. He’s been bankrupt. He lost a lot of money at times. But he still allowed himself to take the risk and do things.
The same with Babe Ruth or any athlete, they’ve had more strikeouts than home runs. But if you keep hitting for the home you can still do world records, even though your strikeouts are more.
So you, anybody who‘s successful had failures, but they let the failures define them. They allow the failures to be the stepping stones to help them to be better, to learn from, and to move forward.
Deanne: I think that’s an excellent advice. I think it’s interesting when you go out college. You went into the insurance industry right in sales?
Vonda: Right in south. I was president. I ran for President for the Student Government at college in my junior year. I became president for two years in college. That allowed me to work on the other side of an insurance company.
When I graduated I had my foot in the door in order to get an interview with them. When they gave the interview, it didn’t go so well. There were two owners. One was really positive. One was really negative. He wouldn’t let me answer any questions and different things. When I left, I thought I’m not sure I want to work for me at all.
Then I went home to Idaho. This is in Florida where I interviewed. I went home to Idaho and no one was knocking on my door to give me a job. So, three months, which I know is really late, but I wrote them a thank you letter. I answered all the questions that Mr. Parker had asked me. That he didn’t let me answer.
I told him, I graduated with honors from college. I financially put myself through college. I did all these stuff with good grades etcetera, while holding a lot of leadership positions.
Then I said, I know I can be the best saleswoman your company has ever had, if you give the opportunity, and I believe in it so much, that I‘ll work for free for six months to prove it to you.
Why they hired is because I had the gumption to get their attention which I learned from a book I read from Norman Vincent Peale about, in the Depression, when jobs are so hard to come by.
There’s was job opening at the movie theatre. So the guy at the very end of the line had sent a note up that said, don’t hire anyone until you’ve interviewed me. I thought, I need to do something like that to grab their attention.
So, by offering to work for free showed I was serious, and would do my best. If it didn’t work, they could fire me and no harm, no foul. Actually that got my foot in the door.
When I got the job, I really worked my tail off to show them that they had made a good decision. They didn’t make me work for free. They gave me a good starting income, a car allowance. I never would’ve got that job if I hadn’t made that offer.
Deanne: And then, you set the sales records right?
Vonda: Yes. I became the second top sales person in the company. At the age of 27, I was promoted to Vice President of the company and Vice President of Sales. I had done really well at a young age. I was making really good money.
When I was like 30, either 30 or 31, and I’ve gotten married. I decided to resign, give up this great career with my savings, and 401, all the safety nets basically.
But I wasn’t happy in the environment. So I decided to quit and start my own company competing. I took a risk which was a huge risk, because, I could’ve failed, and not done well on my own. Have a hard time ever getting a job as good as I had.
But I knew that if I could work hard for someone, how much harder could I work for myself. I decided to take the risk. I did it. Within a year I knew I had made the right decision.
Deanne: That is great. I’d like to hear more. We have to take a break away, for a short break now. When we come back I want to talk a little bit more about your whole model, persistence and self image in goal setting.
But right now we need to take a break. So, stay tuned. After the break we’ll come back with Vonda White. This is Deanne De Marco with Today’s Aspiring Women.
Welcome back. This is Deanne De Marco. We’re talking with Vonda White, who’s gone from food stamps to millionaire.
Just before our break we talked a little bit about being persistent in your dreams, and about self image. We did touch a little bit about goal setting. Could you tell us little bit more about your personal models around persistence, self imaging and goal setting?
Vonda: The first thing I think that’s really important is to have written goals. A lot of people say that they have goals. But they don’t have it written down on paper. If you ask them, what are your goals? What are your specific goals? They wouldn’t be able to tell you.
In life; if you really have a goal, it’s something that you know that you’re working on. You’re working on it usually every day, a little bit. And it’s something that you see progress. You have deadline of when you want to get that accomplished.
So with my life, that’s what’s I’ve always done. Every year I set my goals. I’m working towards them, and by the end of the year I can see what goals I have accomplished. Which ones I need to spend a little bit more time on to get finished and get accomplished.
But through that you really do start accumulating your accomplishments. You realize that you can do so much. But most of us we have dreams in our head. There are things that we want to do, but they are not written. We don’t have the game plan how we’re going to get to it.
So, we really don’t get it accomplished or it takes a lot longer. You are all over the place. Sometimes you’re going after one thing. Then you get sidetracked.
You’re more focused if you’ve written goals. You have it done to where you know what you steps are each week, each month. That’s going to move you closer to getting that goal accomplished.
Deanne: So that would sound to me like; you are writing goals, and making sure that those goals are attainable goals.
Vonda: Yeah. A lot of time when you set a goal you hope that, and you think it’s attainable. But sometimes you’ll doubt, well maybe I can’t do this. But it’s okay to have goals that are lofty.
Like for example; would I ever have thought that I could run a very successful business and do what I do. I probably wouldn’t have thought that back then. But I decided that I’m going to start a company, and do this for myself. So, that was one goal.
But a lot of times, its okay to push yourself, and be bigger than you think you are able to do. At the same time you have to break it down. Like for example, if they want to lose 100 pounds. Then you’ve got to figure out, okay how many is that a week and a month realistically that you could honestly lose.
Because, if you say I’m going to lose 100 pounds in one month, you’re going to be disappointed. Because nobody’s going to be able to lose 100 pounds in one month. They need to be realistic, that it’s something that you actually can do if you put the time effort and focus on it.
But at the same time; like you take Debbie Fields who I featured in my book, from Mrs. Field Cookies. She just wanted to open a little cookie store and sell her cookies because she loved baking. But she ended up owning 3,600 franchises.
She franchised it; but at the beginning she wasn’t looking to be that big. You’ve got to allow yourself some time to think. It could be more than just one store, but right now I’m only going to just focus on doing one store.
Deanne: Then measure your success around that it is a goal that’s actually attainable at that time.
Vonda: Right. Once you hit the one, if I ‘m trying to lose 10 pound in a week. Which is possibly, depending on how much you have to lose etcetera that could be achievable. Then you hit that mark. Then you move to the next mark for the month or the next week.
Deanne: Excellent. I think that’s really good advice. I kind of think that the whole written goals is really important to making sure, that goal that you’re written down is attainable for right here and now.
I mean losing 100 pounds is great, but it wouldn’t be realistic to try to do that in one month. So be realistic about it. Break that down in smaller pieces. So, that you can actually measure your success.
Vonda: Right it’s kind of like Robert Schuller of the Crystal Cathedral Church in California. He always says, inch by inch, anything is a cinch. That’s true. No matter what your goal, if you break that big goal down to little steps. So, you’re accomplishing little things first. It is attainable.
Like even with me, starting a business, I didn’t know what was all included in starting your own business. When I started it every day I need to do something to move myself closer to have a successful company. The first thing is like contacting a lawyer.
The second thing is getting a logo made. The third thing is getting stationary and marketing pieces and on and on. As you’re doing each little step. Once you accomplish each little thing. In a few months you realize you’ve got a company and a business. Something that’s really doable and can be successful.
That you do one little step instead of, some people they look at it and they would say, oh, to start a business you’d have to have money. Know how to market. Know how to do this and that. That you’ll get overwhelmed, and say, I can’t do it.
But if you just, what can I do today to move forward to the potential long goal that you’re trying to achieve. Then breaking it down inch by inch.
Deanne: I like that. What can I do today to move forward? I like that. That would be a good model. Some of our female audiences maybe struggling with their self image, and even in getting started with what their dreams are. What advice would you have for them?
Vonda: I say, you’ve got to search your heart, and allow yourself, like get a blank piece of paper, and write on it different things like, what would I like to accomplish. If there weren’t any obstacles like money, or age, or whatever you feel like I can’t do this because of that.
Take away all those obstacles, and just write the different things that would be something that you’d like. Whether it’s a successful marriage, or getting married, or having family, or getting so much in a paycheck. Whatever it is just write them down.
Once you do that, kind of like whole dream sheet page. Then you can kind of mark through the ones; cross off the ones that, this might be something that I’ll do later. But right now what do I really want to focus on. What’s important to me for this year. I like to look at 12 months. What do I want to accomplish in the next year.
So, then you focus on the couple of things; maybe three, four things that you really want to accomplish in the next 12 months. Is it attainable in the next 12 months? Even, maybe it’s a five year goal, but there’s something you can do in the next 12 months, to move yourself to that five year long time goal, and that what you’re working on.
It can be, I always break it down into the six categories of; it could be finances or education or business, your family, your social life and your health. Taking care of yourself and the relationships.
Deanne: I think that’s a really a good approach. I think this would also work for women who are trying to regroup and rebuild their lives just like you had to do? You know in having to start over again?
Vonda: Like for me, when I started my own company yes. I had to start all over again. But at the same time when I was a kid, I had parents. Not that they were bad or anything. They just weren’t great at wanting to be parents.
So, I had a mom who was not engaged and had her issues that she was dealing with. Then I had dad that was far way. He was an alcoholic and different things going on in his life. It gave me something to look at and say, I don’t want t o be like this.
So, I would pick out role models of the kind of people I did want to be. That’s what I would look at. Then that’s what I would try to start working on to be more like this type of a person.
I’m one of those people that I don’t believe that, the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree and you have to become what you’re accustomed to. Kind of like even if you were abused as a child that you’re abuser as an adult. I don’t believe that.
I believe we have the power to decide, either to learn from those kinds of things and change our lives. Or the easiest thing is just to duplicate what you’re used to, and not change. And kind of be lazy about it. But we do have the power to be able to change things.
Deanne: I think that’s really important. Excellent advice. I believe that strongly. Do you want to talk a little bit about your book? Your book is called the Success Against the Odds. Talk a little bit more about that?
Vonda: My book, I had radio show that was called Let’s Talk Success. Though that I got to interview a lot of very successful people that have gone from rags to riches. It was something that I’ve always admired in people. I like to learn from others how they achieve success. What made them successful.
So, from doing that radio show, I was able to meet a lot of interesting people, taking their stories, and incorporate them into my book. Which basically dealt with like risks, believing in yourself, dreaming big, having goals; written goals, the importance or written goals. Managing your money. Seizing the opportunity. Being kind to others and flip it, meaning taking a negative, and turning it into a positive.
Basically, kind of the secrets and the principles; that helped these people that I interviewed be successful. And have great lives professionally, and personally. It was something that I wanted to share with other people especially women and teens.
I believe you can’t have it all. You can’t find a way to balance and have successful career to choose and family life. And live the life that you want. Instead, taking the cards that you’re dealt, and making the best of it. And feeling that’s the best that it can be.
Deanne: I believe that. I mean I forget; who are some of the people that you interviewed through your book?
Vonda: I interviewed Mrs. Field for Mrs. Field Cookies, Rebecca Matthias, from Motherwork. She’s the founder. She owns the world’s largest maternity stores, to maternity works, and to motherhood. Her story was interesting because e she was an architect.
She got pregnant and couldn’t find any professional clothes to wear. So, designed a business suit for pregnant women, and decided to take an Ad out in the back of magazine.
She started with $7,000 in house and made a closet of clothes and got someone to sew for her things that she cut out. Now, she owns the world’s latest in maternity clothing store in the world.
So, here’s someone who saw a need that needed to be filled. Then just took it from one little suit, and kept building on it.
Deanne: Interesting. So, how do people get your book?
Vonda: You can go to www.SucessAgainsTheOdds.com, and order the book on there.
Deanne: Excellent. So, www.SucessAgainsTheOdds.com. I can’t believe that our time just bought up here. I would like to thank for coming on Today’s Aspiring Women
Vonda: Thank you for having me. I’ve enjoyed it. I hope that women do get inspired, and realize that there are capable of so much. That they have the opportunities that we’re lucky to have so much available to us.
Sometimes, even when you’re struggling, if you look at the positive, and realize you’ve got great strength inside of you. You can change your life. You can make your life the life that you want it to be. It won’t be easy but at the same time it’s possible. You can definitely have the life that you want.
Deanne: That’s excellent. Well, stay tuned we’re going to take a short break. After the short break we’ll been learning more about who to burn barriers. This is Deanne de Marco in Today’s Inspiring Women. Talk to you in a few minutes.
Second Guest: Karen Moulder
Welcome back. You’re listening to Deanne DeMarco with Today’s Inspiring Women. My guest this second half is Karen Moulder.
Karen entered a man’s world when few women did so. A lifetime of breaking personal, and professional barriers was epitomized by getting hired in 1983, as the first female member of the Brownsville, Texas Fire Department.
She says that her tom boyish nature and her single mother’s status led her to this fascinating, and dangerous career which lasted 10 years. A serious car accident brought Karen’s life as a firefighter to an end, but launched her into a whole new direction.
She went back to college, and majored in business. After college, she managed a physician’s office, and obtained her certification in medical billing.
After that, she moved to Massachusetts and started her own medical billing company. Karen wrote the book Burning Barriers to share her life story and encourage other women to pursue their dreams.
Welcome Karen to Today’s Inspiring Women.
Karen: Thank you for having me.
Deanne: I’m just fascinated that you were a firefighter. What made you decide to become a firefighter?
Karen: Well it’s not something that I had a lifelong dream of doing. Basically I found myself being a single mother and needing a job. Like you said my tom boyish nature, they had an ad in the paper that said, they were looking for women to come into this department.
So I said I’m going to give it a try, because it offered great hours and great pay. I’d be able to have more time to spend with my kids. Of course I really didn’t think about the dangers that were involved.
Deanne: The training had to be grueling?
Karen: Yeah. It’s funny because the trainees go through quite a bit of training when they become a firefighter. Being that I was the first female, I actually got a lot more training than most men.
I didn’t find that out actually until I got on shift when they were like, we didn’t get to do that. I just counted my blessings that I was better trained than they were.
Deanne: Trained in what way?
Karen: They trained us in oil pit fires and gas tank fires. They trained us on the Jaws of Life. That one was very demanding, because it’s a very big heavy piece of equipment. I was able to do it, hold it up and tear off the door. I got through that. We went through water rescue and repelling for a rescue. It was a lot I went through.
Deanne: What are some of the obstacles that you encountered by being the only woman in an all male fire department?
Karen: When I first came on, when I first was hired they told me, you’re going to be the first. There’s going to be all this press coverage. There was going to be changes that were going to be made. Actually I was going to go through a lot more than most people would.
They said, they were going to make changes and some of the changes they said that would be made would be more privacy, because it was a 24 hour shift.
Pretty much the only thing they did, and I don't think they did it until the day I showed up on shift work, was to put locks on the bathroom door.
They said they were going to issue us t-shirts, and shorts to wear, when we stayed overnight. That never happened. There was that and having to deal with the attitude, I think was the biggest obstacle.
Deanne: I would think that there would be a lot of almost animosity.
Karen: Yes. I live in South Texas, close to the Mexico border. The attitude down there is that a woman doing the same macho male job that they’re doing, it’s a threat to their manhood. To say that a woman could actually do that type of work.
Deanne: So what were some of the funniest moments in your career as a firefighter?
Karen: I think the funniest time in my career was, I was a driver at the time and we were going to a house fire. When I arrived at the scene I couldn’t park the truck. There was police office that got there before us and he parked his police vehicle right in the way which deterred us from doing our job.
I parked my truck, got off. He was nowhere to be found. The keys were still in the car, so I got in the car, I pulled the car around the corner of the street and left it over there. Then I pulled the truck up and we started working.
I tell you the look on that officer’s face when he came walking around and not seeing his police car, was priceless. His police car was gone. It was really funny.
Deanne: Was it supposed to be there?
Karen: No it wasn’t. They’re supposed to show up for crowd control and stuff like that. When they show up to a scene and they are interfering with our job it makes it difficult.
Deanne: Sure. What about the scariest moment in your career as a firefighter?
Karen: Scariest moment would have to be a 4th of July fire. Apparently somebody was doing fireworks out by the Port of Brownsville, which caught a warehouse on fire. This warehouse was housing a tanker truck, a fuel tanker truck inside of it.
We were first on the scene and basically I was standing about 20, 25 feet away from it putting water on it to keep it cool while they tried to get it out. Apparently they had been working on the brakes, so they were having difficulty getting it out.
They blocked out the highway a mile in each direction just in case it exploded. I’m sitting here 25 feet away. At first I’m doing my job. Then my mind starts thinking about it; if this thing blows up, they’re not going to find my body.
It was a pretty scary moment, but yet it was also kind of funny too because I’m not saying anything about marines or anything like this. But we had an ex marine firefighter, who basically was climbing the fence saying we’re all going to die.
Deanne: Oh my goodness.
Karen: That’s how scary it was.
Deanne: Oh my goodness. I don't think I’d like to hear that.
Karen: There are some pretty scary moments.
Deanne: I would think, when we spoke earlier, you made a mention about your accident that you were in. Since you had your experience as a firefighter, and then you were in this accident, you almost knew too much, I think, right?
Karen: Yeah.
Deanne: Tell our audience about that accident.
Karen: Yeah, it’s totally different. You have a totally different perspective. I was basically, you know how they say most accidents happen within a block from your house? Well, I was turning on my street, from a busy street.
A delivery truck was trying to pass me at the same time. I was turning left and he was trying to pass me at the same time. He was going about 50 miles an hour on the street. I had my two youngest children with me.
We collided twice. My car ended up in the ditch his ended up going over the ditch between two trees. He was lucky he landed between two trees and probably about five feet from hitting a house.
It was pretty scary to know that I’m in this car, in this accident with my kids, trying to figure out how to get them out. You’re in pain. It’s scary.
Deanne: You had to be rescued, right?
Karen: Yeah. Actually the fire department came. They helped me and the kids out, which we ended up going to the hospital. Later on found out that I had a ruptured disk in my back. The car I was driving was a standard. So I had my foot on the brake and the clutch. It ruptured my disk in my back. That basically ended my career as a firefighter.
Deanne: I would think, with all that experience, to actually now be the person who has to be rescued rather than the person who is rescuing others. I think my head would just go through all these different scenarios of what could be wrong and what I need to do.
Karen: Well, you know it’s funny because you would think that that would be the case. Honestly you’re in a place of just any other person. That you’ve just been in an accident, you’re confused.
You’re not really thinking about too much of the rescue part of it. You’re just thinking about my kids. Are they okay? Are we okay? How am I going to get out?
Deanne: To me it was just devastating when you were talking about that. I was just thinking how scary that would be.
Karen: Yeah it is. It is scary to be in a car accident. I think you’re right, it is a little scarier; because of the accidents that I had to go to while I was a firefighter. I think I’ve seen more than my share of deaths and injuries that will last a lifetime.
Deanne: You know we’re going to have to take a quick break here. When we return we’re going to be taking a little bit more about Burning Barriers. I want to hear a little bit more about your book, and other advice that you might give to women who want to enter a traditionally male job.
Karen: Okay.
Deanne: All right. So when we return, we’ll talk a little bit more. This is Deanna DeMarco with Today’s Inspiring Women hang on we’ll be right back.
Welcome back this is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women. We are talking to Karen Moulder, one of the first firefighter in Texas.
Karen tells us a little bit more about what advice you might give women who want to enter a profession, that’s traditionally a male type of profession like you did?
Karen: I’m going to say that my advice is one, be sure you can handle it. No matter how much we advance, there is always going to be some man out there who is not accepting a women doing that type of job. Or that same type of job that they’re doing.
First of all you need to be aware that, that would come up and whether you could handle it or not. Second, if that’s what you want to do, I say go for it.
Deanne: So when you say handle it, I think your meaning both emotionally as well as physically?
Karen: Yeah. Most people think firefighting as a really strenuous job which it is. If you are a very good problem solver you can get away or you can get around not having to use so much physical strength if you’re smarter.
Take for instance when I came in, they gave me a hard time, because on the truck they have these big huge heavy suction hoses that are like positioned very high on the truck.
They were giving me a hard time saying, oh you can't get that down if we had to use it. I’m like, really? Watch me. I climb up on the truck, I unclamped it, kicked it off with my feet. Got down off the truck, dragged it over to the truck and connected it.
I don't have to be tall muscled strong person to pull that thing down off of the truck, I use my intelligent part of my brain and problem solving, and did it that way.
It’s that and you can expect some harassment as well. I went though harassment while I was in there. I think that is probably the more difficult thing to handle. Over the physical is the harassment you will receive.
Deanne: Even though we have the laws in place, I still think it’s probably going to happen. How did you deal with that?
Karen: It’s hard because the fire department is set up like a military style. Basically you have to follow orders, whether there are unjust or not and then file a grievance. That’s the way they handle it.
Now there were sometimes that they would order me to do things that to me endangered lives or endangered my life. I refused to do it, and then I would handle it.
When you’re in a fire truck, whether you’re driving to a scene or back from a scene, you have to follow the laws of the street. The lights and everything. On the way over there, you can go through the lights as long as the traffic gives you the right of way. On the way back you have to follow the laws just like anyone else.
Sometimes we would get calls late at night and they would say, just drive though the lights, I’m like, no. What is a car come speeding through and I didn’t see it, I went through the light.
Deanne: Sure.
Karen: There are things that and they would tell me to go aganist the law that I wouldn’t do.
Deanne: So you really have to be on your toes?
Karen: Yeah. You have to know when to pick you battles too. There’re just plenty of battles going into a job where it’s all male. You have to pick. I just wanted to go to work like everybody else and just do my job, because I enjoyed it. To have to deal with somebody who’s making your life miserable, it’s tough.
Deanne: Some of the toughness I think that you’ve got as a firefighter, because I think that probably sets you up in a mindset of being able to just accomplish almost anything that you’ve put your mind to.
Karen: Yeah that’s got to be part of your nature too, is wanting to accomplish your goals and not let anything get to you. Although it will get to you at times. You just have to set your mind to it.
I think it did shape me as a person in how to handle things in life. Women being a little bit more emotional than men, we tend to tear up a little easier than men do. I was accused multiple times of crying to get my way. I had to learn how to turn my tears off, not to cry.
Deanne: It’s really meant for toughness.
Karen: It is tough. Especially when you’re in emotional situations. When you’re at an accident scene and you’re seeing people injured it’s tough.
Deanne: Yeah. With that background is that what led you to open up your own? You did jump from firefighting into being an entrepreneur and opening up your own medical billing company.
Karen: Yeah, I went to college and I got my business degree. A friend to mine was married to a doctor. I went in to just start helping them, and I’m a very organized person. It just kind of like went one thing to another. I got into managing the doctor’s office and I got my certification in medical billing.
I eventually moved up to Massachusetts, because my daughter is up here. After several jobs I ended up opening my own business. I set my mind to doing it, and I think I set my mind to doing it. Within six months I had my first client.
Deanne: Wow! I just think that’s exciting. I would like to talk a little bit about your book Burning Barriers. What made you decide to write that book?
Karen: Basically when people would find out that I was fire fighter and I would tell them stories. Sometimes not just stories about the firefighting, but things that happen in my life; people would just tell me all the time, you’ve got to write a book. Sit down and write these things down.
I never thought that I could sit down and write a whole book. I found a girl that helped me with it and get it structured. It took me about three years to do it.
It’s not an easy thing sitting down and writing a book. You hear somebody; they’re sitting down and popping out a book every year. I don't know honestly how they do that. It’s very tough, of course I have a full time job and I have five kids. They’re not all at home, but I still have a life and not just writing books.
Deanne: Sure. So who do you think your book will appeal to?
Karen: I think it will appeal to a lot of people. Mainly women who are looking into that, getting into that type of job. The book also talks about the situations that I got into. Becoming pregnant in the fire department, and losing my job.
The resources are out there. I was so naïve I didn’t know what resources I could get, when I got myself in that situation. I think the book is really helpful in that sense to younger women who don't know where to look and what to do.
It would also, I would guess, appeal to women who might want to pursue a job in a traditionally male role. Then again there could be the people who are just interested in what it takes to become a firefighter.
Deanne: Right. I think your book really could help people, not only if they’re looking for a career in firefighting, but also in looking at a career in a male dominated or traditional male job.
Karen: Yeah, it does and it helps them see what kind of things could happen. How you could handle it when that does happen.
Deanne: I think that’s just really very interesting. What are some the resources that would be available for women?
Karen: They have now, for women firefighters, there is an online website. Honestly I can't think of it right now, but there is one for women firefighters. I think its international association for women firefighters. I think that’s what it is; I’m not 100% sure, if you want to do that.
My book talks about going and getting assistance from the government, when you find yourself in a situation where you need help. It talks about paying an attorney, because I did have to file with EOC because of the harassment that I got. It talks about all that stuff. What your rights are and where to go find help and everything. It covers a lot of that kind of things.
Deanne: It sounds like a good resource book as well. Very interesting story as well.
Karen: Yes.
Deanne: How do people get hold of your book?
Karen: You can find it on Amazon; you can find it on BarnesandNoble.com and Author House. I’m assuming that any other bookstore if you request it they can get it for you.
Karen: Wonderful. How do people contact you?
Deanne: Basically I’m more on Facebook, but I do have a website BurningBarries.com. I also have Facebook page for Burning Barriers. I’ll answer any questions there.
Deanne: The thing that’s really interesting is if the audience goes to your Burning Barriers website, they will actually see you in full firemen garment holding a hose putting out a fire.
Karen: Yes. That was a major fire too. That was a major fire, three story building burnt to the ground.
Deanne: I just happen to like that photo.
Karen: That’s one of my favorites.
Deanne: Well our time is just about up here. Karen I’d like to thank you for being on Today's Inspiring Women.
Karen: Thank you for having me.
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Today I’d like to leave you with a quote from George Bernard Shaw. George Bernard Shaw says, you see things; and you say, 'Why?' But I dream things that never were; and I say, ‘Why not?’ Which I think fits our session today perfectly.
This is Deanne DeMarco, until next time, have a wonderful week
Debra Fine and Deanne DeMarco
The Fine Art of Small Talk and Generations@ Work
Dr Christine Quinn and Renee Bondi
Authenticity and Perseverance
Host: Deanne DeMarco
Guests: Doctor Christine Quinn, Provost, National Louis University,
Renee Bondi, Entertainer
Show Date: 3/28/13
Deanne: Welcome to Today’s Inspiring Women. I’m your host, Deanne DeMarco. If you are ready to take the next steps to become inspired, empowered and motivated and better equip for success, then stay tuned. My first guess today is Doctor Christine Quinn; Christine is Provost for National Louis University with more than 20 years of leadership experience in the public, private and non-profit sectors. Her forte is engaging, empowering people so that they can unleash their true potential. Christine has experience in making visions reality. And so I’d like to welcome my first guest, Doctor Christine Quinn. Welcome.
Christine: Hello Deanne, it's great to be here, thank you so much.
Deanne: Christine, I’m glad to have you on board. You know, the experience you have of making vision's reality, that's what we really want in, today's world. How do we make those visions reality? Before we get started here, a lot of our listeners may not know what a Provost does. What is, what do you do as your role as Provost?
Christine: That's a great question. I get asked that question a lot. Actually, a Provost for those who might not be in education…. A Provost is similar to a Chief Operation Officer in business. So that means that I’m in charge of the operations, I oversee and provide leadership for all the academic activities and really to ensure excellent academics and that students have an outstanding learning experience. So that includes support for faculty, whether that's teaching, research or scholarship, and that students are always the priority. And for here us at the National Louis University we have predominately adult learners both at the graduate and undergraduate levels. So what that means, is that no two days are ever alike and that each day is a challenge. But I go home satisfied because we're making a difference in someone lives.
Deanne: Wow, that's great. You know, to be perfectly honest, even though I was an academia, I did not know what a Provost did either. <laughs> Shame on me.
Christine: <laughs> I just worked for the President, right?
Deanne: Well, you know, I had my Department’s chair, that’s as far as it went <laughs>.
Christine: <laughs>. Yeah, yeah. That’s right.
Deanne: You had a very diverse background in getting along your journey to leadership. What are, you know, what are some of the—share a little bit about yourself and some of the highlights of your leadership journey.
Christine: Thank you, thank you for asking. And certainly I would say that my journey isn't probably typical—rather eclectic, but with that said, I would like to begin is that I’m a first generation college educated students. I grew up in Rhodes, Wisconsin, the Midwest part of the United States, and with that I carry with me many traditional role values. But it wasn't probably until I was out of college that I really started to realize what my leadership ability were, or what my leadership potential was. But I explore that through a variety of career opportunity. I started out in the area of vocational rehabilitation, working with individual with disability, which helps me to better understand people, people who come out the world differently. Then being an opportunist, I ended up in the family business. And we owned and operated hotels. So of course that was quite different from my counseling days, and things that I did it might means that someday I would clean rooms, other days I would be putting a business plan together, another day I might be up the Chamber of Commerce working on a community functions. So that was really exciting but then, I decided that I also wanted to be a mom. And to simply balance life, both my career and my family, I saw an opportunity to actually start teaching on a part time basis. And that was where a lot of doors really open for me. It was the beginning of my higher Ed career. It stimulated me because I love inquiry, I love learning, and so that was all good. Which then led to many other academic positions, Department chairs, you talk about Department’s chair. Then I became an Associate Vice President, then I was a Provost, and now I’m in my second Provost position here at the National Louis University. So, I don’t have a typical career, but yet I consider myself very fortunate it is those traditional values that have serve me well. I had many coaches and mentors along the way, and you know, I always had a plan or a vision. But don’t be misled by that. Because I was also open to opportunities, and along the way, could course correct or to change that vision depending on what the opportunity was that it might present itself. And that many time those opportunities presented themselves, and I was committed to learning. Learning about myself, about the world, sometimes,, formal opportunities, sometimes informal opportunities. So I had a rich career path, probably not a typical career path, but a well- rounded one that certainly has brought many opportunities to me, so I am very fortunate to have the career path that I have had.
Deanne: I’m right with you, I mean I definitely believe that you need to look to see what opportunities are crossing your path, and then not being afraid to step through that door.
Christine: You know, and fear really can be a challenge for us. I sort of adopted a motto that is "Sometimes in doubt, just do it" and that really has actually serve me very well because I know that I’m most cases cautious, and so I’m not going to do anything that is just really radical. And so, when I have that fear in my stomach, I’d say "Okay, let's just do it". And I typically find that I’ve learned a lot. Frequently successful, and when I’m not, I also learned from that.
Deanne: Yeah right, we needs, you know, sometimes things just don’t work out we just pick our self up, dust yourself off and keep going.
Christine: I call that resilience and I got that gene too.
Deanne: <laughs>. So, talk to us about some of the biggest challenges that you have to face and how did you overcome those?
Christine: You know, challenges has comes in a variety of shapes and forms. I would say probably my biggest challenge though which probably some of our listeners can relate to is this thing called balance.
Much of my professional career, I was a single mom. I have three delighted children that are now in their twenties. But balance is really hard. And how I frame it even made it harder. I thought that I needed to compartmentalize my life, that it was easier to balance if my mom's hat was in, you know, one box, my relationship with my children, I have another box as college administrator, another that was family and friends, and then of course there was a smaller box for myself. But, I was never very successful at getting that to all to balance out. When I couldn’t get it to balance, then I felt guilty, which of course, didn't help the matter any. So through a lot of trial and error and sometimes frustration, where I’ve landed which has served me well is to reframe my life. I look at my life as an integrated whole, and I also focus on things that give me positive energy. As well as those things then that are taking away my energy.
So let me give you an example. So as a mom, I’d say, I’m going to leave the office at five o'clock. A pre determined time. And I got home, pick up one of the kids to take them to basketball practice or piano lesson, drop them off, and then go to the gym and workout myself. But I would return to pick up my sons or daughter and go home, and we might work on homework together or whatever family task needed to be done. And then at night, after the children were in bed, if I had some pressing emails or task that was not done at five o'clock because we know that work doesn't always end at five o'clock, I would simply go and I look at the to do list, and I would do it, and I would check it off without any guilt at all. And said, "This is just part of the life that I choose". That had made a significant difference for me. And though I talk about positive energy, lets—I’ll give you another example. So for example I love to read, and recently I’m reading books on changed leadership, women in leadership and you might said, “Wow, isn't that helping you to be a better Provost?” And I would say, “Yes it is”. But it also feed my intellectual curiosity so it doesn't have to fit in a box, it gives me energy. Or in a totally different direction, I’m also taking in Improvisation classes. Living here in Chicago, there's a lot of opportunity to take a variety of classes. Now, I’m probably twenty years older than most of the students in the class, but it pushes me to be spontaneous, I get out of my head. Bottom line, I’d simply have fun and it gives me positive energy. So, those are ways that I have found, that I can better create balance and full—and lead a full life.
Deanne: Well, I got a question for you, you may have mention that your—the smaller box was yourself. Now that your children are older, is that personal box of yours getting bigger?
Christine: So, you know, what I would say is that I don’t try to put it in boxes so much anymore, and that I try to have that integrated life and by looking at my life as a integrated whole, I don’t feel like I’m short changing myself. And I don’t feel guilty when I sign up for those Improv classes, for example.
Deanne: Yeah, wow. You know, Improv classes are these, these—not a bad type of class to take. Cause it can help you a lot of —different ways.
Christine: Yeah, it helps me to think differently, it helps me to be spontaneous.
Deanne: Sure.
Christine: There’s a lot of trial and error in Improv. And it's a lot of fun.
Deanne: Yeah, they are fun. They are fun. You know, once I was a theatre major so I know about improve. <laughs>.
Christine: That's awesome. That wasn't for me, but I think that's something in me that would've liked to be.
Deanne: Yeah, that was one of the degrees I’d pick up along the way. <laughs>.
Christine: That's awesome. That’s awesome.
Deanne: You know Improv is one of those, topics or courses that anybody could use, especially if you're interviewing, you could always use Improv. We’re going to take a quick break shortly—one of the questions that I want to start getting into, we have only about a minute to, maybe going highlight it, then we're going into it after the break. And that is, about being authentic and leading from the heart. That’s one of your mantras, right?
Christine: Absolutely, absolutely. Being auntentic and leading from the heart is definitely what I attribute much of my success from. And I might just, you know, initially, define what that means and leading with hearts means be yourself, be open, be willing to engage with your employees. Know them and support them. To build their strength and to empower them, so they can see opportunities that they probably never imagined. And then value and celebrate their contributions.
Deanne: All right.
Christine: Begin with knowing who we are.
Deanne: We have to go away for a short break here, and when we come back from break, I’d really would like to dive deeper into the being auntentic piece. Cause I think that it's really an important piece that we need to investigate a little bit further. So we are going to break away for a short break, stay tune we'll be right back with Today’s Inspiring Women and our guest, Doctor Christine Quinn.
<Commercial Break>
Deanne: And welcome back with Doctor Christine Quinn, Provost from National Louis University, this is Deanne DeMarco and Today's Inspiring Women. And, just before break we start talking to Christine regarding leading, being authentic and leading from the heart. And I like to investigate that just a little bit more. Christine, can you tell us a little bit more about your message about being auntentic and leading with the heart?
Christine: Sure, why don’t I begin by talking about authenticity and to me, authenticity is to be true to who we are and to our values, and the interesting part about that is I would have to say that I learn about my own authenticity when I first started teaching in the classroom. I started the university level, I had no previous teaching experience, but I had a master degree so I had seen and been in a whole lot of college courses. But lo and behold, that lecture style, what we might refer to stage on a stage, really didn't work for me. And so I needed to experience and figure out who I was and what would work for me and the classroom. And it wasn’t until I truly engaged with the students, I was down to earth, I asked probing question to help them think. But I really found my true self and where I could actually set a pace that was about engagement with the students. And so I would say that's really where I started to learn about authenticity. And then the part about leading with heart refers more to engaging with our employees and supporting them. And it begins with being committed to making a different in the lives of our employees as well as successfully advancing our organization.
Deanne: Hmm, I like that. When I was teaching in San Jose States University, it took a little while to get into my own rhythm also, and understand —classroom dynamics and teaching my courses. And once I became more comfortable in my own skin, and I just taught from who I was. Everything was easier.
Christine: Absolutely, you know, at one time I had one of my colleagues, Mrs. Post and she said to me, "You know Christine, you support me and you stretch me at the same time". And that was really good feedback, because that was just something that I had started to do almost intuitively but it was really important to her, and that it acknowledged that I knew who she was, and that I wanted her to do well.
Deanne: Yeah. So what I’m also hearing from you as well is that, even in your leadership role, you need to be really auntentic and lead from the heart as well, and so..
Christine: Go ahead.
Deanne: So, what I thought was is, you know, I always question whether or not a woman could really do that. I think it's easier for a man, but I’m wondering can a woman really be a successful leader with those qualities, and does she comes across as being just too soft?
Christine: You know, and that, that's an excellent question. And actually being in an environment that has predominantly been men, that was a little bit of a struggle for me to say that I could be myself which might not be as hard as what some of the men would be. I don’t think any of my colleagues would call me soft, some might say sometimes that I’m nice, and I’m okay with that. But I also understand as leaders that we need to get results. And what I would say is I get result by working with and through people. And advancing the organization and it comes through engagement. And when we get that engagement, typically the teams I work with actually surpass their goals.
Now I’ve got lots of teams that have had perks. And so, I can tell you that my evidence is that its works. And if I go even further, and I’ve actually done some research in terms of what does the data say about this in terms of really engaging her employees and leading with heart. And what is the data around employee engagement tells us, that our world really needs different ways of leading. The more traditional forms of leadership aren't working. The conference board has been collecting data, and this is global data. From employees, for many. many decades. And what they are seeing is it those jobs satisfaction and engagement has been declining for decades. In 2012, more than half of the employees were unhappy in their jobs. And seventy one percent reported being disengaged. An all time low.
Deanne: Wow.
Christine: That's very significant, isn't it? At a time—when we have complex problems to be solved, and we need to really maximize our effort and engage collectively to make a difference. And when you think about that, you say so where, you know, where does engagement comes from, right?
Deanne: Right.
Christine: Apart of that is around feelings. How people feel towards their co workers, their boss. Their sense of pride and fulfillment in their work. And we also know that engagement drives performance. So if we are going to increase productivity and performance, we need to be connecting with our employees and support their growth and fulfillment.
Deanne: That makes perfect sense. Just think about it logically, if an employee is unhappy, and disengage at work seventy one percent, they are not gonna care about customer service, they are not gonna care about the quality of a product. They’re just gonna clock the paycheck.
Christine: That's right, that's right, they become robot like and come to work, do their job and go home. And we need something more.
Deanne: Yeah, and we wonder why some of our employees just put their badge or their keys on their desk and walk off a job and don’t even tell you that they left.
Christine: Yeah, yeah. That does happen, unfortunately.
Deanne: Yeah, they’re unhappy.
Christine: Yeah, that was another day the point recently that I heard, I don’t remember the source but it was something like, many people would rather get a new boss, than a raise. That’s kind of sad.
Deanne: Really?
Christine: Yeah.
Deanne: Wow. I mean, that’s a wake up call for managers and leaders.
Christine: Absolutely, absolutely.
Deanne: Across the board. Yeah, wow. You know, you talk earlier about trying to balance life and work the same time. And I was wondering it—with it our different stages of life, when we look at leadership, do you have any advice for those just entering leadership positions, and how—they want to start a family, as well as someone who has, maybe retired is starting a second career. Is far is balancing work and life together.
Christine: Yeah, absolutely. You know, it's interesting as I look at my life for I know that I’ve grown and my knowledge is much deeper and my goals are a bit different than earlier in my leadership career, but I don’t think it's really matters if you just entering leadership, if you're taking a pause, maybe or deciding that you want to be a mom and take on family and professional responsibility or you're post retirement. I think the keys are, know yourself, create a roadmap or a vision, surround yourself with a strong network and always be true to yourself and your values. So let me give you an example, so let's just say for example, continue to know yourself. That gonna look a little bit different if I just graduated from college. But yet you will be looking to see and identified what are your strength, what are my passion, what gives me energy? And if I’m a young mom, maybe my focus is more on my children or maybe when I’m entering retirement, what jazzes me and giving me energy is giving back and seeing the world. So it's still comes back to knowing yourself.
Deanne: Hmm Hmm.
Christine: You know, if you think about that roadmap or that vision of what you want your life to look like, I just recently created a vision board for myself, which has that integrated life that just not a career, and so I would say, it look different than it did at one time, but it still kind of what that map that guide me.
Deanne: Sure. Go on.
Christine: Our networks are gonna change whether we're young or we're older, but they become very, very important. I can’t tell you how many doors that open through the networks and the people that I’ve known as well as those has been people that have supported me and help me to see my skill and what assets that I actually bring to the work place or to the lives of others.
Deanne: Hmm Hmm.
Christine: And that messages that I continue to reinforce today and that's to be true to yourself and your values, that's where we find peace and authenticity.
Deanne: We have only a couple of minutes left, and I just to ask you just couple—one more really good question. I mean, you work in a predominantly male field, how did you break through that?
Christine: You know, at first I thought that I need to be like many my predecessor which were predominantly men, but then I let go off that and I found that my true power came from being myself, working from my strength. And that doesn't mean that I didn’t work hard, sometimes harder than maybe my male counterpart. But I didn’t dwell on it. I know who I am, I’ve led a full life, I’m grateful for it, and I felt concern how I can make a difference while still being me.
Deanne: So, back to the authenticity piece. That’s what I’m hearing you say.
Christine: Absolutely, absolutely,
Deanne: So, what would—if any of our listeners wanted to learn more about you and your work, how can they contact you?
Christine: Email is great. I can be reach at [email protected], and that's [email protected], and so if they're interested in a key noter or workshop leader on really how do you unleash real productivity in the workplace, so the essence of your people, you—I can be contacted at that address. Or first individual who just want some coaching to clarify their vision and their plans, I am available to do that as well. And certainly I know that some of your listener may be interested in formal educational opportunity, and National Louis is an institution that's committed to supporting leadership development for all of our students. Also, check us out at www.nl.edu. And we have programs in the Social and Behavioral Sciences, Management and Business. And education. Some of are face to face. All really focusing on the needs of adult learners.
Deanne: And National Louis has online courses as well, is that correct?
Christine: Exactly right, exactly right, we have some programs that are totally online, some that are blended, so we can reach the needs of a broad audiences.
Deanne: All right, wonderful. I can’t believe how the time has just flown. I’d like to thank you for being with us today. You’ve truly been a wonderful and exciting guess, and I’ve learned a lot having you on the show. As we wrap up here, I’d like you to stay tune, our next guess. If you ever had an opportunity— the time when you have been frustrated with the—with your life. Our next guess, Renee Bondi had a tragic accident, her life prior to the accident was filled with excitement, future fill with hope, and when the very tragic accident hit, you would think that it will be the end of the story, right? Well that's hardly, it was just the beginning. To refuse to let her dreams to be shattered along with her spine and she continues today as a singer, working from a wheelchair.
And so our next guess will be Renee Bondi, so stay tune after the break, with Today’s Inspiring Women.
Second Guest
Deanne: You're listening to Today's Inspiring Women. I’m your host Deanne DeMarco, each week we address relevant topics for women to spark your career and life growth. This afternoon, my guest is Renee Bondi, you know, a lot of us have a life filled with excitement and a future filled with hope. And then a tragic accident occurs, end of story, right? Hardly. It is just the beginning. At age twenty nine, Renee Bondi was engaged to be married and had a beautiful singing voice and a thriving career as a music teacher and a loving family. But then one night a bizarre accident happen, shattered her spine and left her as a quadriplegic. Her
life changed forever. Renee lost not only all the use of her hands and legs, but also her singing voice. And she could barely speak above a whisper. She was unwilling to accept that her life was over. Although they were many dark days, Renee continues to persevere. Since that time, Renee has won numerous awards. She won the Last Dance awards, the Gold Medallion awards for the “Last dance but not the last song”, best contemporary acoustic song writer from Guest American song contest. She won Women of the year—wish I get Women of the year, from California State Senate, turning your scars to stars, I just love that, presented by Crystal Cathedral Ministries, she won the Special Congressional Recognition for outstanding services to the community for U.S House of Representative. Renee Bondi is one of the top selling independent contemporary Christian artists, selling over hundred and fifty thousand copies. I would like to welcome Renee to Today's Inspiring Women.
Renee: Hello Deanne, thanks for having me.
Deanne: You know, I first—you know, I’m so glad to have you on the show. I first met you through your wonderful music, and then when I read about your story, I just had to have you on the show. Because I think you show, that no matter what life throws at you, you could truly preserve and overcome, and makes your dream comes through.
Renee: Well that's the goal, right? Because who want to stay in bed for the rest of their lives. That’s the tough, that's the tough, pill to swallow, you know.
Deanne: It is. So tell us a little bit. What was your like before, your life like before your injury?
Renee: Well I was engaged to be married to a great guy by the name of Mike; our wedding was just two month away. I also had a job teaching vocal music choir, at a local public high school. Lots of fans, very close to my sister and my brother and my mum and dad, living in a little small town in Southern California called San Juan Capistrano. Where it's a mid western town for being Southern California. So, life was good. Future was exciting.
Deanne: And then your accident. How does that happen?
Renee: Well, that's the million dollar questions Deanne. To this day we still, almost twenty five years later now, we still really don’t know exactly, what happen. I had, just the night before, been chaperoning our high school—the high school where I was working, teaching, they asked me and my fiancé to chaperon the high school prom. And just the night before, my Mike flown into town, and he was living in Denver at the time. Working there. Surprise me at dinner before we went to the prom with my engagement ring. And even though we have been engage for a whole year, he hadn't been able to afford my ring, and we have been making payment on it, surprise me with it at dinner, so we had a really romantic dinner, and then we when to the prom afterwards, and had a great time even though we had our teacher's hat on, because I was, you know, checking the bathroom and the hallways and outside, all those things that you do when you're chaperoning. But, we also got a couple of time out of the dance floor, and also it's really a wonderful time. The next day, we had breakfast with my family, and he flew back to Denver, and I go to the high school to conduct the orchestra in the state spring musical. And on that night, I went to bed about eleven o'clock after writing out a bunch of lesson plan for the week, went to bed feeling great. The next thing I know, I woke up out of a sound deep sleep, standing on the end of my bed. Diving off the end of my bed on to my head. Breaking my neck, leaving me permanently paralyzed from right above the chest down. And permanently confined to this wheel chair.
Deanne: Wow.
Renee: We don’t have any idea what happened. I don’t have any history of sleepwalking; any kind of deceased that would cause a seizure, the only thing we can thing of is that I must have been having some sort of a dream, although I don’t remember it. Maybe I was diving, because that was literally the position I was in when I woke.
Deanne: Oh my gosh. Oh my goodness.
Renee: Wish I had a clear cut answer, but I have to tell you, you know, I know you have other questions, but let me just insert this really quickly. For years, oh my gosh, for the first probably three or four years, that, I never, I never ask the question why, why, why me? why me? I really asked the question how? How did this happen? And then came the time finally, where, my fiancé, turn husband, and I know I’m jumping ahead here, but, to let you know that Mike still stay with me through the whole thing. And we got married one year after I got out of the hospital. This year we're celebrating twenty three years of marriage. And as we travel around the country, in fact this weekend I’m going to be speaking to a few thousand teenagers and one of the point that I make is don’t settle for junk, in your boyfriend and your girlfriend because you never know when that relationship going to be tested to the max. But Mike was saying, when he really notice a couple years into my injury, he could tell with the how question, how did this happen, was really trying to eat away from—weight me. And he said, you know, Renee, if you got a FedEx photo deliver to you, today, from God, giving you the details of what happen, what would've really change? He's still with me to have a caregiver get you out of bed in the morning, you still have to deals with wheelchair, you still would have to deal of the use of your hands, your feet, for so knowing exactly what happen, what would have really change? And, I look at him, I said, “You know, you're right”. And from that on, I put it to bed. And I say, you know, the how question, I never look back to it now.
Deanne: Wow. So how long did it take before, you are going to be able to sing again?
Renee: It took about four years, for my singing voice to come back. Because I broke cervical vertebrae four, that cause my diaphragm to be compromised tremendously. If I’ve broken anywhere higher on my neck, three, two or one, I’ll be on a ventilator or a breathing machine the rest of my life. So my diaphragm still works, because I broke the neighbor’s cervical vertebrae four, but the muscle around my diaphragm were controlled by C five. And so that's why my voice was reduced to the whispers. Breathing like this, that was, talking like this, and so obviously, I wasn’t going to be finishing any recording project that I was working on unless it was some Marilyn Monroe CD’s or something but because I had a wonderful friend who is a great voice teacher, a vocal coach, she would come and put weight on my stomach, one pound, two pound, three pound, ultimately, up to fifty pounds on my stomach. So that every time I would take a breath, it would essentially make my diaphragm lift the weight. And that would strengthen any muscle that was around my diaphragm. That—to make it stronger and stronger. So that my diaphragm could push against those muscles. And that's ultimately, that and the power of prayer because, boy, I had the whole community on their knees, praying for me. That I would be productive in some way again, that ultimately is what brought my voice back.
Deanne: Wow. And you've been recording ever since, or, did it take a couple of years beyond that? Before you could finally record?
Renee: It took about a year after that. So, my first recording was in, actually, very tail, tail end December 1992. And, they just, my voice has got stronger and you can actually hear on my CD's that I’ve recorded, six , six CD’s and you can hear the progress of my voice, it's interesting how's that happen.
Deanne: Wow. Wow. I’ve just been mesmerize with your music. It’s just been—a lot of your song just, makes me cry. Cause they are just so beautiful. And then you have one song on the current CD that it's actually with your son.
Renee: Yes. That’s six years into our marriage. We made the big old decision that we are going to actively try to start a family, and that's a whole other story. You have to read “The last dance, but not the last song”. My first book, to hear all that story and decision making and the fear, and—but yes, I gave birth to a beautiful baby boy. Naturally, no C section and hey, I didn't feel a thing. Funny, that delivery. But, our son now is seventeen and I have to say, yes, I’m a mother speaking here, but he sings, he's an awesome singer. And, I have to note though, he sing all on this album, the newest—about a year and a half ago, when we were r recording, and he was younger, but now, a year and a half later, he's just doing quite well. So, above this college application and all of that right now, he's already pulling in some music scholarship which is, really wonderful. You’re thinking about majoring in business management or broadcast journalism, and minoring in music.
Deanne: Oh that's wonderful. We gonna have to break away here; as we break away—when we come back from break, we have a clip from one of your songs from one of my favorite songs, from “Eagle Wings”, right? As we come back from break, we will be able to—listen to, listen to singing one of your songs in just a few second. So, let's take a break right now.
<Commercial Break>
Deanne: Welcome back to Today's Inspiring Women. I’m your host, Deanne DeMarco and we are speaking with Renee Bondi who is a quadriplegic, who was in an accident and lost her voice and after four years was able to regain it. Welcome back Renee.
Renee: Thank you Deanne.
Deanne: We've been talking about your music and after four years of—after this bizarre accident it took before you are able to sing again, and, what are the things that you—that we have is for you to have a small clips of one of your songs, for us. Which I am anxious to share with our audience because it's from one of my favorite songs called “On Eagle Wings". Is that the correct title?
Renee: Yes it is. Great. It was a beautiful song written by Micheal Joncas and it was a song that really touches me and kept me going strong through my injury. Hope you'll enjoy it!
Deanne: I will. So let's just take a few second here and listen to “On Eagle Wings"
<Music Playing>
Deanne: That song, always just bring tears to my eyes. I just love this song. And your voice is just so beautiful the way you sound like an angel, the way you're singing that song. I just loved your voice. What a gift.
Renee: Thank you so much. That was one of our biggest fears, when I was first injured, when one of my voice was reduced to whisper and the doctors said that I would never sing again because of my broken neck. And, but—it's just all started to coming back. I’m very grateful.
Deanne: So, sound like you're singing career is back, you're recording.
Renee: Yep.
Deanne: How many albums do you have now?
Renee: I have six CD's, and just starting to think about the next one. And all the music from my CD's, generally speaking, are music to encourage, to inspire, to motivate. Cause that's what I needed, you know, when I first got hurt, a lot of people bought me books to read. And, although I was very grateful for the gift, my fingers don’t work. So it was hard for me to turn the pages and it was hard because I couldn't focus on it. But music, for me, at the hospital room, music permeated my home when I got home from the hospital, and begin to scrape encouragement to me, so that's why I wanted to start recording the music that helps me get through difficult time so that, hopefully would help others.
Deanne: So how—you're a songwriter as well, right?
Renee: Yes, yes, not as much. Last couple of years has been so busy being a wife and a mom and touring and speaking for all kind of event. That I haven't had as much time, and I’m hoping that beginning 2014, that's my goal, is to be able to get back to more writing.
Deanne: Question for you. I mean, since you're quadriplegic, how are you, actually do those, the writing?
Renee: Well, a couple of different ways. I used voice activated software, called “Dragon Naturally Speaking”, that I speak into my computer and that really helps a lot. And because my music training prior to my injury, I’m actually quite good at hearing cord progression in my head, and so I’m able to write down cords using my voice activated software as well.
Deanne: I mean, your whole life has just changed. Because you had an accident. Being things that you are able to do on your own before you now, either needed assistance in some way.
Renee : Yes, I have to be caregiver every morning, for about three to four hours, help me do my range of motion, stretching me so I don’t end up all contorted, transfer me up to a shower chair with wheels that rolls me over the toilet, and then to the shower, and help me to the restroom and they have to shower me, and then roll me back to the bed and transfer me back to the bed, and get me dress, help me put my pants on, and then transfer me up to my power wheelchair that I’m sitting in right now as we speak. And then, help me put a brace on and put some food in front of me so I can feed myself. And then, they on their way, and, our son now is old enough to drive himself to work, to school, and my husband goes to work in the morning as well. And so we have a home office and I have a couple people then, they come in usually about ten or eleven o'clock, and we work on events that I’m invited to speak and sing across the country. Lots of Christian events as well as corporate events and conferences.
Deanne: One of the questions I have for you Renee is how do you deal with—I mean, I’ve would have been really depressed. How did you deal with that depression? We really have about three minutes, so..
Renee: There are four things that I do on a regular basis. And ironically, its spelled dive. D-I-V-E. Ironically cause I was diving off my bed when I broke my head. Broke my head. Broke my neck. The “D” stands for Decide. I have to make constant decision that I want to be joyful. Not everyone wants to get up of their difficult position sometimes or the sad state because they get used to it. And I didn't want to stay there. So “I” made a decision, really early on, and it's a daily decision on what kind of attitude I want to have that day. The I stand for Invite. Invite people into my world, into my life, into my day, to help me through all this. Sometimes a pride gets in the way, we didn't want to ask for help, but I’ve learned that people want to help and they need to serve. They need to help. So early on I had a friend get mad at me when I didn't want her to help me. And she said "Are you kidding me? Please help me!" and so that's when I realized "Oh, they don’t mind!" so invite people to help. The “V” stands for Volunteer. Volunteer to help other people, whatever way you can. Whatever talents you've been given, use them and volunteer to help others. Gets you out of your valley. And then finally the “E”, of DIVE, stands for Enter. Enter into a prayerful life. Once I said "Okay God, I gave this to you". And when I made a real conscious and deliberate decision to have maybe fifteen to twenty minutes of prayer time, boy, did it make a difference. So, Decide, Invite, Volunteer and Enter, a deep prayer life.
Deanne: Wow, that's really wonderful. So, we're running out of time here, I just want to make sure that people know how to get hold of you. How do they get hold of your music? Where do they go to?
Renee: Best way is to ReneeBondi.com. That’s ReneeBondi.com. ReneeBondi.com is the best way. Or you can dial: 1-800-795-5757. 1-800-795-5757.
Deanne: And on that website, you also have—people can buy your book as well, is that right?
Renee: Yes, the “Last dance but not the last song". And my newest book is out, called "Still I will praise - the power of praising God even when you don’t feel like it".
Deanne: Boy, I’ll tell ya, you're just an incredible, incredible, women. We need to wrap this up. Another premier sponsor for the Today's Inspiring Women is Breaking Boundaries International who partners business professionals who wants to create strategies and facilitating results. They work with executives and individuals. The provide , personal coaching, corporate training, and inspiration motivational speaking as well. They can be reach at http://www.Breaking-Boundaries.com or 866-91-COACH. That’s 866-91-COACH. Also for those who are going to be coming into the Chicago end area, April 19th, 2013, there is a Chicago Women's Conference at the Willis Tower in downtown Chicago. Featuring nationally and international respected speakers and workshop leaders offering practical solutions to move you from ideas to action. They can be reach at
www.chicagowomenconference.com. In closing today, we had—just remarkable guest. When—there's a wonderful quote by Oprah Winfrey. Oprah says "When you don’t know what to do, get still. Get very still".
Renee: I totally agree.
Deanne: “Until you know, exactly what to do". This is Deanne DeMarco signing off, hope you'll have a wonderful day until next week, bye for now!
Guests: Doctor Christine Quinn, Provost, National Louis University,
Renee Bondi, Entertainer
Show Date: 3/28/13
Deanne: Welcome to Today’s Inspiring Women. I’m your host, Deanne DeMarco. If you are ready to take the next steps to become inspired, empowered and motivated and better equip for success, then stay tuned. My first guess today is Doctor Christine Quinn; Christine is Provost for National Louis University with more than 20 years of leadership experience in the public, private and non-profit sectors. Her forte is engaging, empowering people so that they can unleash their true potential. Christine has experience in making visions reality. And so I’d like to welcome my first guest, Doctor Christine Quinn. Welcome.
Christine: Hello Deanne, it's great to be here, thank you so much.
Deanne: Christine, I’m glad to have you on board. You know, the experience you have of making vision's reality, that's what we really want in, today's world. How do we make those visions reality? Before we get started here, a lot of our listeners may not know what a Provost does. What is, what do you do as your role as Provost?
Christine: That's a great question. I get asked that question a lot. Actually, a Provost for those who might not be in education…. A Provost is similar to a Chief Operation Officer in business. So that means that I’m in charge of the operations, I oversee and provide leadership for all the academic activities and really to ensure excellent academics and that students have an outstanding learning experience. So that includes support for faculty, whether that's teaching, research or scholarship, and that students are always the priority. And for here us at the National Louis University we have predominately adult learners both at the graduate and undergraduate levels. So what that means, is that no two days are ever alike and that each day is a challenge. But I go home satisfied because we're making a difference in someone lives.
Deanne: Wow, that's great. You know, to be perfectly honest, even though I was an academia, I did not know what a Provost did either. <laughs> Shame on me.
Christine: <laughs> I just worked for the President, right?
Deanne: Well, you know, I had my Department’s chair, that’s as far as it went <laughs>.
Christine: <laughs>. Yeah, yeah. That’s right.
Deanne: You had a very diverse background in getting along your journey to leadership. What are, you know, what are some of the—share a little bit about yourself and some of the highlights of your leadership journey.
Christine: Thank you, thank you for asking. And certainly I would say that my journey isn't probably typical—rather eclectic, but with that said, I would like to begin is that I’m a first generation college educated students. I grew up in Rhodes, Wisconsin, the Midwest part of the United States, and with that I carry with me many traditional role values. But it wasn't probably until I was out of college that I really started to realize what my leadership ability were, or what my leadership potential was. But I explore that through a variety of career opportunity. I started out in the area of vocational rehabilitation, working with individual with disability, which helps me to better understand people, people who come out the world differently. Then being an opportunist, I ended up in the family business. And we owned and operated hotels. So of course that was quite different from my counseling days, and things that I did it might means that someday I would clean rooms, other days I would be putting a business plan together, another day I might be up the Chamber of Commerce working on a community functions. So that was really exciting but then, I decided that I also wanted to be a mom. And to simply balance life, both my career and my family, I saw an opportunity to actually start teaching on a part time basis. And that was where a lot of doors really open for me. It was the beginning of my higher Ed career. It stimulated me because I love inquiry, I love learning, and so that was all good. Which then led to many other academic positions, Department chairs, you talk about Department’s chair. Then I became an Associate Vice President, then I was a Provost, and now I’m in my second Provost position here at the National Louis University. So, I don’t have a typical career, but yet I consider myself very fortunate it is those traditional values that have serve me well. I had many coaches and mentors along the way, and you know, I always had a plan or a vision. But don’t be misled by that. Because I was also open to opportunities, and along the way, could course correct or to change that vision depending on what the opportunity was that it might present itself. And that many time those opportunities presented themselves, and I was committed to learning. Learning about myself, about the world, sometimes,, formal opportunities, sometimes informal opportunities. So I had a rich career path, probably not a typical career path, but a well- rounded one that certainly has brought many opportunities to me, so I am very fortunate to have the career path that I have had.
Deanne: I’m right with you, I mean I definitely believe that you need to look to see what opportunities are crossing your path, and then not being afraid to step through that door.
Christine: You know, and fear really can be a challenge for us. I sort of adopted a motto that is "Sometimes in doubt, just do it" and that really has actually serve me very well because I know that I’m most cases cautious, and so I’m not going to do anything that is just really radical. And so, when I have that fear in my stomach, I’d say "Okay, let's just do it". And I typically find that I’ve learned a lot. Frequently successful, and when I’m not, I also learned from that.
Deanne: Yeah right, we needs, you know, sometimes things just don’t work out we just pick our self up, dust yourself off and keep going.
Christine: I call that resilience and I got that gene too.
Deanne: <laughs>. So, talk to us about some of the biggest challenges that you have to face and how did you overcome those?
Christine: You know, challenges has comes in a variety of shapes and forms. I would say probably my biggest challenge though which probably some of our listeners can relate to is this thing called balance.
Much of my professional career, I was a single mom. I have three delighted children that are now in their twenties. But balance is really hard. And how I frame it even made it harder. I thought that I needed to compartmentalize my life, that it was easier to balance if my mom's hat was in, you know, one box, my relationship with my children, I have another box as college administrator, another that was family and friends, and then of course there was a smaller box for myself. But, I was never very successful at getting that to all to balance out. When I couldn’t get it to balance, then I felt guilty, which of course, didn't help the matter any. So through a lot of trial and error and sometimes frustration, where I’ve landed which has served me well is to reframe my life. I look at my life as an integrated whole, and I also focus on things that give me positive energy. As well as those things then that are taking away my energy.
So let me give you an example. So as a mom, I’d say, I’m going to leave the office at five o'clock. A pre determined time. And I got home, pick up one of the kids to take them to basketball practice or piano lesson, drop them off, and then go to the gym and workout myself. But I would return to pick up my sons or daughter and go home, and we might work on homework together or whatever family task needed to be done. And then at night, after the children were in bed, if I had some pressing emails or task that was not done at five o'clock because we know that work doesn't always end at five o'clock, I would simply go and I look at the to do list, and I would do it, and I would check it off without any guilt at all. And said, "This is just part of the life that I choose". That had made a significant difference for me. And though I talk about positive energy, lets—I’ll give you another example. So for example I love to read, and recently I’m reading books on changed leadership, women in leadership and you might said, “Wow, isn't that helping you to be a better Provost?” And I would say, “Yes it is”. But it also feed my intellectual curiosity so it doesn't have to fit in a box, it gives me energy. Or in a totally different direction, I’m also taking in Improvisation classes. Living here in Chicago, there's a lot of opportunity to take a variety of classes. Now, I’m probably twenty years older than most of the students in the class, but it pushes me to be spontaneous, I get out of my head. Bottom line, I’d simply have fun and it gives me positive energy. So, those are ways that I have found, that I can better create balance and full—and lead a full life.
Deanne: Well, I got a question for you, you may have mention that your—the smaller box was yourself. Now that your children are older, is that personal box of yours getting bigger?
Christine: So, you know, what I would say is that I don’t try to put it in boxes so much anymore, and that I try to have that integrated life and by looking at my life as a integrated whole, I don’t feel like I’m short changing myself. And I don’t feel guilty when I sign up for those Improv classes, for example.
Deanne: Yeah, wow. You know, Improv classes are these, these—not a bad type of class to take. Cause it can help you a lot of —different ways.
Christine: Yeah, it helps me to think differently, it helps me to be spontaneous.
Deanne: Sure.
Christine: There’s a lot of trial and error in Improv. And it's a lot of fun.
Deanne: Yeah, they are fun. They are fun. You know, once I was a theatre major so I know about improve. <laughs>.
Christine: That's awesome. That wasn't for me, but I think that's something in me that would've liked to be.
Deanne: Yeah, that was one of the degrees I’d pick up along the way. <laughs>.
Christine: That's awesome. That’s awesome.
Deanne: You know Improv is one of those, topics or courses that anybody could use, especially if you're interviewing, you could always use Improv. We’re going to take a quick break shortly—one of the questions that I want to start getting into, we have only about a minute to, maybe going highlight it, then we're going into it after the break. And that is, about being authentic and leading from the heart. That’s one of your mantras, right?
Christine: Absolutely, absolutely. Being auntentic and leading from the heart is definitely what I attribute much of my success from. And I might just, you know, initially, define what that means and leading with hearts means be yourself, be open, be willing to engage with your employees. Know them and support them. To build their strength and to empower them, so they can see opportunities that they probably never imagined. And then value and celebrate their contributions.
Deanne: All right.
Christine: Begin with knowing who we are.
Deanne: We have to go away for a short break here, and when we come back from break, I’d really would like to dive deeper into the being auntentic piece. Cause I think that it's really an important piece that we need to investigate a little bit further. So we are going to break away for a short break, stay tune we'll be right back with Today’s Inspiring Women and our guest, Doctor Christine Quinn.
<Commercial Break>
Deanne: And welcome back with Doctor Christine Quinn, Provost from National Louis University, this is Deanne DeMarco and Today's Inspiring Women. And, just before break we start talking to Christine regarding leading, being authentic and leading from the heart. And I like to investigate that just a little bit more. Christine, can you tell us a little bit more about your message about being auntentic and leading with the heart?
Christine: Sure, why don’t I begin by talking about authenticity and to me, authenticity is to be true to who we are and to our values, and the interesting part about that is I would have to say that I learn about my own authenticity when I first started teaching in the classroom. I started the university level, I had no previous teaching experience, but I had a master degree so I had seen and been in a whole lot of college courses. But lo and behold, that lecture style, what we might refer to stage on a stage, really didn't work for me. And so I needed to experience and figure out who I was and what would work for me and the classroom. And it wasn’t until I truly engaged with the students, I was down to earth, I asked probing question to help them think. But I really found my true self and where I could actually set a pace that was about engagement with the students. And so I would say that's really where I started to learn about authenticity. And then the part about leading with heart refers more to engaging with our employees and supporting them. And it begins with being committed to making a different in the lives of our employees as well as successfully advancing our organization.
Deanne: Hmm, I like that. When I was teaching in San Jose States University, it took a little while to get into my own rhythm also, and understand —classroom dynamics and teaching my courses. And once I became more comfortable in my own skin, and I just taught from who I was. Everything was easier.
Christine: Absolutely, you know, at one time I had one of my colleagues, Mrs. Post and she said to me, "You know Christine, you support me and you stretch me at the same time". And that was really good feedback, because that was just something that I had started to do almost intuitively but it was really important to her, and that it acknowledged that I knew who she was, and that I wanted her to do well.
Deanne: Yeah. So what I’m also hearing from you as well is that, even in your leadership role, you need to be really auntentic and lead from the heart as well, and so..
Christine: Go ahead.
Deanne: So, what I thought was is, you know, I always question whether or not a woman could really do that. I think it's easier for a man, but I’m wondering can a woman really be a successful leader with those qualities, and does she comes across as being just too soft?
Christine: You know, and that, that's an excellent question. And actually being in an environment that has predominantly been men, that was a little bit of a struggle for me to say that I could be myself which might not be as hard as what some of the men would be. I don’t think any of my colleagues would call me soft, some might say sometimes that I’m nice, and I’m okay with that. But I also understand as leaders that we need to get results. And what I would say is I get result by working with and through people. And advancing the organization and it comes through engagement. And when we get that engagement, typically the teams I work with actually surpass their goals.
Now I’ve got lots of teams that have had perks. And so, I can tell you that my evidence is that its works. And if I go even further, and I’ve actually done some research in terms of what does the data say about this in terms of really engaging her employees and leading with heart. And what is the data around employee engagement tells us, that our world really needs different ways of leading. The more traditional forms of leadership aren't working. The conference board has been collecting data, and this is global data. From employees, for many. many decades. And what they are seeing is it those jobs satisfaction and engagement has been declining for decades. In 2012, more than half of the employees were unhappy in their jobs. And seventy one percent reported being disengaged. An all time low.
Deanne: Wow.
Christine: That's very significant, isn't it? At a time—when we have complex problems to be solved, and we need to really maximize our effort and engage collectively to make a difference. And when you think about that, you say so where, you know, where does engagement comes from, right?
Deanne: Right.
Christine: Apart of that is around feelings. How people feel towards their co workers, their boss. Their sense of pride and fulfillment in their work. And we also know that engagement drives performance. So if we are going to increase productivity and performance, we need to be connecting with our employees and support their growth and fulfillment.
Deanne: That makes perfect sense. Just think about it logically, if an employee is unhappy, and disengage at work seventy one percent, they are not gonna care about customer service, they are not gonna care about the quality of a product. They’re just gonna clock the paycheck.
Christine: That's right, that's right, they become robot like and come to work, do their job and go home. And we need something more.
Deanne: Yeah, and we wonder why some of our employees just put their badge or their keys on their desk and walk off a job and don’t even tell you that they left.
Christine: Yeah, yeah. That does happen, unfortunately.
Deanne: Yeah, they’re unhappy.
Christine: Yeah, that was another day the point recently that I heard, I don’t remember the source but it was something like, many people would rather get a new boss, than a raise. That’s kind of sad.
Deanne: Really?
Christine: Yeah.
Deanne: Wow. I mean, that’s a wake up call for managers and leaders.
Christine: Absolutely, absolutely.
Deanne: Across the board. Yeah, wow. You know, you talk earlier about trying to balance life and work the same time. And I was wondering it—with it our different stages of life, when we look at leadership, do you have any advice for those just entering leadership positions, and how—they want to start a family, as well as someone who has, maybe retired is starting a second career. Is far is balancing work and life together.
Christine: Yeah, absolutely. You know, it's interesting as I look at my life for I know that I’ve grown and my knowledge is much deeper and my goals are a bit different than earlier in my leadership career, but I don’t think it's really matters if you just entering leadership, if you're taking a pause, maybe or deciding that you want to be a mom and take on family and professional responsibility or you're post retirement. I think the keys are, know yourself, create a roadmap or a vision, surround yourself with a strong network and always be true to yourself and your values. So let me give you an example, so let's just say for example, continue to know yourself. That gonna look a little bit different if I just graduated from college. But yet you will be looking to see and identified what are your strength, what are my passion, what gives me energy? And if I’m a young mom, maybe my focus is more on my children or maybe when I’m entering retirement, what jazzes me and giving me energy is giving back and seeing the world. So it's still comes back to knowing yourself.
Deanne: Hmm Hmm.
Christine: You know, if you think about that roadmap or that vision of what you want your life to look like, I just recently created a vision board for myself, which has that integrated life that just not a career, and so I would say, it look different than it did at one time, but it still kind of what that map that guide me.
Deanne: Sure. Go on.
Christine: Our networks are gonna change whether we're young or we're older, but they become very, very important. I can’t tell you how many doors that open through the networks and the people that I’ve known as well as those has been people that have supported me and help me to see my skill and what assets that I actually bring to the work place or to the lives of others.
Deanne: Hmm Hmm.
Christine: And that messages that I continue to reinforce today and that's to be true to yourself and your values, that's where we find peace and authenticity.
Deanne: We have only a couple of minutes left, and I just to ask you just couple—one more really good question. I mean, you work in a predominantly male field, how did you break through that?
Christine: You know, at first I thought that I need to be like many my predecessor which were predominantly men, but then I let go off that and I found that my true power came from being myself, working from my strength. And that doesn't mean that I didn’t work hard, sometimes harder than maybe my male counterpart. But I didn’t dwell on it. I know who I am, I’ve led a full life, I’m grateful for it, and I felt concern how I can make a difference while still being me.
Deanne: So, back to the authenticity piece. That’s what I’m hearing you say.
Christine: Absolutely, absolutely,
Deanne: So, what would—if any of our listeners wanted to learn more about you and your work, how can they contact you?
Christine: Email is great. I can be reach at [email protected], and that's [email protected], and so if they're interested in a key noter or workshop leader on really how do you unleash real productivity in the workplace, so the essence of your people, you—I can be contacted at that address. Or first individual who just want some coaching to clarify their vision and their plans, I am available to do that as well. And certainly I know that some of your listener may be interested in formal educational opportunity, and National Louis is an institution that's committed to supporting leadership development for all of our students. Also, check us out at www.nl.edu. And we have programs in the Social and Behavioral Sciences, Management and Business. And education. Some of are face to face. All really focusing on the needs of adult learners.
Deanne: And National Louis has online courses as well, is that correct?
Christine: Exactly right, exactly right, we have some programs that are totally online, some that are blended, so we can reach the needs of a broad audiences.
Deanne: All right, wonderful. I can’t believe how the time has just flown. I’d like to thank you for being with us today. You’ve truly been a wonderful and exciting guess, and I’ve learned a lot having you on the show. As we wrap up here, I’d like you to stay tune, our next guess. If you ever had an opportunity— the time when you have been frustrated with the—with your life. Our next guess, Renee Bondi had a tragic accident, her life prior to the accident was filled with excitement, future fill with hope, and when the very tragic accident hit, you would think that it will be the end of the story, right? Well that's hardly, it was just the beginning. To refuse to let her dreams to be shattered along with her spine and she continues today as a singer, working from a wheelchair.
And so our next guess will be Renee Bondi, so stay tune after the break, with Today’s Inspiring Women.
Second Guest
Deanne: You're listening to Today's Inspiring Women. I’m your host Deanne DeMarco, each week we address relevant topics for women to spark your career and life growth. This afternoon, my guest is Renee Bondi, you know, a lot of us have a life filled with excitement and a future filled with hope. And then a tragic accident occurs, end of story, right? Hardly. It is just the beginning. At age twenty nine, Renee Bondi was engaged to be married and had a beautiful singing voice and a thriving career as a music teacher and a loving family. But then one night a bizarre accident happen, shattered her spine and left her as a quadriplegic. Her
life changed forever. Renee lost not only all the use of her hands and legs, but also her singing voice. And she could barely speak above a whisper. She was unwilling to accept that her life was over. Although they were many dark days, Renee continues to persevere. Since that time, Renee has won numerous awards. She won the Last Dance awards, the Gold Medallion awards for the “Last dance but not the last song”, best contemporary acoustic song writer from Guest American song contest. She won Women of the year—wish I get Women of the year, from California State Senate, turning your scars to stars, I just love that, presented by Crystal Cathedral Ministries, she won the Special Congressional Recognition for outstanding services to the community for U.S House of Representative. Renee Bondi is one of the top selling independent contemporary Christian artists, selling over hundred and fifty thousand copies. I would like to welcome Renee to Today's Inspiring Women.
Renee: Hello Deanne, thanks for having me.
Deanne: You know, I first—you know, I’m so glad to have you on the show. I first met you through your wonderful music, and then when I read about your story, I just had to have you on the show. Because I think you show, that no matter what life throws at you, you could truly preserve and overcome, and makes your dream comes through.
Renee: Well that's the goal, right? Because who want to stay in bed for the rest of their lives. That’s the tough, that's the tough, pill to swallow, you know.
Deanne: It is. So tell us a little bit. What was your like before, your life like before your injury?
Renee: Well I was engaged to be married to a great guy by the name of Mike; our wedding was just two month away. I also had a job teaching vocal music choir, at a local public high school. Lots of fans, very close to my sister and my brother and my mum and dad, living in a little small town in Southern California called San Juan Capistrano. Where it's a mid western town for being Southern California. So, life was good. Future was exciting.
Deanne: And then your accident. How does that happen?
Renee: Well, that's the million dollar questions Deanne. To this day we still, almost twenty five years later now, we still really don’t know exactly, what happen. I had, just the night before, been chaperoning our high school—the high school where I was working, teaching, they asked me and my fiancé to chaperon the high school prom. And just the night before, my Mike flown into town, and he was living in Denver at the time. Working there. Surprise me at dinner before we went to the prom with my engagement ring. And even though we have been engage for a whole year, he hadn't been able to afford my ring, and we have been making payment on it, surprise me with it at dinner, so we had a really romantic dinner, and then we when to the prom afterwards, and had a great time even though we had our teacher's hat on, because I was, you know, checking the bathroom and the hallways and outside, all those things that you do when you're chaperoning. But, we also got a couple of time out of the dance floor, and also it's really a wonderful time. The next day, we had breakfast with my family, and he flew back to Denver, and I go to the high school to conduct the orchestra in the state spring musical. And on that night, I went to bed about eleven o'clock after writing out a bunch of lesson plan for the week, went to bed feeling great. The next thing I know, I woke up out of a sound deep sleep, standing on the end of my bed. Diving off the end of my bed on to my head. Breaking my neck, leaving me permanently paralyzed from right above the chest down. And permanently confined to this wheel chair.
Deanne: Wow.
Renee: We don’t have any idea what happened. I don’t have any history of sleepwalking; any kind of deceased that would cause a seizure, the only thing we can thing of is that I must have been having some sort of a dream, although I don’t remember it. Maybe I was diving, because that was literally the position I was in when I woke.
Deanne: Oh my gosh. Oh my goodness.
Renee: Wish I had a clear cut answer, but I have to tell you, you know, I know you have other questions, but let me just insert this really quickly. For years, oh my gosh, for the first probably three or four years, that, I never, I never ask the question why, why, why me? why me? I really asked the question how? How did this happen? And then came the time finally, where, my fiancé, turn husband, and I know I’m jumping ahead here, but, to let you know that Mike still stay with me through the whole thing. And we got married one year after I got out of the hospital. This year we're celebrating twenty three years of marriage. And as we travel around the country, in fact this weekend I’m going to be speaking to a few thousand teenagers and one of the point that I make is don’t settle for junk, in your boyfriend and your girlfriend because you never know when that relationship going to be tested to the max. But Mike was saying, when he really notice a couple years into my injury, he could tell with the how question, how did this happen, was really trying to eat away from—weight me. And he said, you know, Renee, if you got a FedEx photo deliver to you, today, from God, giving you the details of what happen, what would've really change? He's still with me to have a caregiver get you out of bed in the morning, you still have to deals with wheelchair, you still would have to deal of the use of your hands, your feet, for so knowing exactly what happen, what would have really change? And, I look at him, I said, “You know, you're right”. And from that on, I put it to bed. And I say, you know, the how question, I never look back to it now.
Deanne: Wow. So how long did it take before, you are going to be able to sing again?
Renee: It took about four years, for my singing voice to come back. Because I broke cervical vertebrae four, that cause my diaphragm to be compromised tremendously. If I’ve broken anywhere higher on my neck, three, two or one, I’ll be on a ventilator or a breathing machine the rest of my life. So my diaphragm still works, because I broke the neighbor’s cervical vertebrae four, but the muscle around my diaphragm were controlled by C five. And so that's why my voice was reduced to the whispers. Breathing like this, that was, talking like this, and so obviously, I wasn’t going to be finishing any recording project that I was working on unless it was some Marilyn Monroe CD’s or something but because I had a wonderful friend who is a great voice teacher, a vocal coach, she would come and put weight on my stomach, one pound, two pound, three pound, ultimately, up to fifty pounds on my stomach. So that every time I would take a breath, it would essentially make my diaphragm lift the weight. And that would strengthen any muscle that was around my diaphragm. That—to make it stronger and stronger. So that my diaphragm could push against those muscles. And that's ultimately, that and the power of prayer because, boy, I had the whole community on their knees, praying for me. That I would be productive in some way again, that ultimately is what brought my voice back.
Deanne: Wow. And you've been recording ever since, or, did it take a couple of years beyond that? Before you could finally record?
Renee: It took about a year after that. So, my first recording was in, actually, very tail, tail end December 1992. And, they just, my voice has got stronger and you can actually hear on my CD's that I’ve recorded, six , six CD’s and you can hear the progress of my voice, it's interesting how's that happen.
Deanne: Wow. Wow. I’ve just been mesmerize with your music. It’s just been—a lot of your song just, makes me cry. Cause they are just so beautiful. And then you have one song on the current CD that it's actually with your son.
Renee: Yes. That’s six years into our marriage. We made the big old decision that we are going to actively try to start a family, and that's a whole other story. You have to read “The last dance, but not the last song”. My first book, to hear all that story and decision making and the fear, and—but yes, I gave birth to a beautiful baby boy. Naturally, no C section and hey, I didn't feel a thing. Funny, that delivery. But, our son now is seventeen and I have to say, yes, I’m a mother speaking here, but he sings, he's an awesome singer. And, I have to note though, he sing all on this album, the newest—about a year and a half ago, when we were r recording, and he was younger, but now, a year and a half later, he's just doing quite well. So, above this college application and all of that right now, he's already pulling in some music scholarship which is, really wonderful. You’re thinking about majoring in business management or broadcast journalism, and minoring in music.
Deanne: Oh that's wonderful. We gonna have to break away here; as we break away—when we come back from break, we have a clip from one of your songs from one of my favorite songs, from “Eagle Wings”, right? As we come back from break, we will be able to—listen to, listen to singing one of your songs in just a few second. So, let's take a break right now.
<Commercial Break>
Deanne: Welcome back to Today's Inspiring Women. I’m your host, Deanne DeMarco and we are speaking with Renee Bondi who is a quadriplegic, who was in an accident and lost her voice and after four years was able to regain it. Welcome back Renee.
Renee: Thank you Deanne.
Deanne: We've been talking about your music and after four years of—after this bizarre accident it took before you are able to sing again, and, what are the things that you—that we have is for you to have a small clips of one of your songs, for us. Which I am anxious to share with our audience because it's from one of my favorite songs called “On Eagle Wings". Is that the correct title?
Renee: Yes it is. Great. It was a beautiful song written by Micheal Joncas and it was a song that really touches me and kept me going strong through my injury. Hope you'll enjoy it!
Deanne: I will. So let's just take a few second here and listen to “On Eagle Wings"
<Music Playing>
Deanne: That song, always just bring tears to my eyes. I just love this song. And your voice is just so beautiful the way you sound like an angel, the way you're singing that song. I just loved your voice. What a gift.
Renee: Thank you so much. That was one of our biggest fears, when I was first injured, when one of my voice was reduced to whisper and the doctors said that I would never sing again because of my broken neck. And, but—it's just all started to coming back. I’m very grateful.
Deanne: So, sound like you're singing career is back, you're recording.
Renee: Yep.
Deanne: How many albums do you have now?
Renee: I have six CD's, and just starting to think about the next one. And all the music from my CD's, generally speaking, are music to encourage, to inspire, to motivate. Cause that's what I needed, you know, when I first got hurt, a lot of people bought me books to read. And, although I was very grateful for the gift, my fingers don’t work. So it was hard for me to turn the pages and it was hard because I couldn't focus on it. But music, for me, at the hospital room, music permeated my home when I got home from the hospital, and begin to scrape encouragement to me, so that's why I wanted to start recording the music that helps me get through difficult time so that, hopefully would help others.
Deanne: So how—you're a songwriter as well, right?
Renee: Yes, yes, not as much. Last couple of years has been so busy being a wife and a mom and touring and speaking for all kind of event. That I haven't had as much time, and I’m hoping that beginning 2014, that's my goal, is to be able to get back to more writing.
Deanne: Question for you. I mean, since you're quadriplegic, how are you, actually do those, the writing?
Renee: Well, a couple of different ways. I used voice activated software, called “Dragon Naturally Speaking”, that I speak into my computer and that really helps a lot. And because my music training prior to my injury, I’m actually quite good at hearing cord progression in my head, and so I’m able to write down cords using my voice activated software as well.
Deanne: I mean, your whole life has just changed. Because you had an accident. Being things that you are able to do on your own before you now, either needed assistance in some way.
Renee : Yes, I have to be caregiver every morning, for about three to four hours, help me do my range of motion, stretching me so I don’t end up all contorted, transfer me up to a shower chair with wheels that rolls me over the toilet, and then to the shower, and help me to the restroom and they have to shower me, and then roll me back to the bed and transfer me back to the bed, and get me dress, help me put my pants on, and then transfer me up to my power wheelchair that I’m sitting in right now as we speak. And then, help me put a brace on and put some food in front of me so I can feed myself. And then, they on their way, and, our son now is old enough to drive himself to work, to school, and my husband goes to work in the morning as well. And so we have a home office and I have a couple people then, they come in usually about ten or eleven o'clock, and we work on events that I’m invited to speak and sing across the country. Lots of Christian events as well as corporate events and conferences.
Deanne: One of the questions I have for you Renee is how do you deal with—I mean, I’ve would have been really depressed. How did you deal with that depression? We really have about three minutes, so..
Renee: There are four things that I do on a regular basis. And ironically, its spelled dive. D-I-V-E. Ironically cause I was diving off my bed when I broke my head. Broke my head. Broke my neck. The “D” stands for Decide. I have to make constant decision that I want to be joyful. Not everyone wants to get up of their difficult position sometimes or the sad state because they get used to it. And I didn't want to stay there. So “I” made a decision, really early on, and it's a daily decision on what kind of attitude I want to have that day. The I stand for Invite. Invite people into my world, into my life, into my day, to help me through all this. Sometimes a pride gets in the way, we didn't want to ask for help, but I’ve learned that people want to help and they need to serve. They need to help. So early on I had a friend get mad at me when I didn't want her to help me. And she said "Are you kidding me? Please help me!" and so that's when I realized "Oh, they don’t mind!" so invite people to help. The “V” stands for Volunteer. Volunteer to help other people, whatever way you can. Whatever talents you've been given, use them and volunteer to help others. Gets you out of your valley. And then finally the “E”, of DIVE, stands for Enter. Enter into a prayerful life. Once I said "Okay God, I gave this to you". And when I made a real conscious and deliberate decision to have maybe fifteen to twenty minutes of prayer time, boy, did it make a difference. So, Decide, Invite, Volunteer and Enter, a deep prayer life.
Deanne: Wow, that's really wonderful. So, we're running out of time here, I just want to make sure that people know how to get hold of you. How do they get hold of your music? Where do they go to?
Renee: Best way is to ReneeBondi.com. That’s ReneeBondi.com. ReneeBondi.com is the best way. Or you can dial: 1-800-795-5757. 1-800-795-5757.
Deanne: And on that website, you also have—people can buy your book as well, is that right?
Renee: Yes, the “Last dance but not the last song". And my newest book is out, called "Still I will praise - the power of praising God even when you don’t feel like it".
Deanne: Boy, I’ll tell ya, you're just an incredible, incredible, women. We need to wrap this up. Another premier sponsor for the Today's Inspiring Women is Breaking Boundaries International who partners business professionals who wants to create strategies and facilitating results. They work with executives and individuals. The provide , personal coaching, corporate training, and inspiration motivational speaking as well. They can be reach at http://www.Breaking-Boundaries.com or 866-91-COACH. That’s 866-91-COACH. Also for those who are going to be coming into the Chicago end area, April 19th, 2013, there is a Chicago Women's Conference at the Willis Tower in downtown Chicago. Featuring nationally and international respected speakers and workshop leaders offering practical solutions to move you from ideas to action. They can be reach at
www.chicagowomenconference.com. In closing today, we had—just remarkable guest. When—there's a wonderful quote by Oprah Winfrey. Oprah says "When you don’t know what to do, get still. Get very still".
Renee: I totally agree.
Deanne: “Until you know, exactly what to do". This is Deanne DeMarco signing off, hope you'll have a wonderful day until next week, bye for now!
Sabrina Isherwood and Lillian Bjorseth
Personal Branding
Host: Deanne DeMarco
Guest: Sabrina Isherwood, CMO Chiro One
Lillian Bjorseth, Author, Networking Expert
Deanne: Welcome to Today’s Inspiring Women. I’m your host, Deanne DeMarco. If you are ready to take the next step to become inspired, motivated and better equipped for success stayed tuned. We have got two dynamite speakers for you today.
My first guest is Sabrina Isherwood. And, Sabrina is a Senior Global Marketing and Sales Executive who has experience in the international and US markets. She has extensive experience in the US, Caribbean, Latin America, European and Asian market place. She has worked for companies such as; Kraft International, Welch’s International, William Wrigley Jr. and Cancer Treatment Centers of America. Today Isherwood is with the fastest growing Chiropractic Health Care Organization in the world. I am so thrilled to introduce you to Sabrina. Sabrina welcome.
Sabrina: Thank you, Deanne it’s great to be with you.
Deanne: I am just so excited that you have decided to join us today. What a powerful background you have! I mean working for companies like Kraft and Welch’s and Wrigley. Holy Smokes! How did you get started?
Sabrina: Well it was interesting I worked full time all through school. Actually, from the time I was twelve I had my first job. But, all through my under grad and my graduate studies I was working full time. I was working on my International MBA I was actually at General Motors in Pontiac Michigan. I was just a lowly sort of data entry clerk
in a cubicle, working crazy hours because they allowed me that flexibility which was perfect for a full time student. They didn’t really care when the work got done. Just come in when you can around your class schedule or around your homework schedule and get everything done. When I was getting ready to get my degree in just a couple of weeks out from graduating with my degree. I had the courage to walk down the hall and knock on the door of the VP of International. I sort of thought this was special. You know, I’ve got this International MBA…I don’t know if you know who I am, kind of that sort of thing. He was just a fantastic guy and was, I guess a little impressed with my naiveté and my bodacious and courageous demeanor that I would just knock on his door and sort of introduce myself. I ended up being in their International Marketing Program and in several short weeks on my way to South America with General Motors. That was just a huge sort of, you know in the right place at the right time. He happened to be in his office when I knocked on the door. He probably wouldn’t have responded to a “post it” the same way. That was really the start of it all which was back I guess in 1988 after I got my post graduate Degree.
Deanne: Well, that just shows that you have to take control of your own future.
Sabrina: Right, right and then you know you’ve gotta not be afraid….sure he’s got a stack of Harvard MBAs sitting on his desk, but I’m here right now.
Deanne: Right. Your experience in the International world as a female executive is something really to take note of. There’s got to have been some very challenging times that you have faced in working in International markets. Tell us about some of those. How did you break through the boundaries and barriers with some of those challenges?
Sabrina: Certainly, both as an American and then as a six foot tall female American certainly you run into a lot of those barriers. I think that the best advice that I would have on something like that is really just seek to understand that culture. And I don’t mean just in a one piece document that you can download off of the internet. But really get deep into the culture. Find meaningful elements of that culture to really embrace. And, go deeper into that expertise than anyone would ever expect you to. They are gonna expect this American Executive to sort of fly in and fly out, take care of business and then be on their way. What I would regularly do and this is some advice that I received very early on in my career. I would go in two days early and I would hit the museums and I would make sure that I went to…not the sort of touristy place of attraction but really the rich cultural attractions. I knew where the gardens were and I had been to the historical monuments. I had studies their important historical figures. That allowed me in conversation and sort of in those warm up little mixers that you’re at with your partners to speak to things that were near and dear to their heart. Frankly, they were surprised that I would have taken the time to have that understanding. All of a sudden we’re connected on a deeper level and all of a sudden I know stuff about your writers, something about your teachers and about your historical figures that you didn’t expect me to know. We’re able to sort of have this respect for each other and leap frog into the relationship more so than we would have done previously. You know in many cultures you’re immediately discounted because you are female. You need to come to the table with, not only that cultural context but also certainly the knowledge and the expertise and the intellectual horse power. At the same time, don’t think that you are going to necessarily belly up to the bar with boys just as you do here in the states. In some cultures that will work. In other cultures you have to manage it differently. I think that just really being super sensitive to that and to those nuances is huge in your ability to be impactful and effective and successful over the long haul.
Deanne: Wow! I know one of the things that you talk about is personal brand. What is the role that personal brand plays for both the cooperate as well as the entrepreneurial woman?
Sabrina: I am huge on that. I talk about that every single day. I really believe that it all starts and ends with that. It is everything because it sets you apart and it allows you to truly differentiate yourself from the competition. If you think about this world that we live in and you think about brands and marketing and the competitive advantage that you are looking for as an executive in the workplaces as an example if we just use the workplace as an example, you have to be able to define yourself and really define who you are. What are your unique abilities? If you can sum yourself up in a single word or a single concept…people refer to me as the “Brand Savant” because I walk it, I talk it, I preach about it, I coach about it. I can tell you in just a few words what it is that I can bring to the table. If I am riding up the elevator and I happen to make a connection then I’m gonna tell you, I’m your “go to girl” on X,Y and Z. That’s what I really encourage individuals to do to be able to articulate that. The flip side of that is to understand how you come off, because how I am intending my brand to be perceived may not be exactly how it’s being perceived. I may “think” this is how everybody is thinking about me but actually…No Sabrina, they are thinking X, Y, and Z. You have to sort of survey your audience and survey the customer of your brand and understand, how are other people thinking about me. What sort of impressions am I making on them, whether it’s in business or it’s your neighbors? You have to be top of mind about it just as any brand in management would be and really take the time to speak with different people and understand how they perceive your strengths and where they think your power alley is. Then try to speak to that when you’re articulating your own brand. It’s everything from your business cards to how your resume reads to how you dress to the language that you use. What is the word choice that you use? I mean I’ve seen people walk into a room and their presence was really quite attention getting until they opened their mouth. Then they ruined it because they don’t have a good command and they speak however it is that they speak and I am not talking about a foreign language accent, I’m just talking about not really being able to command the English language. Certainly I have seen vice versa as well. Someone can really bring the intellectual horse power and then be a disaster when you go to break bread with them and you’re in a dinner situation. I mean its 1000 details and 1000 possible opinions that all roll up to make your brand.
Deanne: So part of building your personal brand is about taking stock and being willing to get honest feedback from others.
Sabrina: Oh, absolutely! You have to have the confidence and I would say as confidants at various levels, people who are above you, people who are below you, your peers where you can speak frankly and have that sober honest conversation.
Deanne: Yeah, because you are right I mean how we see the world or how we think other people might see us might be totally different than what they actually see. Part of that is just being honest with ourselves and say, okay, how do I come across?’ What are you seeing? Maybe even asking people what your strengths are as they see it.
Sabrina: Exactly, exactly because you might think that you’re strong in a certain area and if you don’t understand the competitive benchmark and what other people have worked with. I have had that situation before, where somebody will say, “I’m a really great writer.” Then I looked at their writing samples and I am very honest with them. I’ll say I understand that you think you’re a great writer, I’m not sure who told you that but I’ve worked with great writers and this is not great writing. If you want to be a great writer we can talk about how one goes about doing that, but right now, right here, today you are not a good writer.
Deanne: Wow, yeah and a lot of times that’s hard for people to hear.
Sabrina: Sure.
Deanne: It is important for people to ask for honest feedback.
Sabrina: That’s why you have to be very sincere about wanting to do that. It’s the same in business. I’m very big on Net Promoter Score, really doing your research with your customer. What was that customer’s experience like? What was that patient experience like? If you don’t want to hear the brutal truth then don’t ask the question. You have to have your “big boy pants” on to really be able to hear that.
Deanne: Right, so how does one go about, besides asking for feedback, how do you go about building a personal brand?
Sabrina: Well, I think it is just really being present and cognizant about those different elements and certainly making sure that’s all integrated and it’s all consistent. How my business card looks and how I dress and how I speak and how I conduct myself is all very consistent. You have to be mindful of all of those interactions. It’s not just how you come across to the CEO. It’s also how you come across to the cleaning lady. How do you come across to the guy whose four levels below you on the chain of command? How are you helping them and how are you giving back to them? Because, it can’t just all be take, take, take, right?
Deanne: Wow, yeah you are absolutely right. We need to break away for a break here for just a minute. This is Deanne DeMarco and I’m talking with Sabrina Isherwood who is the current Chief Marketing Officer for Chiro One Wellness Centers the fastest growing chiropractic healthcare organization in the world. We’ll get back to you in just a minute.
Deanne: This is Deanne DeMarco and we are with Today’s Inspiring Women. Right now we are speaking with Sabrina Isherwood who is the Chief Marketing Officer for Chiro One Wellness Centers.
Sabrina, we were talking about personal brand just before the break. One of the questions that I have is what do you do if you tarnish your personal brand? How do you fix it?
Sabrina: It’s a great question and it can happen to the best of us. I mean we see brand disasters in the media every day with products and services and certainly we see brand disasters with individuals as well. I really think it’s a question of just PR 101, Public Relations 101. You have to acknowledge the err and really be specific and demonstrate your compassion, your empathy, and your sincere regret. Then you carefully rebuild. I think that you really have to be thoughtful and purposeful with every single decision. That’s everything from which you align yourself with to how you deliver a specific plan or how you receive bad news, right. Don’t they say we fear truth colors in our worst moments? When things are great everybody can sort of be in a positive place with positive energy. But when things are really hitting the fan and stuff is in the basement then how are we handling that? How are we behaving and modeling the desired leadership qualities that we want to see in others, when the heat is really on? It’s one encounter, one transaction, and one relationship at a time. Each one is important and has to be handled in a branded way. It’s everything from sort of missteps in your career to missteps at a company party Saturday night when somebody’s had too much to drink. You have to just be very, very, intentional and very certain. I think, be true to yourself. That’s where I would start when it comes to how to repair that.
Deanne: I’ve got a question that just came to my mind. Men versus women…do women have to do things differently from personal brand than men do?
Sabrina: I think that men are more forgiven and easier to forgive when there is a misstep or a violation of the brand within sort of the male ranks, if you will. Females are not as easily forgiven; neither do they as easily forgive. I do think that the standard is higher. I don’t think that that is necessarily a bad thing. Is it different? Yes. Are their rules different? My experience is, yes. Other people might have a different experience. But, my experience is, yes.
Deanne: Is there anything that we need to learn from our male counterparts in the business world?
Sabrina: Yeah, for sure, I hate to make generalizations but I’m gonna make on right now. Historically I think men have done a better job of supporting each other, of believing in each other and of being an advocate for one another. I think that we as woman, we are getting better at that but I still think we have a long way to go. On the whole I think that men do a better job of tapping into their competitive spirit. They’re smart, they’re risk taking, they’re collaborative and certainly a lot of us woman are, but I think that men wear that on their sleeve more. They’re more comfortable with that, unless you are talking about athletes. I just hired an amazing young woman and one of the things that I just loved about her is she is this competitive volley ball player. There was just this different energy about her as soon as she walked in the door. No apologies, I’m competitive and I’ll take you down and she walks through the door just full of this great power and energy. I just loved that. Woman rarely wear that on their sleeve the way that men do. I think that men are more confident and they also concentrate on what they have versus what they lack. Which is what I think is a great aspect and attribute that woman can learn from them.
Deanne: Wow, so what advice or counsel would you have for women in general who are trying to climb the cooperate ladder or just entering the cooperate work places of any size, of any size company?
Sabrina: I think that you have to bring your best game every single day. I think that…and this is going to sound like it’s a little bit conflicted to what I was just speaking about with being competitive because I am all about bellying up and being strong and being competitive but I also think that you have to be kind. I don’t think that you are inherently conflicted. I think you have to be kind to those who came before you, to those who you are transitioning out of the organization. When we come in and we’re sort of just making these big changes and we’re being bold you can’t forget to sprinkle that with a pretty heavy dose of kindness.
Deanne: Wow, that’s good advice. You’re with Chiro One. I happen to love Chiro One. I have seen tremendous results. Our l istening audience may not know who Chiro One is and may not know how Chiro One is different than other Chiropractic providers. Can you give us a little bit of information on that?
Sabrina: Yeah, absolutely. Chiro One Wellness Centers is a wellness based network of Chiropractic offices. We are 78 clinics across three states. There is a little bit of a difference between wellness based chiropractic and more acute symptom based chiropractic. Certainly we see all sorts of patients and people with a myriad of complaints. But, our goal is to not just address and adjusts for the acute pain or symptom but to be able to have a deeper understanding of what is causing the pain or symptom to address that and then optimize the individual’s performance even more. It is really more a life style and philosophy base versus I’ve got a pinched nerve can you fix that and then be on your way.
Deanne: I know my husband and I have both seen great results going to Chiro One.
Sabrina: I’m so happy to hear that, that’s great!
Deanne: Yeah, both of us have. So we’re talking about branding now so what is your vision as far as branding with Chiro One?
Sabrina: Well, I mean, it’s huge! {Laughter} Our vision at Chiro One is that all human beings discover their full potential. When you put some people who don’t know us, I believe that you know us, Deanne that might sound a little lofty or a little “pie in the sky” at first but it is an amazing vision. I’ve been able to whole-heartedly get behind it. My extension of that vision as CMO is to make sure that we are carrying out that cooperate vision in a world class branded way. That means that we are able to penetrate new markets. We are able to expand in a manner that allows us to impact more families and transform more lives and really to assure that we continue in the van guard of wellness both in this US market and abroad. We really want to be and we are at the center of changing face of health and wellness and being a part of that solution. As you know, or you may not know, there are countless markets and countries where Chiropractic is relatively unknown, they’ve never heard of it. They don’t really know what it is. We have an opportunity to really go in and educate and enroll and transform lives all over the world. From a market potential in a healthcare opportunity it’s just an amazing thing when you think about the impact that this profession can have. We have barely scratched the surface.
Deanne: Wow, sounds like an exciting opportunity.
Sabrina: Yeah, it really is.
Deanne: Now you are also on faculty for the University of Chicago, right?
Sabrina: Yes, I am.
Deanne: What do you teach there?
Sabrina: I teach a course to graduate students called Managing Integrated Marketing Communications. It’s an advanced course and I absolutely love it. I’ve been doing it for a couple of years now. The courses are very intense and my syllabus is particularly heavy. I am all about customer satisfaction. I want to make sure my students are really getting their money’s worth. I try to cram a lot into these terms. My students are just so smart and I think to myself, oh my gosh was I that smart when I was their age. I am pretty sure I know what that answer is. It is really very satisfying to me because it gives me an opportunity three or four times a year, I guess four times a year that my course is offered in downtown Chicago at the University to reach out and give back to young and upcoming marketers. I think that we all have a responsibility to pay it forward and to give back to that community and to help younger marketers and younger executive who are coming up. Give them some of the more practical real world experience and lessons that we’ve garnered over the years versus just the theoretical that they’re gonna pick up in their books and in their case studies.
Deanne: We have like one minute left before break again. Are there any last words or advice that you would have for our audience?
Sabrina: Yeah, absolutely. I think to females in the business place what I would
is we have to be particularly strong and smart and resourceful and really be purposeful and make good choices both about the person and the executive that we want to become. I am just incredibly thankful for the mentors and the coaches that I’ve had and I continue to have. I continue to reach out to them and to learn from them, right, because we’re always learning if we’re smart. I think that if we prioritize that and if we take time, and I know it sounds really cliché but if we take time to sort of extend that hand or offer someone the coaching and the helping hand and the feedback and the honest conversation. Have the sober honest conversation so that someone can understand their reality. Then, I think that that’s time really well spent.
Deanne: Wow, time has just flown by. Sabrina, we are out of time. I would like to thank you very much for coming on Today’s Inspiring Women. You have truly inspired us with your comments.
So after break stick with me this is Deanne De Marco with Today’s Inspiring Women and our next guest is Lillian Bjorseth. Talk to you soon.
This is Deanne DeMarco with Today’s Inspiring Woman and today we are talking with Lillian Bjorseth in this segment of this show. Lillian I have known for a while. Lillian is a bright and charismatic networking diva. She is Miss Networking. Lillian has worked and played politics in the cooperate courier offices and in the trenches and has been in the entrepreneurial battlefield. She knows what it takes professionally to be a winner and how to build relationships that last. She is the networking expert. Her book is, Breakthrough Networking Building Relationships That Last. Lillian is a graduate from the University of Missouri School of Journalism. Her Fortune 100 Experience includes 11 years with AT&T where she coached top executives in communications and media relation skills. Welcome Lillian to Today’s Inspiring Women!
Lillian: Thank you for having me Deanne, it is my pleasure!
Deanne: I’m glad you decided to come aboard on this show. You started out with AT&T and then you became an entrepreneur. How long have you been an entrepreneur?
Lillian: For a little over 20 years.
Deanne: To be a successful entrepreneur for over 20 years that is quite undertaking. What were some of your biggest challenges as an entrepreneur?
Lillian: Well, I’m just gonna repeat the same word marketing, marketing, marketing.
Deanne: Ah I know you are known for this verbal business card. I know I have a printed business card and I use that everywhere and I always make sure I have 15 or 20 of them in my purse or my briefcase to hand out. But you have this thing called the verbal business card what is that ? Tell us more about that.
Lillian: Sure, well the verbal business card is something that you carry within you, if you will, because the verbal business card you explain through words. It’s a spoken one. A lot of people carry a printed card but I’m disappointed to say not everyone because I run into a lot of circumstances where people don’t have their printed business cards with them because they’ve run out, or so many, many, myriad reasons you know why. There is really never an excuse for you not to have the verbal business card because as long as you can speak you should be able to give your verbal business card. Having said that that doesn’t always work successfully for people either, because, sometimes people start to say it, But they have oos and ahs and ums you know when somebody says what do you do. That’s why the first thing right out of the shoot, Deanne that you have to remove from your verbal business card, because if you um and ah when someone asks you what you do you don’t instill confidence in them.
Deanne: So, why do people need a verbal business card?
Lillian: Why they need it is that, it’s what interests people in talking with you. It lets people know quickly what’s in it for them. That is such a big thing. I hate to tell you this but when people meet you they really don’t care that much about you they care about what you can do for them. Or, what you can do for people they know. The other thing is, when you do it correctly it helps you share with people in what I call lay language, easily understandable language of what you do. Sometimes I talk with people and after a few minutes I still have no idea what they do. That is a shame. Because you have wasted those vital first few minutes in a conversation without people even knowing what you do. The way I want you to envision a verbal business card is that you are fishing. You have your line in the water and you have a hook on the end of that line but you are missing one important ingredient. What do you think that is needed to catch the fish?
Deanne: The bait.
Lillian: Absolutely! So, your verbal business card is your bait on your hook that reels people in to talk with you.
Deanne: Is there just one type or one kind of verbal business card?
Lillian: I’ve come up with three of them and it’s a process, by the way, that I did develop because people were having difficulty in what I call, simply articulated what they do. There are three of them that I’ve come up with. One is the generic version. The generic version is what you use when your, let’s say at a Chamber of Commerce luncheon and you might be sitting or meeting people, sitting with or meeting people who don’t really understand your business. So, it is a generic way in lay language to let them know what you do. A second version is the industry version. That’s when you are with people who do the same thing you do whether it’s being a printer, an IT person, an engineer and you can use jargon because people understand the jargon. Then the third version is the cooperate or your company version. That’s particularly relevant if you work for a company that has multi-offices, like I did with AT&T. you have certain lingo within the company that you can use when you meet people.
Deanne: Can you give me an example of what a good verbal business card sounds like?
Lillian: Sure, let me share with you in reality a client that came to me, and of course I won’t use his name. He was a psychologist and he would say something like, I’m John and I’m a psychologist. He was trying to reach people in transition. He said to them I do stress management programs to help you get over the stress in your career especially when you lose your job. He said to me, “Lillian, people are backing away from me rather than coming in to talk with me.” So, I ask a few people, I gave them that card and I said, “What is it about it that would most turn you off?” Interesting enough it was the word psychologist because for people out of work they didn’t want to feel you know…one of them said to me, “Gee, now I lost my job and now I have to go see a shrink?” So anyway we changed it. It was kind of an interesting situation because he was trying to convince his father that he couldn’t get his PHD. So, your psychologist on your card is your backup, if you will. It’s your reinforcement, it’s your credibility. But what we changed it for him to say is, “I’m John and I’ve developed a 3 point program to help take your career to a new level.” Interesting enough he also attracted people who were not out of work because people who had a job were also interested in learning how they could take their career to a new level.
I also have another quick one from a woman…I did some work at Motorola. I said to her, “What do you do?” And, she said, “I’m a software engineer.” And, I said, “How many software engineers does Motorola have?” And, she said, “A lot.” So I said, “Why don’t you share with me what you do?” It turns out after talking that what she did is she helped write software to help 911 dispatch officers do their job, which was much more informative than saying I’m a software engineer because now I could identify with her, which I couldn’t with a software engineer because I don’t know much about software engineering. I said to her, “You could also say that I help write software that could save your life.” She said, “Yeah, I’m not quite as comfortable with that.”
The verbal business card has to suit your behavior or your personality style as well. One size doesn’t fit all.
Deanne: So, are there certain components that must be included in a verbal business card?
Lillian: Yes. I was listening to your previous interview and talking about how do you establish your brand. This will be helpful to people because I am actually going to give you a formula to write this verbal business card or those first few words that come out of your mouth, if you will. What you want to include first of all, first and foremost is your name because even though people may know your name they may forget it. You know you can have a senior moment when you are 20 and the name just goes right out the other end of you, if you will.
Anytime you meet someone in a networking situation, in any type of situation you want a make it as easy for them as possible. So you repeat your name. Or, with a name like “Bjorseth” I know that people don’t necessarily know how to pronounce that. They get confused with the “J” etc. So, you include your first and last name. You also then include what you do. People seldom say do you…they don’t come up to you and say, who are you? How do you do what you do? They say “what” do you do. So many of us tell people “who” we are or “how” we do it. we really need to work on the “what”. To get to the “what” you include a benefit. You know people buy benefits, they don’t buy features. You don’t buy a stove because it’s three feet high and it’s white. Why do you buy a stove?
Deanne: To cook on.
Lillian: That’s right! If you want to find out from other people is what is it you do that cooks their food because people don’t like to eat sushi all the time. When you can tell someone you’ve met how you can cook their food. They’re gonna be interested in talking further with you. You have to have benefits in there not features. I do a whole series of exercises to help people understand the difference between benefits and features because that can be difficult.
Then the last ingredient, to get the benefit, you have to use active verbs, because they are the most powerful words in the English language. If we go back to English and I know you enjoy English as much as I did. I am not talking about those linking verbs like is, are, was, were. I am talking about words like create, connect, educate, design whatever it is you do that people can feel because then if you give them touchy, feely words they can begin to identify with what you do.
Deanne: Excellent. We have to break away here at this moment. This is Deanne DeMarco at Today’s Inspiring Women. We are speaking to Lillian Bjorseth who is helping us build our brand by using a verbal business card. I’ll be back in just a few minutes.
This is Deanne DeMarco with Today’s Inspiring Women. We are speaking with Lillian Bjorseth and today we are talking about building your brand and Lillian is helping us with building our brand through using the verbal business card. Just before break we talked about some of the things that must be included in the verbal business card. We talked about including your name, first name and last name, what you do, the benefits in using action verbs. Those are all the things that need to be included in the verbal business card, correct, Lillian?
Lillian: That’s correct.
Deanne: Okay, so what would be things that you would “not” want to include in the verbal business card.
Lillian: There are some that are marginal and then there are some that are no nos. Marginal may be your company name, unless your company name is well known like it was when I was with AT&T, I don’t use my company name. Because, now it’s Duo Force Enterprises. People would just stand there and wonder what a Duo Force is. You don’t want to give them anything that might confuse them or take their attention away from what you are saying. The company location is typically not important because the verbal business card is only about a sentence or two and it only last 10 to 15 seconds. You don’t need to share with people where you’re located, particularly if you are at a local event. You also stay away from adjectives and adverbs because they modify and usually that modification is of your own design. You know, you’re the best at this, you do this, but you know how that turns people off. So you stay away from those most times. What you definitely stay away from is a company title. You don’t introduce yourself as a trainer, as a speaker, as someone who sells insurance, as an attorney because…in fact, research shows that if you say that you’re an attorney or that you are in insurance people actually step away from you rather than into the conversation.
Deanne: Really!
Lillian: People don’t want to talk with you about insurance. So you have to tell people you help build a nest egg or you make sure they can educate their children, that type of thing because that appeals to the person, but saying you sell insurance does not. In life insurance then people think about dying or long term care. Those are not pleasant thoughts. If you are in a business like that you have to work around those words. Another no no is how you do it.
Deanne: Give me an example of that.
Lillian: The example of it you know my business would be, I help people build a new kind of wealth, social capitol by improving their networking and communication skills. That’s what I do. How I do it is as the trainer, speaker, coach you know. That doesn’t say anything because if I say that I am a trainer or a speaker, I haven’t told the other person anything. I could be, you know a personal trainer, or I could be an animal trainer. I could be a software trainer. So, you want to be more specific so you stay away from that labeling and how you do it. Then of course you have to avoid industry jargon. That jargon that, you know that one word that you can say that encapsulates a whole thought when you are speaking with someone who understands it, but who left the person cold if they don’t know what you are talking about.
Deanne: Hm, interesting.
Lillian: The reason you stay away from the how is that’s the purpose of the whole verbal business card is that it should illicit one question and that is, “How do you do what you do?’ if I say I help you build more social…a different kind of wealth, social capitol you want to say to me well, how do you do that. Or, how do I build social capitol? That is the purpose of the verbal business card for people.
Deanne: So, they come back and ask you more questions.
Lillian; Exactly! And, then guess what? You now have permission they’ve given you permission then to tell them how you do it and more about what you do. Hopefully, you have stimulated their interest.
Deanne: Sure, that’s the fishing analogy. You throw your line in you’re giving them the bait and then now they’ve taken the bait that’s given you permission for you to give them more information.
Lillian: Exactly, so that you can “hook em”, if you will.
Deanne: Oh, that is sweet!
Lillian: When you hook em that means you’re gonna get business or at least you are going to get an appointment.
Deanne: Really good. Are there any situations that come into play with the verbal business card?
Lillian: What do you mean situations?
Deanne: Well, is there…you may or may not include something depending on the type of situation that you’re in?
Lillian: Yeah, as I said, it depends on your audience that generic audience, the company audience, the industry audience. I use the generic a lot, obviously when I’m working with groups who don’t understand what I do, who aren’t doing what I do, I use the generic one. So, when I teach people that, I always teach them the generic one, because, that’s by far the hardest one to do. That’s where you have to reduce it all to lay language. It’s really difficult to say what you do simply. There is so much going on when you first meet people and you’re talking and you know…the whole listening process because people are thinking about other things, their looking at you, their first impression, how are you acting, what do have on and all of that. So, you have to make the words as simple yet as meaningful as possible. So that when the interaction is over you are memorable and meaningful.
Deanne: Hm, interesting. One of the things that you have written is this wonderfulbook called Breakthrough Networking Building Relationships that Last and it’s in its’ third edition.
Lillian: Yes.
Deanne: That’s very impressive.
Lillian: Thank you.
Deanne: What is that book about?
Lillian: Well, that has a myriad of networking tips. It has the process in there on the verbal business card. When I speak about and think about networking I think about what you do before the event, how you work the event and what you do afterwords. That’s how the book is broken down. How do you prepare for an event? It can even can be a meeting. How you can work it, so there’s all sorts of tips about you know arriving early and the whole process of meeting people. I have a 10 minute rule, networking rule. I break that 10 minute rule down into an introduction, a body and a conclusion. Then I have something else I created an “ask for question and listen for answer”. The idea being that anytime you meet people whether you’re in an airplane or a person to person event you have questions you asked to determine if they are potential prospects for you or for someone you know. Then you listen to their answers, by the way they answer you will know. So, if you use that process you should never leave an interaction with another person without knowing whether that person is worth following up with for you.
Deanne: Got a question for you. If people want some additional help on creating this verbal business card can they call you or get coached from you?
Lillian: They sure can.
Deanne: All right, what is the best way for people to get hold of you?
Lillian: The phone number is 630-983-5308. My website is simply http://www.duoforce.com.
Deanne: And that was 630-983-5308 and that was at duoforce.com?
Lillian: Right or they can Google Lillian Bjorseth and they’ll get thousands of entries.
Deanne: Wonderful.
Lillian: All my information is there.
Deanne: Well, this segment just flew by again. Lillian I thank you very much for being part of Today’s Inspiring Women.
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As we are wrapping up this session I want to give you a quote from Ellen DeGeneres, which I happen to love. She says “Sometimes you can’t see yourself clearly until you see yourself through the eyes of others.”
This is Deanne DeMarco with Today’s Inspiring Women until next time. Have a wonderful week. Bye for now.
Guest: Sabrina Isherwood, CMO Chiro One
Lillian Bjorseth, Author, Networking Expert
Deanne: Welcome to Today’s Inspiring Women. I’m your host, Deanne DeMarco. If you are ready to take the next step to become inspired, motivated and better equipped for success stayed tuned. We have got two dynamite speakers for you today.
My first guest is Sabrina Isherwood. And, Sabrina is a Senior Global Marketing and Sales Executive who has experience in the international and US markets. She has extensive experience in the US, Caribbean, Latin America, European and Asian market place. She has worked for companies such as; Kraft International, Welch’s International, William Wrigley Jr. and Cancer Treatment Centers of America. Today Isherwood is with the fastest growing Chiropractic Health Care Organization in the world. I am so thrilled to introduce you to Sabrina. Sabrina welcome.
Sabrina: Thank you, Deanne it’s great to be with you.
Deanne: I am just so excited that you have decided to join us today. What a powerful background you have! I mean working for companies like Kraft and Welch’s and Wrigley. Holy Smokes! How did you get started?
Sabrina: Well it was interesting I worked full time all through school. Actually, from the time I was twelve I had my first job. But, all through my under grad and my graduate studies I was working full time. I was working on my International MBA I was actually at General Motors in Pontiac Michigan. I was just a lowly sort of data entry clerk
in a cubicle, working crazy hours because they allowed me that flexibility which was perfect for a full time student. They didn’t really care when the work got done. Just come in when you can around your class schedule or around your homework schedule and get everything done. When I was getting ready to get my degree in just a couple of weeks out from graduating with my degree. I had the courage to walk down the hall and knock on the door of the VP of International. I sort of thought this was special. You know, I’ve got this International MBA…I don’t know if you know who I am, kind of that sort of thing. He was just a fantastic guy and was, I guess a little impressed with my naiveté and my bodacious and courageous demeanor that I would just knock on his door and sort of introduce myself. I ended up being in their International Marketing Program and in several short weeks on my way to South America with General Motors. That was just a huge sort of, you know in the right place at the right time. He happened to be in his office when I knocked on the door. He probably wouldn’t have responded to a “post it” the same way. That was really the start of it all which was back I guess in 1988 after I got my post graduate Degree.
Deanne: Well, that just shows that you have to take control of your own future.
Sabrina: Right, right and then you know you’ve gotta not be afraid….sure he’s got a stack of Harvard MBAs sitting on his desk, but I’m here right now.
Deanne: Right. Your experience in the International world as a female executive is something really to take note of. There’s got to have been some very challenging times that you have faced in working in International markets. Tell us about some of those. How did you break through the boundaries and barriers with some of those challenges?
Sabrina: Certainly, both as an American and then as a six foot tall female American certainly you run into a lot of those barriers. I think that the best advice that I would have on something like that is really just seek to understand that culture. And I don’t mean just in a one piece document that you can download off of the internet. But really get deep into the culture. Find meaningful elements of that culture to really embrace. And, go deeper into that expertise than anyone would ever expect you to. They are gonna expect this American Executive to sort of fly in and fly out, take care of business and then be on their way. What I would regularly do and this is some advice that I received very early on in my career. I would go in two days early and I would hit the museums and I would make sure that I went to…not the sort of touristy place of attraction but really the rich cultural attractions. I knew where the gardens were and I had been to the historical monuments. I had studies their important historical figures. That allowed me in conversation and sort of in those warm up little mixers that you’re at with your partners to speak to things that were near and dear to their heart. Frankly, they were surprised that I would have taken the time to have that understanding. All of a sudden we’re connected on a deeper level and all of a sudden I know stuff about your writers, something about your teachers and about your historical figures that you didn’t expect me to know. We’re able to sort of have this respect for each other and leap frog into the relationship more so than we would have done previously. You know in many cultures you’re immediately discounted because you are female. You need to come to the table with, not only that cultural context but also certainly the knowledge and the expertise and the intellectual horse power. At the same time, don’t think that you are going to necessarily belly up to the bar with boys just as you do here in the states. In some cultures that will work. In other cultures you have to manage it differently. I think that just really being super sensitive to that and to those nuances is huge in your ability to be impactful and effective and successful over the long haul.
Deanne: Wow! I know one of the things that you talk about is personal brand. What is the role that personal brand plays for both the cooperate as well as the entrepreneurial woman?
Sabrina: I am huge on that. I talk about that every single day. I really believe that it all starts and ends with that. It is everything because it sets you apart and it allows you to truly differentiate yourself from the competition. If you think about this world that we live in and you think about brands and marketing and the competitive advantage that you are looking for as an executive in the workplaces as an example if we just use the workplace as an example, you have to be able to define yourself and really define who you are. What are your unique abilities? If you can sum yourself up in a single word or a single concept…people refer to me as the “Brand Savant” because I walk it, I talk it, I preach about it, I coach about it. I can tell you in just a few words what it is that I can bring to the table. If I am riding up the elevator and I happen to make a connection then I’m gonna tell you, I’m your “go to girl” on X,Y and Z. That’s what I really encourage individuals to do to be able to articulate that. The flip side of that is to understand how you come off, because how I am intending my brand to be perceived may not be exactly how it’s being perceived. I may “think” this is how everybody is thinking about me but actually…No Sabrina, they are thinking X, Y, and Z. You have to sort of survey your audience and survey the customer of your brand and understand, how are other people thinking about me. What sort of impressions am I making on them, whether it’s in business or it’s your neighbors? You have to be top of mind about it just as any brand in management would be and really take the time to speak with different people and understand how they perceive your strengths and where they think your power alley is. Then try to speak to that when you’re articulating your own brand. It’s everything from your business cards to how your resume reads to how you dress to the language that you use. What is the word choice that you use? I mean I’ve seen people walk into a room and their presence was really quite attention getting until they opened their mouth. Then they ruined it because they don’t have a good command and they speak however it is that they speak and I am not talking about a foreign language accent, I’m just talking about not really being able to command the English language. Certainly I have seen vice versa as well. Someone can really bring the intellectual horse power and then be a disaster when you go to break bread with them and you’re in a dinner situation. I mean its 1000 details and 1000 possible opinions that all roll up to make your brand.
Deanne: So part of building your personal brand is about taking stock and being willing to get honest feedback from others.
Sabrina: Oh, absolutely! You have to have the confidence and I would say as confidants at various levels, people who are above you, people who are below you, your peers where you can speak frankly and have that sober honest conversation.
Deanne: Yeah, because you are right I mean how we see the world or how we think other people might see us might be totally different than what they actually see. Part of that is just being honest with ourselves and say, okay, how do I come across?’ What are you seeing? Maybe even asking people what your strengths are as they see it.
Sabrina: Exactly, exactly because you might think that you’re strong in a certain area and if you don’t understand the competitive benchmark and what other people have worked with. I have had that situation before, where somebody will say, “I’m a really great writer.” Then I looked at their writing samples and I am very honest with them. I’ll say I understand that you think you’re a great writer, I’m not sure who told you that but I’ve worked with great writers and this is not great writing. If you want to be a great writer we can talk about how one goes about doing that, but right now, right here, today you are not a good writer.
Deanne: Wow, yeah and a lot of times that’s hard for people to hear.
Sabrina: Sure.
Deanne: It is important for people to ask for honest feedback.
Sabrina: That’s why you have to be very sincere about wanting to do that. It’s the same in business. I’m very big on Net Promoter Score, really doing your research with your customer. What was that customer’s experience like? What was that patient experience like? If you don’t want to hear the brutal truth then don’t ask the question. You have to have your “big boy pants” on to really be able to hear that.
Deanne: Right, so how does one go about, besides asking for feedback, how do you go about building a personal brand?
Sabrina: Well, I think it is just really being present and cognizant about those different elements and certainly making sure that’s all integrated and it’s all consistent. How my business card looks and how I dress and how I speak and how I conduct myself is all very consistent. You have to be mindful of all of those interactions. It’s not just how you come across to the CEO. It’s also how you come across to the cleaning lady. How do you come across to the guy whose four levels below you on the chain of command? How are you helping them and how are you giving back to them? Because, it can’t just all be take, take, take, right?
Deanne: Wow, yeah you are absolutely right. We need to break away for a break here for just a minute. This is Deanne DeMarco and I’m talking with Sabrina Isherwood who is the current Chief Marketing Officer for Chiro One Wellness Centers the fastest growing chiropractic healthcare organization in the world. We’ll get back to you in just a minute.
Deanne: This is Deanne DeMarco and we are with Today’s Inspiring Women. Right now we are speaking with Sabrina Isherwood who is the Chief Marketing Officer for Chiro One Wellness Centers.
Sabrina, we were talking about personal brand just before the break. One of the questions that I have is what do you do if you tarnish your personal brand? How do you fix it?
Sabrina: It’s a great question and it can happen to the best of us. I mean we see brand disasters in the media every day with products and services and certainly we see brand disasters with individuals as well. I really think it’s a question of just PR 101, Public Relations 101. You have to acknowledge the err and really be specific and demonstrate your compassion, your empathy, and your sincere regret. Then you carefully rebuild. I think that you really have to be thoughtful and purposeful with every single decision. That’s everything from which you align yourself with to how you deliver a specific plan or how you receive bad news, right. Don’t they say we fear truth colors in our worst moments? When things are great everybody can sort of be in a positive place with positive energy. But when things are really hitting the fan and stuff is in the basement then how are we handling that? How are we behaving and modeling the desired leadership qualities that we want to see in others, when the heat is really on? It’s one encounter, one transaction, and one relationship at a time. Each one is important and has to be handled in a branded way. It’s everything from sort of missteps in your career to missteps at a company party Saturday night when somebody’s had too much to drink. You have to just be very, very, intentional and very certain. I think, be true to yourself. That’s where I would start when it comes to how to repair that.
Deanne: I’ve got a question that just came to my mind. Men versus women…do women have to do things differently from personal brand than men do?
Sabrina: I think that men are more forgiven and easier to forgive when there is a misstep or a violation of the brand within sort of the male ranks, if you will. Females are not as easily forgiven; neither do they as easily forgive. I do think that the standard is higher. I don’t think that that is necessarily a bad thing. Is it different? Yes. Are their rules different? My experience is, yes. Other people might have a different experience. But, my experience is, yes.
Deanne: Is there anything that we need to learn from our male counterparts in the business world?
Sabrina: Yeah, for sure, I hate to make generalizations but I’m gonna make on right now. Historically I think men have done a better job of supporting each other, of believing in each other and of being an advocate for one another. I think that we as woman, we are getting better at that but I still think we have a long way to go. On the whole I think that men do a better job of tapping into their competitive spirit. They’re smart, they’re risk taking, they’re collaborative and certainly a lot of us woman are, but I think that men wear that on their sleeve more. They’re more comfortable with that, unless you are talking about athletes. I just hired an amazing young woman and one of the things that I just loved about her is she is this competitive volley ball player. There was just this different energy about her as soon as she walked in the door. No apologies, I’m competitive and I’ll take you down and she walks through the door just full of this great power and energy. I just loved that. Woman rarely wear that on their sleeve the way that men do. I think that men are more confident and they also concentrate on what they have versus what they lack. Which is what I think is a great aspect and attribute that woman can learn from them.
Deanne: Wow, so what advice or counsel would you have for women in general who are trying to climb the cooperate ladder or just entering the cooperate work places of any size, of any size company?
Sabrina: I think that you have to bring your best game every single day. I think that…and this is going to sound like it’s a little bit conflicted to what I was just speaking about with being competitive because I am all about bellying up and being strong and being competitive but I also think that you have to be kind. I don’t think that you are inherently conflicted. I think you have to be kind to those who came before you, to those who you are transitioning out of the organization. When we come in and we’re sort of just making these big changes and we’re being bold you can’t forget to sprinkle that with a pretty heavy dose of kindness.
Deanne: Wow, that’s good advice. You’re with Chiro One. I happen to love Chiro One. I have seen tremendous results. Our l istening audience may not know who Chiro One is and may not know how Chiro One is different than other Chiropractic providers. Can you give us a little bit of information on that?
Sabrina: Yeah, absolutely. Chiro One Wellness Centers is a wellness based network of Chiropractic offices. We are 78 clinics across three states. There is a little bit of a difference between wellness based chiropractic and more acute symptom based chiropractic. Certainly we see all sorts of patients and people with a myriad of complaints. But, our goal is to not just address and adjusts for the acute pain or symptom but to be able to have a deeper understanding of what is causing the pain or symptom to address that and then optimize the individual’s performance even more. It is really more a life style and philosophy base versus I’ve got a pinched nerve can you fix that and then be on your way.
Deanne: I know my husband and I have both seen great results going to Chiro One.
Sabrina: I’m so happy to hear that, that’s great!
Deanne: Yeah, both of us have. So we’re talking about branding now so what is your vision as far as branding with Chiro One?
Sabrina: Well, I mean, it’s huge! {Laughter} Our vision at Chiro One is that all human beings discover their full potential. When you put some people who don’t know us, I believe that you know us, Deanne that might sound a little lofty or a little “pie in the sky” at first but it is an amazing vision. I’ve been able to whole-heartedly get behind it. My extension of that vision as CMO is to make sure that we are carrying out that cooperate vision in a world class branded way. That means that we are able to penetrate new markets. We are able to expand in a manner that allows us to impact more families and transform more lives and really to assure that we continue in the van guard of wellness both in this US market and abroad. We really want to be and we are at the center of changing face of health and wellness and being a part of that solution. As you know, or you may not know, there are countless markets and countries where Chiropractic is relatively unknown, they’ve never heard of it. They don’t really know what it is. We have an opportunity to really go in and educate and enroll and transform lives all over the world. From a market potential in a healthcare opportunity it’s just an amazing thing when you think about the impact that this profession can have. We have barely scratched the surface.
Deanne: Wow, sounds like an exciting opportunity.
Sabrina: Yeah, it really is.
Deanne: Now you are also on faculty for the University of Chicago, right?
Sabrina: Yes, I am.
Deanne: What do you teach there?
Sabrina: I teach a course to graduate students called Managing Integrated Marketing Communications. It’s an advanced course and I absolutely love it. I’ve been doing it for a couple of years now. The courses are very intense and my syllabus is particularly heavy. I am all about customer satisfaction. I want to make sure my students are really getting their money’s worth. I try to cram a lot into these terms. My students are just so smart and I think to myself, oh my gosh was I that smart when I was their age. I am pretty sure I know what that answer is. It is really very satisfying to me because it gives me an opportunity three or four times a year, I guess four times a year that my course is offered in downtown Chicago at the University to reach out and give back to young and upcoming marketers. I think that we all have a responsibility to pay it forward and to give back to that community and to help younger marketers and younger executive who are coming up. Give them some of the more practical real world experience and lessons that we’ve garnered over the years versus just the theoretical that they’re gonna pick up in their books and in their case studies.
Deanne: We have like one minute left before break again. Are there any last words or advice that you would have for our audience?
Sabrina: Yeah, absolutely. I think to females in the business place what I would
is we have to be particularly strong and smart and resourceful and really be purposeful and make good choices both about the person and the executive that we want to become. I am just incredibly thankful for the mentors and the coaches that I’ve had and I continue to have. I continue to reach out to them and to learn from them, right, because we’re always learning if we’re smart. I think that if we prioritize that and if we take time, and I know it sounds really cliché but if we take time to sort of extend that hand or offer someone the coaching and the helping hand and the feedback and the honest conversation. Have the sober honest conversation so that someone can understand their reality. Then, I think that that’s time really well spent.
Deanne: Wow, time has just flown by. Sabrina, we are out of time. I would like to thank you very much for coming on Today’s Inspiring Women. You have truly inspired us with your comments.
So after break stick with me this is Deanne De Marco with Today’s Inspiring Women and our next guest is Lillian Bjorseth. Talk to you soon.
This is Deanne DeMarco with Today’s Inspiring Woman and today we are talking with Lillian Bjorseth in this segment of this show. Lillian I have known for a while. Lillian is a bright and charismatic networking diva. She is Miss Networking. Lillian has worked and played politics in the cooperate courier offices and in the trenches and has been in the entrepreneurial battlefield. She knows what it takes professionally to be a winner and how to build relationships that last. She is the networking expert. Her book is, Breakthrough Networking Building Relationships That Last. Lillian is a graduate from the University of Missouri School of Journalism. Her Fortune 100 Experience includes 11 years with AT&T where she coached top executives in communications and media relation skills. Welcome Lillian to Today’s Inspiring Women!
Lillian: Thank you for having me Deanne, it is my pleasure!
Deanne: I’m glad you decided to come aboard on this show. You started out with AT&T and then you became an entrepreneur. How long have you been an entrepreneur?
Lillian: For a little over 20 years.
Deanne: To be a successful entrepreneur for over 20 years that is quite undertaking. What were some of your biggest challenges as an entrepreneur?
Lillian: Well, I’m just gonna repeat the same word marketing, marketing, marketing.
Deanne: Ah I know you are known for this verbal business card. I know I have a printed business card and I use that everywhere and I always make sure I have 15 or 20 of them in my purse or my briefcase to hand out. But you have this thing called the verbal business card what is that ? Tell us more about that.
Lillian: Sure, well the verbal business card is something that you carry within you, if you will, because the verbal business card you explain through words. It’s a spoken one. A lot of people carry a printed card but I’m disappointed to say not everyone because I run into a lot of circumstances where people don’t have their printed business cards with them because they’ve run out, or so many, many, myriad reasons you know why. There is really never an excuse for you not to have the verbal business card because as long as you can speak you should be able to give your verbal business card. Having said that that doesn’t always work successfully for people either, because, sometimes people start to say it, But they have oos and ahs and ums you know when somebody says what do you do. That’s why the first thing right out of the shoot, Deanne that you have to remove from your verbal business card, because if you um and ah when someone asks you what you do you don’t instill confidence in them.
Deanne: So, why do people need a verbal business card?
Lillian: Why they need it is that, it’s what interests people in talking with you. It lets people know quickly what’s in it for them. That is such a big thing. I hate to tell you this but when people meet you they really don’t care that much about you they care about what you can do for them. Or, what you can do for people they know. The other thing is, when you do it correctly it helps you share with people in what I call lay language, easily understandable language of what you do. Sometimes I talk with people and after a few minutes I still have no idea what they do. That is a shame. Because you have wasted those vital first few minutes in a conversation without people even knowing what you do. The way I want you to envision a verbal business card is that you are fishing. You have your line in the water and you have a hook on the end of that line but you are missing one important ingredient. What do you think that is needed to catch the fish?
Deanne: The bait.
Lillian: Absolutely! So, your verbal business card is your bait on your hook that reels people in to talk with you.
Deanne: Is there just one type or one kind of verbal business card?
Lillian: I’ve come up with three of them and it’s a process, by the way, that I did develop because people were having difficulty in what I call, simply articulated what they do. There are three of them that I’ve come up with. One is the generic version. The generic version is what you use when your, let’s say at a Chamber of Commerce luncheon and you might be sitting or meeting people, sitting with or meeting people who don’t really understand your business. So, it is a generic way in lay language to let them know what you do. A second version is the industry version. That’s when you are with people who do the same thing you do whether it’s being a printer, an IT person, an engineer and you can use jargon because people understand the jargon. Then the third version is the cooperate or your company version. That’s particularly relevant if you work for a company that has multi-offices, like I did with AT&T. you have certain lingo within the company that you can use when you meet people.
Deanne: Can you give me an example of what a good verbal business card sounds like?
Lillian: Sure, let me share with you in reality a client that came to me, and of course I won’t use his name. He was a psychologist and he would say something like, I’m John and I’m a psychologist. He was trying to reach people in transition. He said to them I do stress management programs to help you get over the stress in your career especially when you lose your job. He said to me, “Lillian, people are backing away from me rather than coming in to talk with me.” So, I ask a few people, I gave them that card and I said, “What is it about it that would most turn you off?” Interesting enough it was the word psychologist because for people out of work they didn’t want to feel you know…one of them said to me, “Gee, now I lost my job and now I have to go see a shrink?” So anyway we changed it. It was kind of an interesting situation because he was trying to convince his father that he couldn’t get his PHD. So, your psychologist on your card is your backup, if you will. It’s your reinforcement, it’s your credibility. But what we changed it for him to say is, “I’m John and I’ve developed a 3 point program to help take your career to a new level.” Interesting enough he also attracted people who were not out of work because people who had a job were also interested in learning how they could take their career to a new level.
I also have another quick one from a woman…I did some work at Motorola. I said to her, “What do you do?” And, she said, “I’m a software engineer.” And, I said, “How many software engineers does Motorola have?” And, she said, “A lot.” So I said, “Why don’t you share with me what you do?” It turns out after talking that what she did is she helped write software to help 911 dispatch officers do their job, which was much more informative than saying I’m a software engineer because now I could identify with her, which I couldn’t with a software engineer because I don’t know much about software engineering. I said to her, “You could also say that I help write software that could save your life.” She said, “Yeah, I’m not quite as comfortable with that.”
The verbal business card has to suit your behavior or your personality style as well. One size doesn’t fit all.
Deanne: So, are there certain components that must be included in a verbal business card?
Lillian: Yes. I was listening to your previous interview and talking about how do you establish your brand. This will be helpful to people because I am actually going to give you a formula to write this verbal business card or those first few words that come out of your mouth, if you will. What you want to include first of all, first and foremost is your name because even though people may know your name they may forget it. You know you can have a senior moment when you are 20 and the name just goes right out the other end of you, if you will.
Anytime you meet someone in a networking situation, in any type of situation you want a make it as easy for them as possible. So you repeat your name. Or, with a name like “Bjorseth” I know that people don’t necessarily know how to pronounce that. They get confused with the “J” etc. So, you include your first and last name. You also then include what you do. People seldom say do you…they don’t come up to you and say, who are you? How do you do what you do? They say “what” do you do. So many of us tell people “who” we are or “how” we do it. we really need to work on the “what”. To get to the “what” you include a benefit. You know people buy benefits, they don’t buy features. You don’t buy a stove because it’s three feet high and it’s white. Why do you buy a stove?
Deanne: To cook on.
Lillian: That’s right! If you want to find out from other people is what is it you do that cooks their food because people don’t like to eat sushi all the time. When you can tell someone you’ve met how you can cook their food. They’re gonna be interested in talking further with you. You have to have benefits in there not features. I do a whole series of exercises to help people understand the difference between benefits and features because that can be difficult.
Then the last ingredient, to get the benefit, you have to use active verbs, because they are the most powerful words in the English language. If we go back to English and I know you enjoy English as much as I did. I am not talking about those linking verbs like is, are, was, were. I am talking about words like create, connect, educate, design whatever it is you do that people can feel because then if you give them touchy, feely words they can begin to identify with what you do.
Deanne: Excellent. We have to break away here at this moment. This is Deanne DeMarco at Today’s Inspiring Women. We are speaking to Lillian Bjorseth who is helping us build our brand by using a verbal business card. I’ll be back in just a few minutes.
This is Deanne DeMarco with Today’s Inspiring Women. We are speaking with Lillian Bjorseth and today we are talking about building your brand and Lillian is helping us with building our brand through using the verbal business card. Just before break we talked about some of the things that must be included in the verbal business card. We talked about including your name, first name and last name, what you do, the benefits in using action verbs. Those are all the things that need to be included in the verbal business card, correct, Lillian?
Lillian: That’s correct.
Deanne: Okay, so what would be things that you would “not” want to include in the verbal business card.
Lillian: There are some that are marginal and then there are some that are no nos. Marginal may be your company name, unless your company name is well known like it was when I was with AT&T, I don’t use my company name. Because, now it’s Duo Force Enterprises. People would just stand there and wonder what a Duo Force is. You don’t want to give them anything that might confuse them or take their attention away from what you are saying. The company location is typically not important because the verbal business card is only about a sentence or two and it only last 10 to 15 seconds. You don’t need to share with people where you’re located, particularly if you are at a local event. You also stay away from adjectives and adverbs because they modify and usually that modification is of your own design. You know, you’re the best at this, you do this, but you know how that turns people off. So you stay away from those most times. What you definitely stay away from is a company title. You don’t introduce yourself as a trainer, as a speaker, as someone who sells insurance, as an attorney because…in fact, research shows that if you say that you’re an attorney or that you are in insurance people actually step away from you rather than into the conversation.
Deanne: Really!
Lillian: People don’t want to talk with you about insurance. So you have to tell people you help build a nest egg or you make sure they can educate their children, that type of thing because that appeals to the person, but saying you sell insurance does not. In life insurance then people think about dying or long term care. Those are not pleasant thoughts. If you are in a business like that you have to work around those words. Another no no is how you do it.
Deanne: Give me an example of that.
Lillian: The example of it you know my business would be, I help people build a new kind of wealth, social capitol by improving their networking and communication skills. That’s what I do. How I do it is as the trainer, speaker, coach you know. That doesn’t say anything because if I say that I am a trainer or a speaker, I haven’t told the other person anything. I could be, you know a personal trainer, or I could be an animal trainer. I could be a software trainer. So, you want to be more specific so you stay away from that labeling and how you do it. Then of course you have to avoid industry jargon. That jargon that, you know that one word that you can say that encapsulates a whole thought when you are speaking with someone who understands it, but who left the person cold if they don’t know what you are talking about.
Deanne: Hm, interesting.
Lillian: The reason you stay away from the how is that’s the purpose of the whole verbal business card is that it should illicit one question and that is, “How do you do what you do?’ if I say I help you build more social…a different kind of wealth, social capitol you want to say to me well, how do you do that. Or, how do I build social capitol? That is the purpose of the verbal business card for people.
Deanne: So, they come back and ask you more questions.
Lillian; Exactly! And, then guess what? You now have permission they’ve given you permission then to tell them how you do it and more about what you do. Hopefully, you have stimulated their interest.
Deanne: Sure, that’s the fishing analogy. You throw your line in you’re giving them the bait and then now they’ve taken the bait that’s given you permission for you to give them more information.
Lillian: Exactly, so that you can “hook em”, if you will.
Deanne: Oh, that is sweet!
Lillian: When you hook em that means you’re gonna get business or at least you are going to get an appointment.
Deanne: Really good. Are there any situations that come into play with the verbal business card?
Lillian: What do you mean situations?
Deanne: Well, is there…you may or may not include something depending on the type of situation that you’re in?
Lillian: Yeah, as I said, it depends on your audience that generic audience, the company audience, the industry audience. I use the generic a lot, obviously when I’m working with groups who don’t understand what I do, who aren’t doing what I do, I use the generic one. So, when I teach people that, I always teach them the generic one, because, that’s by far the hardest one to do. That’s where you have to reduce it all to lay language. It’s really difficult to say what you do simply. There is so much going on when you first meet people and you’re talking and you know…the whole listening process because people are thinking about other things, their looking at you, their first impression, how are you acting, what do have on and all of that. So, you have to make the words as simple yet as meaningful as possible. So that when the interaction is over you are memorable and meaningful.
Deanne: Hm, interesting. One of the things that you have written is this wonderfulbook called Breakthrough Networking Building Relationships that Last and it’s in its’ third edition.
Lillian: Yes.
Deanne: That’s very impressive.
Lillian: Thank you.
Deanne: What is that book about?
Lillian: Well, that has a myriad of networking tips. It has the process in there on the verbal business card. When I speak about and think about networking I think about what you do before the event, how you work the event and what you do afterwords. That’s how the book is broken down. How do you prepare for an event? It can even can be a meeting. How you can work it, so there’s all sorts of tips about you know arriving early and the whole process of meeting people. I have a 10 minute rule, networking rule. I break that 10 minute rule down into an introduction, a body and a conclusion. Then I have something else I created an “ask for question and listen for answer”. The idea being that anytime you meet people whether you’re in an airplane or a person to person event you have questions you asked to determine if they are potential prospects for you or for someone you know. Then you listen to their answers, by the way they answer you will know. So, if you use that process you should never leave an interaction with another person without knowing whether that person is worth following up with for you.
Deanne: Got a question for you. If people want some additional help on creating this verbal business card can they call you or get coached from you?
Lillian: They sure can.
Deanne: All right, what is the best way for people to get hold of you?
Lillian: The phone number is 630-983-5308. My website is simply http://www.duoforce.com.
Deanne: And that was 630-983-5308 and that was at duoforce.com?
Lillian: Right or they can Google Lillian Bjorseth and they’ll get thousands of entries.
Deanne: Wonderful.
Lillian: All my information is there.
Deanne: Well, this segment just flew by again. Lillian I thank you very much for being part of Today’s Inspiring Women.
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As we are wrapping up this session I want to give you a quote from Ellen DeGeneres, which I happen to love. She says “Sometimes you can’t see yourself clearly until you see yourself through the eyes of others.”
This is Deanne DeMarco with Today’s Inspiring Women until next time. Have a wonderful week. Bye for now.
Pam McElvane and Deanne DeMarco
Leadership Strategies
Today’s Inspiring Women
Host: Deanne DeMarco
Guest: Pam McElvane, CEO Diversity MBA Magazine
Deanne DeMarco, Executive Coach, Leadership Vision
Deanne: Welcome to today's inspiring women. I'm your host Deanne DeMarco. If you are ready to take the next steps to become inspired, empowered, motivated, and better equipped for success then stay tuned. We have got an absolutely phenomenal guest with us today. Her name is Pamela McElvane and she is CEO of Diversity MBA Magazine. And Diversity MBA Magazine celebrates one million in online distribution to both domestic and international clients serving thirty countries. Pam was named Chicago's Who's Who Most Influential for 2006 or ((and)) 2010, 2009 Phenomenal Woman Award from Black Women's Expo, 2009 Women of the Year Award, 2009 Board Service Award and she received a scholarship 2007 to Dartmouth's Executive Education for Entrepreneurs. She has spent fourteen years in publishing and she has had many years of executive leadership experience with the insurance property and casualty industry and she is known for her business acumen to turn around unprofitable divisions. She has been— has selected appearances on WGM, ABC, and NBC television. In addition to that she has served on over twenty-five private community boards in her career. In addition to that Pamela is a mother of two boys. My goodness, Pam welcome to today's Inspiring Women.
Pam: Oh thank you so much, Deanne. I'm very excited to be here.
Deanne: You've had a really diverse career in—in speaking with you. Can you just tell our audience a little about where you started and how you ended up with MBA Diversity Magazine?
Pam: Absolutely. First, um, I actually was born and raised out of California, Stockton California. So I spent the first half of my career in California. Um, I graduated from, uh, University of Berkley, uh, which you know with an MBA in Finance and International Marketing so there's your MBA connection there. But I spent, um, the first part of my year, um, as an insurance- half of my years- as insurance executive running property and casualty companies, turning them around. And so I was very, um, lucky and blessed to be able to be successful in that area and managing, um, companies and being able to turn around profit in a business that was actually very volatile and actually not very popular. But it was something that I became very good at and I really enjoyed working and developing people in corporate America. And I'm from a family of entrepreneurs all the way back to my great- great-great grandfather who was an entrepreneur and we have a number of entrepreneurs in our family so I've always wanted to do something entrepreneurial. I didn't know what but I wanted to be entrepreneurial. And I'm one of these really creative people. I didn't want to necessarily become an artist but I had that type of creativity so I was able to bring that kind of creativity into my business acumen. The business, really, I didn't really know what entrepreneurial venture I would do. The kind of, um, through public service actually fell into the publishing business. I used to manage marketing and communication, um, in corporate- that was one of the divisions- and I always volunteered to do newsletters and brochures but I never thought I'd own a publishing company. So, um, with that, working with the National Black MBA Association gave me my, um, opportunity to launch a minority owned publication at that time, Black MBA, which I published successfully for ten years and then 2007 we, um, launched Diversity MBA a management and leadership publication focused on, um, supporting all areas of leadership and management development. So, just, really did not know what I was going to do but I just followed my passion and it led me to being able to have a corporate career and I also considered my volunteer service as a part of my career development as it's always been a part of what I do and that brought me into to the entrepreneurial area. I think when I looked at passion and what was fulfilling, um, I left corporate America because I wanted a family and I wanted more opportunities to develop freely other aspirations.
Deanne: I think it's very difficult to go from a corporate America type of job where you had that security, you know, that paycheck every week or every month into an entrepreneurial venture where things are just really unknown. I mean, that just takes a lot of inner strength.
Pam: It does, you're absolutely right. It does. It's scary and I—I think anyone considering it should consider those feelings of fear and of the unknown as natural, as a normal part of it.
Deanne: Alright. One of the things you just talked about was this, um, volunteer, working with volunteer organizations. So besides holding, if I got this straight, you were holding a full time job but you were also involved in volunteer organizations as well. So was volunteering part of your leadership success strategy?
Pam: Absolutely. Absolutely. Um, and because volunteering was so much a part of who I am, I made it more of a strategic process and I've done a tremendous amount of board service both on paid, private, and public as well as non-profit; probably thirty-five boards in my career and I still sit on five boards today. I think that—I know that— early in my career where I had an opportunity to be a part of the UC, University of California Region’s Board, very early I was introduced to the board’s service and I saw how sophisticated those processes were and— and boards were and just volunteering and professional organizations and then helping young people in honing my skills or skills that I necessarily didn't have opportunity to demonstrate in corporate America. So, coupled with the opportunity to go give back and develop at the same time led me to be able to mo- I think really, to move faster in corporations when I wasn't necessarily exposed to certain things. And I, and trust me, it was like a full time job, but I loved it. So, the volunteering I, you know, I went to work, came home and did those things and then just, um, really had a lot of passion in the volunteering service that I did.
Deanne: So it sounds like volunteering on boards is a good strategy for even today. Would you agree?
Pam: Oh, it absolutely is. And—and so many professionals are volunteering on boards but not necessarily considering it strategic to their career development and it—it absolutely is. If you think about who's around the board that you're serving on and think about what organiz- what task or what community you want to chair and truly that's just managing, and then managing the folks on the community are really managing peers and/or colleagues that are either equally experienced, more experienced, or less experienced. So then when you think about the opportunity to develop and where you can make a mistake and it's okay. <laughter> You know, people like making mistakes and you don't lose anything.
Deanne: Sure.
Pam: It's absolutely, I think, critical. And not just for current career development but even also for future. And even more senior executives like yourself that are looking for paid opportunities and, and um, corporate ((seeds)). It's, it's definitely a strategy that, um, all of us should look at.
Deanne: I've just got a question for this- So, if you have, a young employee in corporate America and they're looking to be promoted, and they haven't gotten a management position yet, but they really want a management position, will their board service be recognized, do you think, by corporate America for their potential to be a manager?
Pam: Absolutely. Um, in fact with the research that we do in our benchmarking division, um, that is a requirement that they have for all of their existing managers and particularly for their senior leaders, is board service and giving back is necessary for, um, next level roles. And then when you talk about, um, well if I was an individual contributor and not necessarily managing people, you can show, truly demonstrate where you had an opportunity to manage others on a team. Um, and someone may say, "Well you know it's not the same as volunteering." And you're like, "Right. It's harder." Because it's not their job and people don't have to be as committed because they're volunteering so you have to be creative, innovative, and be able to make sure that you, uh, create and provide environments to people to be motivated and continue to influence them. So, hands down, it absolutely is, um, used as a way, um, when looking at other skills and other positions.
Deanne: Excellent, excellent. Did you have a lot of mentors along the way?
Pam: I absolutely did. Um, again, I was very blessed to receive many, uh, many mentors along the way, starting even, um, in college. I had some of probably the most successful, uh, professors that— and deans— and chancellors at the universities that mentor me.
Deanne: Uhuh.
Pam: So, how lucky was that. And then in the insurance industry, um, which at the time that I was an executive in tha- in that area in the 80's and 90's, er— early 70's 80's and 90's, um, you really did not have, you know, there wasn't the robust network that, um, we have today for women. And so— and in that industry at the time there just weren't that many women of color that were in l leadership roles. I'm gonna' be honest, there weren't that many women in leadership roles.
Deanne: Mhm.
Pam: I was one of the few women of color enrolled, so my- my role models and mentors were white men. And I had some of the best mentors, um, of these white males that allowed me to develop, grow, position, and be successful. Um, it helped me, and I didn't even think of them, to be honest with you, as white men. It, uh, they were just— they were executives that had compassion and empathy, um, for building a business and for individuals that I learned so much. So— and then outside of, even after my corporate America stint, I still engaged for my business, uh, organizational development. I had a white male CEO that continued to mentor me on the business strategy side. Um, and— I don't know how— why that was the case but it was the case and then I looked at peer to peer for more of the— more women that became, I would say, the colleagues for mentoring. So peer to peer became very very im- a powerful menting— mentoring— um, uh, way for me and as an entrepreneur I also look at, um, different mentoring from circles, the different folks with different disciplines and different ex- and different, um, experts areas to provide mentorship. So I, I believe in, no matter where you are in your journey in development, it should be continuous in mentoring, um, in this many stages to see a part of your, uh, career development.
Deanne: Mm. We only have about two minutes until break, but I was just wondering are there any lessons that you learned as a woman or that we as women should learn from our male counterparts?
Pam: Yes. And, one, you know, typically most men are pragmatic in terms of their thinking, you know, they tend to, you know, want to, um, understand, you know, what it is, to get to what, um, what the outcome is. And I think being able to demonstrate with our mare camel- with our male counterpart a very clear objective with a very clear end makes sense for them and allows you to achieve the highest performance from then. And then when you do get some men that are empathetic and highly sensitive, then you can leverage that and help them in position to bring other males along.
Deanne: Very interesting. Well, we're going to be taking a short break at this time, um, and then when we come back from break I would like to go into personal brand, I know this is a very important, uh, piece for you, uh, Pam and I'd like to touch on that a little bit more so we're going to take a short break. Uh, stay tuned, this is, uh, Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women and we'll talk to you in a few minutes.
Deanne: Now we are back with, uh, Pam McElvane from MBA Diversity Magazine. And just before the break we started to talk about, uh, personal brand and I— Pam I know you are, um, personal brand is very important to you. Is there a difference with how a person sees themselves versus how others see you and which is more important or are they both the same?
Pam: Oh, boy. Those are good questions. Yes, there— there is a difference. Um, on how a lot times how people see themselves and how others perceive you or how others sees yo- er, see you. Um, it's difficulty to say which is more important. I would they are equally important, um, but it is very clearly important that you know yourself and that you're really clear on what differentiates you from anyone else. And I think it's also important that you're part of driving and shaping what others— how others perceive you. People are gonna' always bring their own influences, uh, and experiences in defining who you are, but it's important that, t that influence about you comes from you. So, um, they're equally important, but, um, I think it's very very, um, it's a necessary requirement that, that you are a person trying to drive your own brand is able to influence what others think about you.
Deanne: So, personal brand is really influenced by, your authentic self? Is that what you would say is the correct term for that?
Pam: Um, definitely bring your authentic self to your personal brand. Your personal brand, um, really is how you want others to define you. It's bigger, it's bigger than life, it's bigger than you, and it'll go further than you ever will go. It'll travel, um, around the world— million more miles than you ever bill— you ever will. Um, you basically want people, when they say your name, to be able to relate it to something and if it is authenticity, then that's great. And that's because that is when, um, they've ever— they've— they read or see any information or images, um, about who you are and they can relate it to something of success. So, Pam McElvane for example, in most of my circles from a business perspective is related to Diversity MBA. It's related to our business brand and almost one and the same, but from a personal perspective I want people to perceive, um, the authentic— the authenticity that I do bring to the table which that we're honest, that we're trustworthy, that we're high ethics, high integrity, high quality. So what all these things— is to be attached to Pam McElvane personally but then also to be demonstrated through the business brand. Um, and so people have to work hard and part of "how do I build that?" well if you have to be really clear what your own message is and to be really clear what it is you are— who you are and in defining who you are and as you define who you are, it's showing up the same time, all the time. You know, it's not— not necessarily, you know, being confusing to people in the market place as well as the— your closest friends. This really being messy, again, you're talking about the authenticity of one's self.
Deanne: That is very interesting
Pam: So others can be able to articulate how they see— how you want them to see you and then they can add their own experience to it. "I can relate to her because she, you know, she does these things very well and I- I resonate with that." (())
Deanne: Now in this world of social networking, I mean we have Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn, and a whole bunch of others. Can that be a problem with developing your personal brand?
Pam: If— if you're not— if you're not strategic in using it. I- I believe, um, one, social media is absolutely necessary today because you do have audiences that primarily only communicate that way and I think as people develop their brand, I know for me, um, I— every— each component of social media I have a different strategy for. Uh, the strategy I have for LinkedIn is a very different strategy I have for Facebook and a very strategy for twitter and I think, uh, and you also have to be careful in terms of what you want out there. And, and the— and the messages that you want to put out there 'cause at— at anyone- at any given time you want to be able to have a ripple effect within the message but at the same time you want to make sure that anyone can use it anyway. So, for example, um, LinkedIn is one of the most trusted, um, it is the most trusted, um, social media platform for professionals. Not just for career, but just for connecting, um, and building relationships. So, I use LinkedIn as a major league professional networking for, you know, professionals that I want to connect with, for very experienced people. I use Facebook f for— as a college strategy. Really reaching out to the young generation and providing them information; always having content, always having new and fresh information out there for them. And then I use twitter through our events, where we can begin to, um, if you want to share, if you're a blogger, then that's a great thing to use twitter for, if you're personally always bringing new content and information. And the things that they all have in common is that social media is not only a connecting, but it is an information platform that you can always bring current, fresh, updated content to the folks that you're trying to stay connected with or that you're trying to brand to. And— but you have to be very careful and very strict and— in the parameters that you're going to use in those platforms.
Deanne: Yeah, because it can come back to bite you later on, right?
Pam: It— it absolutely will, <laughter> big one, too.
Deanne: Yeah, kind of like the old, uh, bad photos, right? <Laughter>
Pam: Right, right.
Deanne: Yeah, wow. You know, I— I know when you're— publishing world, trend watching is very very important. Um, can trend watching be a success strategy in today's market place?
Pam: I absolutely think so, and I— I believe so, not think so. Um, and I just— and I think that's a great question that you asked because I— I believe in the past we haven't really needed to, uh, look at a lot of different trends, parteculy in— particularly in career development. Um, we might have looked at examples of people being successful, but now with today's information, um, that's out there, there's so much information and there's also various sources. I mean, Diversity MBA Magazine, we do benchmarking and we rank the best places for companies to work. Uh, they have people— er, diverse managers (men) and women that are in management and then there's others: Diversity Inc., Working Mothers, uh, Fortune 100, that's— really looks at companies who are best places to work for. And so, as in your career, if you want to look at it as a sucstress— success strategy, there's a couple things. There's companies that're saying, "Hey, we're publically committed to promoting women and people of color." And then you have, you know, where are some of the best practices within those organizations, in terms of looking at how they develop talent. You can actually look at trends and see how organizations are developing their talent and if it is a company that I would want to work for, and even gathering information to have this kind of conversation in an interview process. You also can look at companies from a market perspective to see what they're doing on the consumer side.
Deanne: Mhm.
Pam: Where you can you be able to have that conversation and that knowledge to talk about how are you linking what you're doing in the consumer side to what you do internal to your culture, in helping, you know, move your career and how you engage and develop people. So there's so much information and all you got to do is, what, is ask Google and so <laughter> and then go back and, you know, look at QPEW Resources, that's a, uh, really large research organization and that—that can let you look at what're some of the key trends in business, some of the key trends in what your area or field of interest is. And let the organization know that you're either working in or that y- the next level you looking at, or that you are volunteering at understand that you have a broader understanding of what's going on in the market place. Um, and there's so many things that go into benchmarking, go into looking at trends, as, uh, one should make a decision—as you make dif- different types of decisions in different, you know, walks of life.
Deanne: Yeah. I- I agree with that completely. You know, I think trend watching is probably more important than ever. I don't think we had to worry about that, you know, twenty years ago.
Pam: Mm-mm, mm-mm.
Deanne: But I think today, I- I think it's, is critical for people who want to really be considered as a leader in their organization or, uh, a person who wants to be a manager. You know, whatever you career path is, I think trend work—trend watching is right at the top of, just, keeping a pulse on what's going on out there and what people are interested in. I, eh, I— I definitely agree with that, a hundred percent.
Pam: Absolutely.
Deanne: You know, what I am— things I'm seeing is, you know, in society we've seen a huge shift in education. You know, before World War II, only three percent of the population had- had college degrees and now we're at about seventy percent have college degrees, so we're very much into a continually learning type of, society. One of the questions I have is, what're you seeing aft— the role of education once you complete college and you get that first job, do you think continual learning is still important?
Pam: I absolutely do. And you are absolutely right in your assessment, in particular what's happening in- in academia. And one of the things that is- is happening, uh, particularly in the diversity space, is the gap of, um—universities are very concerned and really want to fill the gap between providing education and what's actually going on in- in companies, both either entrepreneurial or within large organizations. And so, once an individual, um, what you- what we call OJT, on the job training, and also becoming engaged in inclusion of that organization and that— and we're talking about culture now. So, once you're—go through your training on the job and you're understanding the culture, then those two will now get you in really what we call a sustainable l level within the organization, but to really be able to get to the next level, to be able to bring out, um, your expertise and how you're different, you have to be engaged, I believe, your tire- entire career in the continuous learning process. That has to be, um, I think, depending on the discipline, um, you may have to go back and actually take certifications, you ma y not have or might need.
Deanne: I agree
Pam: A person might need to go back and take additional courses and get a graduate degree, or take additional courses.
Deanne: Yes
Pam: Or, a Masters or, and/or Doctorate. You may have to go back, maybe it's just courses that you just have to stay abreast to, maybe certain types of certifications. And then there's some that doesn't necessarily require it, but because you aspire to get into a different— the next level wall, it's good to, uh, take advantage of the internal education programs your organizations have as well as take advantage of the external education programs that your organization will pay for.
Deanne: I agree
Pam: Where I can go to a university and take a leadership certification and/or get a higher level degree.
Deanne: I've got, I've got one real quick question
Pam: Yep.
Deanne: Most everything I've read and this just—we only have a couple minutes left.
Pam: Oh yeah, sure.
Deanne: Most CEOs, I've read, read at least one book a month. Do you agree with that?
Pam: Absolutely
Deanne: Do you read at least one book a month?
Pam: Absolute- yes. Probably a little bit more, um, just because of the nature of my business, but a minimum of one book a month.
Deanne: Interesting
Pam: What will keep you abreast of some of the best, um, information out there.
Deanne: Alright, just wanted to kinda' check with that. Now, I want you to tell us, a little bit; we only have about two minutes left--
Pam: Okay.
Deanne: Want you to tell us a little bit about, uh, MBA Diversity Magazine. I know it has a readership of a million plus globally. Tell us a little bit about it, who's the audience, how do people get a copy of your magazine, and things like that.
Pam: Oh, excellent. Um, Diversity MBA is the management and leadership publication. Our website is, um, www. diversitymbamagazine.com. Uh, you may go online and—and subscribe to, uh, a complimentary subscription, annual subscription. We publish quarterly. Uh, we do reach over a million worldwide. Um, we have a lot of global and local partners. Our audience, we target, uh, the graduate students, um, and college. We target current professionals, entrepreneurs, as well as, uh, corporate executives, and at the end of the day anyone that is looking to enhance their management and leadership skills, we're the publication for you.
Deanne: So the- there's a free copy and then they can subscribe to a yearly?
Pam: Yes, they can subscribe to an annual subscription, which will be complimentary and then, clearly, they can purchase, uh, the print copies. We do print- we do print as well.
Deanne: Well, uh, a- as we're wrapping up here, only- we're down to about thirty seconds here. Is there one last suggestion for women out there that you would have for them to be successful?
Pam: Yes, I do. I think, um, if we can each reach one to teach one, where we can, um— where we show up and are excellent in one area, if we can support another woman and each— in any of her endeavors, it could just be one thing, um, I think that will be huge in creating confidence, um, in women in business. So if we can reach one— each one, reach one, to teach one, um, would be my advice. It's that no matter what it is, if we continue that chain in supporting each other.
Deanne: Wow, well, thank you. I, appreciate you being on Today's Inspiring Women. You were just a phenomenal guest.
Pam: Oh my, thank you.
Deanne: And, uh, for our listening audience, we're going to be taking a short break. Uh, stay tuned as we go on and discuss the qualities of great leadership after the break.
Second Guest (Host: Deanne DeMarco)
Deanne: Welcome back to Today's Inspiring Women. I'm your host, Deanne DeMarco. And we're going to be talking a— now about l leadership. I get a lot of questions from people asking me, "What is the difference between a leader and a manager?" And "What do leaders really do?" and "What skills do leaders need to have if you're going to— to be a leader?" So I'm going to talk a little bit about that this— this part of the, show today.
So, first of all, what's the difference between a leader and a manager? Well, leadership is really that one-to-many relationship as compared to a one-to-one relationship of a manager. That's pretty much it in a nutshell. The second question I'm asked a lot is, so what do, what do leaders do? What's the work that leaders do? Well, basically, leaders help to create a vision. They help to build alignment and they are champions of, and oversee the execution of that vision. So, those three pieces that a l leader— the work of a leader includes crafting a vision, uh, of new possibilities for the future through exploration, boldness, and testing of assumptions. The second part of that is a leader needs to build alignment, so leaders build alignment by communicating with clarity, engaging in dialogue, and providing inspiration so everyone is moving in the— in the same direction in the organization. And the third aspect of what the work leaders do is they— is around execution. So, leaders finally, um, leaders need to champion execution through building momentum and structure and feedback and enabling the— the group to capitalize on its talents while making that vision a reality. So, I'm gonna' be diving into a little bit more around vision, alignment, and execution, um, at this time, so let's go on and talk about this a little bit more. So, what do we mean by vision?
Vision is, …..there's a difference between vision and a goal, so let's say, for our company we wanted to make ten million widgets this year. Well, that is actually a goal, whereas a vision is that we want to be the world leader in widget making while maintaining the highest quality standards in the industry that makes widgets. So that would be the vision as compared to a goal, so that's a little bit different, uh, way of looking at things. So, vision is important because it expands, um, assumptions about what is to be done. It provides purpose for the organization, the teams that supports your organization, and the individuals as well as the leader as well. Vision also drives the development of specific vision supporting goals, like making the ten million widgets a year, and it helps to unify people. So that's what vision is really all about and there are three drivers in creating vision and those drivers are exploration, boldness, and testing of assumptions. And we're gonna' be touching on just a couple of these because we don't have time to cover them all. We're going to touch on just a couple of these, so what does exploration of driving vision, what does that really mean? That— that driver for vision? So, in dri- being exploring and driving vision is really all about remaining open uh, and prioritizing the big picture. There are actually three sub-drivers here, but we're gonna' touch on— on just one of these. So those three sub-drivers are, um, to explore, to be bold, and to test assumptions. So in the piece of exploration, we— the best practices around vision are to remain open and to prioritize big ideas. Remaining open is all about, um, not being so focused on a single idea but be willing to, uh, explore a lot of different ideas. Being open and unstructured and looking at a lot of different ideas and not jumping in too quickly on— on a decision, so really trying to be re- open as far as looking at different ideas. And the second piece is prioritizing the big picture, being able to think broadly, kinda' like big brush strokes. Being able to think broadly about how everything is going to fit together rather than concentrating on single, individual little details. So, it's really about looking at those— those bigger ideas. So, it's all about looking at how ideas might fit into current plans, um, maybe when you embrace a bigger picture view you are then able to more likely notice when, uh, there are outdated assumptions or practices that are maybe hindering your team or the organization.
There are other drivers of vision as well and that's boldness and testing assumptions and we can dive into those maybe at another time, another show. The second thing that I'd like to talk about is alignment. Alignment is, uh, refers to the act of getting buy-in for the vision from everyone who has a role in making that vision a reality, so alignment ensures that people are on the— the same page from both, uh, a task as well as an emotional perspective. So it's like everyone is aligned and/or working together. So alignment requires an ongoing, one-way and a two-way communication. In fact, part of the failure, um, of vision is not having both one-way and two-way communication. What it is not, it's not a check-off list. Uh, alignment is— is really a dynamic, ongoing process that requires the leader to continually and realign as the conditions change and the needs of the organization change. So alignment is important because it sets the stage. Uh, it sets the stage for proposing a plan for effective implementation. It— it provides a forum for questions and concerns from— from other managers and leaders in the organization. It helps to bring people together behind the vision. If you don’t have an alignment, people can't align up behind it. You can't help be the cheerleaders around it. And it also generates excitement or— for the vision, so that alignment is a c crucial, crucial piece in getting the vi- the vision to become reality. So, when it comes to alignment in your organization, you need to understand that there are a number of different variables that can come into play when looking at alignment. For example, some of those variables would be formal versus informal communication. Face-to-face and virtual environments where a lot of organizations today have a lot of virtual and global communication, and employees. So how is the alignment around face-to-face and virtual environments? Lateral and hierarchical organizational structures, so every organization has a hierarchical structure, which some of the organizations are pretty tall, as well as lateral. So, how is that communication both laterally and as well as in a hierarchical structure? And how is your companies communication around negotiating competing interests?
One of the things that I get pulled into a lot is helping resolve internal conflict, say, between sales and marketing or between finance and marketing. And a lot of time there's some competing interest around the same end products, so how is the alignment in your organization around those issues as well? There are three drivers with alignment as well, and those three drivers are around clarity, dialogue, and inspiration. And I'm going to touch on these, in just a little bit more depth than I did in the first piece.
So let's talk a little bit about clarity— the clarity driver that drives alignment. So the two things we need to look at as far as clarity is— are you someone who, is more intuitive, or do you explain your rationale? Are you more impromptu in your messaging or are you more structured in your messaging? Say that you need to be able to explain your rationale clearly, are you logical, are you being able to, uh, explain the rationale behind the vision to others so they can understand it versus just being reactive and being intuitive around your— your message. And the other one is a structured message versus an impromptu message. You know, a lot of times leaders are— tend to be— have a tendency to be impromptu and what ends up happening is in those impromptu messages, um, those leaders who tend to deliver impromptu messages, often provide unnecessary details, they go off in tangents, and people have trouble identifying the main points and you end up losing their attention. So, as a leader in trying to drive alignment, you need to really— maybe outline your message so that people can understand what you're trying to say in a nice, logical— approach to the message that you're trying to get across. Another one in—with alignment, is the type of dialogue that you, get involved in also drives alignment. Are you someone who just presents information or are you someone who is willing to exchange perspectives on information? In other words, are you inviting people to respond or are you pretty closed? One of the best practices around this are for leaders to solicit other people’s opinions and input and not be close-minded. So you're not just presenting information, but you're opening it up and asking for other people’s information that they might have. So there by— in that way you're then gaining alignment around vision and you're inviting a participatory type of approach, which is often a lot more effective. If a person does not feel like they're part of the process then what ends up happening is engagement and morale will both suffer. In the— in the last piece of this piece that I want to touch on just before break here is the difference between are you someone who's challenging or are you someone who's receptive? Do you have a tendency to challenge other people’s ideas or are you someone who is open to new ideas, and willing to create, an open dialogue with people so they don't feel — criticized or minimized when speaking with you— which is what challenging does. So, by being receptive, you're creating a culture of people who are not afraid to— to share their ideas. And people want to know that their words will be met with openness when they decide to— to speak up. I see we— that— we're ready for a break here. So let's, uh, go ahead and take a break and we'll come back and talk a little bit more about leadership.
Deanne: Welcome back, this is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women and I am talking about leadership and what's the difference between managing and leading and what're some of the key elements of what do leaders do— and some of those qualities and skills that leaders need to attain. And just before break we started talking a little about, uh, the second, uh, skill set which is around alignment. And— 'cause alignment is one of those areas that leaders tend to have a problem with as they— they wonder why their vision doesn't get carried out the way that they want it to get carried out and part of it is because of the alignment piece. It tends to be a really challenging a— area, so one of the things I had talked about just before break was the difference between are you someone who is more challenging or are you someone who is more receptive to other people’s ideas. And while a lot of managers or leaders tend to have a tendency to be challenging other people’s ideas. Um, while this helps you in— and in your mind your— your solutions are logical, it does not help other people, um, and— to feel like they're actually being deflated when their ideas or concerns are criticized or minimized. So what's really important is that a leader needs to create a culture where people are not afraid to share, because otherwise if you don't create that culture even when you, uh, ask them for their opinion, if they feel like their ideas in the past have been criticized or minimized, they're going to be afraid to share their opinions and you don't want that. You really need other people's perspectives on things. Uh, so people want to know that their words will be met with openness, uh, when they finally do decide to— decide to speak up. So, as a leader, best practice is that you need to be more receptive to the ideas of others and to focus on exchanging perspectives to provide that dialogue that others need as well and I want to talk a little more because alignment is definitely one of those areas. So maybe you're someone who tends to present information versus exchanging perspectives, maybe you're someone who tends to be more challenging versus receptive, so what are some tips for improvement? So, one of the tips that you can do is, um, even if your first instinct is to dismiss an opinion, you need to encourage a discussion so that you can understand the person's thought process behind their opinion. Not only will this help people feel that— that they are being heard, it might help you also to get a fresh perspective or insights as well. Need to, uh, be willing to avoid challenging or completely dismissing other people's opinions. Um, being receptive will create a culture which people feel, um, more comfortable in contributing. You need to be proactive about thanking people for the feedback, even if you don't agree. I know it's tough, but even if you don't agree with what was said, you need to thank them for their feedback anyways. Just, "Thank you for your perspective on that." This will help people feel that it's, um, worth their efforts to be part of this dialogue. So the next time that you have a question they're ((unintelligible)) more willing to open up. And make sure that your tone, uh, of voice and your body language says that you're being receptive. Your, you know, there's a lot of research between what is said and tone and body language and if your body language is saying that you really don't want to hear their opinion, I've got news for you: people are not going to speak up. So your— your tone of voice and your body language also needs to be really clear that you are open and receptive to the information that they're giving, uh, giving to you. You know, it's not always what you say but how you say it that will have the biggest impact in— in moving forward. I do want to talk a little bit about the third skill set, which is execution. So in execution, w— execution is making the vision reality. That's what execution is really about. It's turning the imagined future, uh, and the imagined future condition into a— a reality, so in carrying out the vision that you have. Successful execution of a vision can't happen without a deep commitment and support of the leader. So, it's not just something you give to somebody. You need to stay committed and being supportive as the leader in driving and executing that vision to make it reality. So execution is important because it propels the development of concrete strategies. It makes the vision actionable. It gives people a sense of achievement and it fulfills the promise of the vision. You need to understand that you have a definite role in executing the vision. The questions I— you need to ask yourself: Are you someone who is more hands on or are you less hands on? Are you advocating for resources or do you just provide resources? Are you helping to create strategy or just following strategy? Are you helping to establish a culture or supporting the culture? You need to understand that there are also three drivers in execution as well and those three drivers are momentum, structure, and feedback. I mean if you want a culture where people want to work, you have to be the driver of that. So let's talk a little bit more about the momentum aspects of driving execution. Are you someone who is low-key or are you someone who is really driven? Uh, and it goes both ways. I've worked with leaders that are on both ends of this continuum. If you're someone who tends to be very rapid— into rapid progress, you may grow restless when energy seems to drag. As the leader you need to create a culture with, uh, a substantial focus on results. This keeps people on their toes and provides a sense of drive and a— and a competitive spirit. You need to create a sense of momentum for others by encouraging them to push themselves to do their very best. And the second piece of that is are you someone who is reactive or are you someone who initiates, uh, opportunities? So, uh, as a leader who tends to, uh, initiate, you're someone who is more open to fresh opportunities. You're more likely to call attention to areas of improvement and to kick off new projects. This is kinda' that entrepreneurial spirit of leadership, is that initiating, um, skill set. 'Cause it helps to create a culture of people— are— tend to be proactive and, uh, in that— in being proactive tends to be valued. When a leader shows initiative, the group is more likely to grow and extend is— its reach much— much further than simply trying to maintain the status quo. So the— the three drivers, again, of execution are all around momentum, so you're trying to really build that momentum, structure, and then feedback as well. So let's talk a— a little bit more about the structure, uh, skill set. So in structure, it's, um, working to, um, help people plan and analyze more in depth. So with that piece of the information, are you someone who improvises or do you develop a solid plan? If you're someone who tends to improvise and you're trying to figure things out along the way, well, that may help you; it doesn't help the people who you're trying to lead. Um, people that you're trying to lead get very anxious when they don't have a well-defined structure to depend on. Without a clear process, your group can— can suffer considerably in— in being inefficient. Um, they can b— they can suffer with redundancies and there can be a lot of frustration with your employees as well and what ends up happening is those inefficiencies, ((redundancies)), and frustrations can end up threatening the successful execution of the vision. I know this ((was)) just a really short, little, uh, information around what leaders do, but if you were a leader or if you are aspiring to be a leader within your organization and you would like more information, there's a ton of information on what leaders do, uh, contact me at [email protected]. I actually have an assessment that you can take that's called "The Work of Leader Profile" that can actually help you assess where you're skill sets—- skill sets are in creating a vision, building alignment, and are you, in fact, a champion around execution to make the vision a reality? So this is, uh, a little bit information around what leaders— what leaders do. It's all about creating that vision, building alignment, and then champing— being that champion in executing the vision and going forward. One of our primary, um, sponsors for Today's Inspiring Women is, uh, Breaking Boundaries International. Breaking Boundaries International provides a personalized coaching and corporate training services to business professionals and organizations. If you are looking to break through your personal boundaries and career roadblocks, they are there to help. Breaking Boundaries provides coaching and training to organizations who want to create corporate culture where people want to work. Breaking Boundaries International has won national recognition from Training Magazine's Top 100 for their management coaching clinic program. Their services include executive and personal coaching, corporate training for managers; Breaking Boundaries can also provide a motivational business speaker for your next business meeting or conference. They can be reached at www.breaking-boundaries.com or they can be reached at 866-91-COACH.
In wrapping up today's show, I want to leave you with a quote from, Dr. D.M. Burns. And Dr. Burns say that, "We need to aim for success, not perfection. Never give up your right to be wrong, because then you will lose the ability to learn new things and to move forward with your life."
This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women. Until next time, have a wonderful day.
Host: Deanne DeMarco
Guest: Pam McElvane, CEO Diversity MBA Magazine
Deanne DeMarco, Executive Coach, Leadership Vision
Deanne: Welcome to today's inspiring women. I'm your host Deanne DeMarco. If you are ready to take the next steps to become inspired, empowered, motivated, and better equipped for success then stay tuned. We have got an absolutely phenomenal guest with us today. Her name is Pamela McElvane and she is CEO of Diversity MBA Magazine. And Diversity MBA Magazine celebrates one million in online distribution to both domestic and international clients serving thirty countries. Pam was named Chicago's Who's Who Most Influential for 2006 or ((and)) 2010, 2009 Phenomenal Woman Award from Black Women's Expo, 2009 Women of the Year Award, 2009 Board Service Award and she received a scholarship 2007 to Dartmouth's Executive Education for Entrepreneurs. She has spent fourteen years in publishing and she has had many years of executive leadership experience with the insurance property and casualty industry and she is known for her business acumen to turn around unprofitable divisions. She has been— has selected appearances on WGM, ABC, and NBC television. In addition to that she has served on over twenty-five private community boards in her career. In addition to that Pamela is a mother of two boys. My goodness, Pam welcome to today's Inspiring Women.
Pam: Oh thank you so much, Deanne. I'm very excited to be here.
Deanne: You've had a really diverse career in—in speaking with you. Can you just tell our audience a little about where you started and how you ended up with MBA Diversity Magazine?
Pam: Absolutely. First, um, I actually was born and raised out of California, Stockton California. So I spent the first half of my career in California. Um, I graduated from, uh, University of Berkley, uh, which you know with an MBA in Finance and International Marketing so there's your MBA connection there. But I spent, um, the first part of my year, um, as an insurance- half of my years- as insurance executive running property and casualty companies, turning them around. And so I was very, um, lucky and blessed to be able to be successful in that area and managing, um, companies and being able to turn around profit in a business that was actually very volatile and actually not very popular. But it was something that I became very good at and I really enjoyed working and developing people in corporate America. And I'm from a family of entrepreneurs all the way back to my great- great-great grandfather who was an entrepreneur and we have a number of entrepreneurs in our family so I've always wanted to do something entrepreneurial. I didn't know what but I wanted to be entrepreneurial. And I'm one of these really creative people. I didn't want to necessarily become an artist but I had that type of creativity so I was able to bring that kind of creativity into my business acumen. The business, really, I didn't really know what entrepreneurial venture I would do. The kind of, um, through public service actually fell into the publishing business. I used to manage marketing and communication, um, in corporate- that was one of the divisions- and I always volunteered to do newsletters and brochures but I never thought I'd own a publishing company. So, um, with that, working with the National Black MBA Association gave me my, um, opportunity to launch a minority owned publication at that time, Black MBA, which I published successfully for ten years and then 2007 we, um, launched Diversity MBA a management and leadership publication focused on, um, supporting all areas of leadership and management development. So, just, really did not know what I was going to do but I just followed my passion and it led me to being able to have a corporate career and I also considered my volunteer service as a part of my career development as it's always been a part of what I do and that brought me into to the entrepreneurial area. I think when I looked at passion and what was fulfilling, um, I left corporate America because I wanted a family and I wanted more opportunities to develop freely other aspirations.
Deanne: I think it's very difficult to go from a corporate America type of job where you had that security, you know, that paycheck every week or every month into an entrepreneurial venture where things are just really unknown. I mean, that just takes a lot of inner strength.
Pam: It does, you're absolutely right. It does. It's scary and I—I think anyone considering it should consider those feelings of fear and of the unknown as natural, as a normal part of it.
Deanne: Alright. One of the things you just talked about was this, um, volunteer, working with volunteer organizations. So besides holding, if I got this straight, you were holding a full time job but you were also involved in volunteer organizations as well. So was volunteering part of your leadership success strategy?
Pam: Absolutely. Absolutely. Um, and because volunteering was so much a part of who I am, I made it more of a strategic process and I've done a tremendous amount of board service both on paid, private, and public as well as non-profit; probably thirty-five boards in my career and I still sit on five boards today. I think that—I know that— early in my career where I had an opportunity to be a part of the UC, University of California Region’s Board, very early I was introduced to the board’s service and I saw how sophisticated those processes were and— and boards were and just volunteering and professional organizations and then helping young people in honing my skills or skills that I necessarily didn't have opportunity to demonstrate in corporate America. So, coupled with the opportunity to go give back and develop at the same time led me to be able to mo- I think really, to move faster in corporations when I wasn't necessarily exposed to certain things. And I, and trust me, it was like a full time job, but I loved it. So, the volunteering I, you know, I went to work, came home and did those things and then just, um, really had a lot of passion in the volunteering service that I did.
Deanne: So it sounds like volunteering on boards is a good strategy for even today. Would you agree?
Pam: Oh, it absolutely is. And—and so many professionals are volunteering on boards but not necessarily considering it strategic to their career development and it—it absolutely is. If you think about who's around the board that you're serving on and think about what organiz- what task or what community you want to chair and truly that's just managing, and then managing the folks on the community are really managing peers and/or colleagues that are either equally experienced, more experienced, or less experienced. So then when you think about the opportunity to develop and where you can make a mistake and it's okay. <laughter> You know, people like making mistakes and you don't lose anything.
Deanne: Sure.
Pam: It's absolutely, I think, critical. And not just for current career development but even also for future. And even more senior executives like yourself that are looking for paid opportunities and, and um, corporate ((seeds)). It's, it's definitely a strategy that, um, all of us should look at.
Deanne: I've just got a question for this- So, if you have, a young employee in corporate America and they're looking to be promoted, and they haven't gotten a management position yet, but they really want a management position, will their board service be recognized, do you think, by corporate America for their potential to be a manager?
Pam: Absolutely. Um, in fact with the research that we do in our benchmarking division, um, that is a requirement that they have for all of their existing managers and particularly for their senior leaders, is board service and giving back is necessary for, um, next level roles. And then when you talk about, um, well if I was an individual contributor and not necessarily managing people, you can show, truly demonstrate where you had an opportunity to manage others on a team. Um, and someone may say, "Well you know it's not the same as volunteering." And you're like, "Right. It's harder." Because it's not their job and people don't have to be as committed because they're volunteering so you have to be creative, innovative, and be able to make sure that you, uh, create and provide environments to people to be motivated and continue to influence them. So, hands down, it absolutely is, um, used as a way, um, when looking at other skills and other positions.
Deanne: Excellent, excellent. Did you have a lot of mentors along the way?
Pam: I absolutely did. Um, again, I was very blessed to receive many, uh, many mentors along the way, starting even, um, in college. I had some of probably the most successful, uh, professors that— and deans— and chancellors at the universities that mentor me.
Deanne: Uhuh.
Pam: So, how lucky was that. And then in the insurance industry, um, which at the time that I was an executive in tha- in that area in the 80's and 90's, er— early 70's 80's and 90's, um, you really did not have, you know, there wasn't the robust network that, um, we have today for women. And so— and in that industry at the time there just weren't that many women of color that were in l leadership roles. I'm gonna' be honest, there weren't that many women in leadership roles.
Deanne: Mhm.
Pam: I was one of the few women of color enrolled, so my- my role models and mentors were white men. And I had some of the best mentors, um, of these white males that allowed me to develop, grow, position, and be successful. Um, it helped me, and I didn't even think of them, to be honest with you, as white men. It, uh, they were just— they were executives that had compassion and empathy, um, for building a business and for individuals that I learned so much. So— and then outside of, even after my corporate America stint, I still engaged for my business, uh, organizational development. I had a white male CEO that continued to mentor me on the business strategy side. Um, and— I don't know how— why that was the case but it was the case and then I looked at peer to peer for more of the— more women that became, I would say, the colleagues for mentoring. So peer to peer became very very im- a powerful menting— mentoring— um, uh, way for me and as an entrepreneur I also look at, um, different mentoring from circles, the different folks with different disciplines and different ex- and different, um, experts areas to provide mentorship. So I, I believe in, no matter where you are in your journey in development, it should be continuous in mentoring, um, in this many stages to see a part of your, uh, career development.
Deanne: Mm. We only have about two minutes until break, but I was just wondering are there any lessons that you learned as a woman or that we as women should learn from our male counterparts?
Pam: Yes. And, one, you know, typically most men are pragmatic in terms of their thinking, you know, they tend to, you know, want to, um, understand, you know, what it is, to get to what, um, what the outcome is. And I think being able to demonstrate with our mare camel- with our male counterpart a very clear objective with a very clear end makes sense for them and allows you to achieve the highest performance from then. And then when you do get some men that are empathetic and highly sensitive, then you can leverage that and help them in position to bring other males along.
Deanne: Very interesting. Well, we're going to be taking a short break at this time, um, and then when we come back from break I would like to go into personal brand, I know this is a very important, uh, piece for you, uh, Pam and I'd like to touch on that a little bit more so we're going to take a short break. Uh, stay tuned, this is, uh, Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women and we'll talk to you in a few minutes.
Deanne: Now we are back with, uh, Pam McElvane from MBA Diversity Magazine. And just before the break we started to talk about, uh, personal brand and I— Pam I know you are, um, personal brand is very important to you. Is there a difference with how a person sees themselves versus how others see you and which is more important or are they both the same?
Pam: Oh, boy. Those are good questions. Yes, there— there is a difference. Um, on how a lot times how people see themselves and how others perceive you or how others sees yo- er, see you. Um, it's difficulty to say which is more important. I would they are equally important, um, but it is very clearly important that you know yourself and that you're really clear on what differentiates you from anyone else. And I think it's also important that you're part of driving and shaping what others— how others perceive you. People are gonna' always bring their own influences, uh, and experiences in defining who you are, but it's important that, t that influence about you comes from you. So, um, they're equally important, but, um, I think it's very very, um, it's a necessary requirement that, that you are a person trying to drive your own brand is able to influence what others think about you.
Deanne: So, personal brand is really influenced by, your authentic self? Is that what you would say is the correct term for that?
Pam: Um, definitely bring your authentic self to your personal brand. Your personal brand, um, really is how you want others to define you. It's bigger, it's bigger than life, it's bigger than you, and it'll go further than you ever will go. It'll travel, um, around the world— million more miles than you ever bill— you ever will. Um, you basically want people, when they say your name, to be able to relate it to something and if it is authenticity, then that's great. And that's because that is when, um, they've ever— they've— they read or see any information or images, um, about who you are and they can relate it to something of success. So, Pam McElvane for example, in most of my circles from a business perspective is related to Diversity MBA. It's related to our business brand and almost one and the same, but from a personal perspective I want people to perceive, um, the authentic— the authenticity that I do bring to the table which that we're honest, that we're trustworthy, that we're high ethics, high integrity, high quality. So what all these things— is to be attached to Pam McElvane personally but then also to be demonstrated through the business brand. Um, and so people have to work hard and part of "how do I build that?" well if you have to be really clear what your own message is and to be really clear what it is you are— who you are and in defining who you are and as you define who you are, it's showing up the same time, all the time. You know, it's not— not necessarily, you know, being confusing to people in the market place as well as the— your closest friends. This really being messy, again, you're talking about the authenticity of one's self.
Deanne: That is very interesting
Pam: So others can be able to articulate how they see— how you want them to see you and then they can add their own experience to it. "I can relate to her because she, you know, she does these things very well and I- I resonate with that." (())
Deanne: Now in this world of social networking, I mean we have Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn, and a whole bunch of others. Can that be a problem with developing your personal brand?
Pam: If— if you're not— if you're not strategic in using it. I- I believe, um, one, social media is absolutely necessary today because you do have audiences that primarily only communicate that way and I think as people develop their brand, I know for me, um, I— every— each component of social media I have a different strategy for. Uh, the strategy I have for LinkedIn is a very different strategy I have for Facebook and a very strategy for twitter and I think, uh, and you also have to be careful in terms of what you want out there. And, and the— and the messages that you want to put out there 'cause at— at anyone- at any given time you want to be able to have a ripple effect within the message but at the same time you want to make sure that anyone can use it anyway. So, for example, um, LinkedIn is one of the most trusted, um, it is the most trusted, um, social media platform for professionals. Not just for career, but just for connecting, um, and building relationships. So, I use LinkedIn as a major league professional networking for, you know, professionals that I want to connect with, for very experienced people. I use Facebook f for— as a college strategy. Really reaching out to the young generation and providing them information; always having content, always having new and fresh information out there for them. And then I use twitter through our events, where we can begin to, um, if you want to share, if you're a blogger, then that's a great thing to use twitter for, if you're personally always bringing new content and information. And the things that they all have in common is that social media is not only a connecting, but it is an information platform that you can always bring current, fresh, updated content to the folks that you're trying to stay connected with or that you're trying to brand to. And— but you have to be very careful and very strict and— in the parameters that you're going to use in those platforms.
Deanne: Yeah, because it can come back to bite you later on, right?
Pam: It— it absolutely will, <laughter> big one, too.
Deanne: Yeah, kind of like the old, uh, bad photos, right? <Laughter>
Pam: Right, right.
Deanne: Yeah, wow. You know, I— I know when you're— publishing world, trend watching is very very important. Um, can trend watching be a success strategy in today's market place?
Pam: I absolutely think so, and I— I believe so, not think so. Um, and I just— and I think that's a great question that you asked because I— I believe in the past we haven't really needed to, uh, look at a lot of different trends, parteculy in— particularly in career development. Um, we might have looked at examples of people being successful, but now with today's information, um, that's out there, there's so much information and there's also various sources. I mean, Diversity MBA Magazine, we do benchmarking and we rank the best places for companies to work. Uh, they have people— er, diverse managers (men) and women that are in management and then there's others: Diversity Inc., Working Mothers, uh, Fortune 100, that's— really looks at companies who are best places to work for. And so, as in your career, if you want to look at it as a sucstress— success strategy, there's a couple things. There's companies that're saying, "Hey, we're publically committed to promoting women and people of color." And then you have, you know, where are some of the best practices within those organizations, in terms of looking at how they develop talent. You can actually look at trends and see how organizations are developing their talent and if it is a company that I would want to work for, and even gathering information to have this kind of conversation in an interview process. You also can look at companies from a market perspective to see what they're doing on the consumer side.
Deanne: Mhm.
Pam: Where you can you be able to have that conversation and that knowledge to talk about how are you linking what you're doing in the consumer side to what you do internal to your culture, in helping, you know, move your career and how you engage and develop people. So there's so much information and all you got to do is, what, is ask Google and so <laughter> and then go back and, you know, look at QPEW Resources, that's a, uh, really large research organization and that—that can let you look at what're some of the key trends in business, some of the key trends in what your area or field of interest is. And let the organization know that you're either working in or that y- the next level you looking at, or that you are volunteering at understand that you have a broader understanding of what's going on in the market place. Um, and there's so many things that go into benchmarking, go into looking at trends, as, uh, one should make a decision—as you make dif- different types of decisions in different, you know, walks of life.
Deanne: Yeah. I- I agree with that completely. You know, I think trend watching is probably more important than ever. I don't think we had to worry about that, you know, twenty years ago.
Pam: Mm-mm, mm-mm.
Deanne: But I think today, I- I think it's, is critical for people who want to really be considered as a leader in their organization or, uh, a person who wants to be a manager. You know, whatever you career path is, I think trend work—trend watching is right at the top of, just, keeping a pulse on what's going on out there and what people are interested in. I, eh, I— I definitely agree with that, a hundred percent.
Pam: Absolutely.
Deanne: You know, what I am— things I'm seeing is, you know, in society we've seen a huge shift in education. You know, before World War II, only three percent of the population had- had college degrees and now we're at about seventy percent have college degrees, so we're very much into a continually learning type of, society. One of the questions I have is, what're you seeing aft— the role of education once you complete college and you get that first job, do you think continual learning is still important?
Pam: I absolutely do. And you are absolutely right in your assessment, in particular what's happening in- in academia. And one of the things that is- is happening, uh, particularly in the diversity space, is the gap of, um—universities are very concerned and really want to fill the gap between providing education and what's actually going on in- in companies, both either entrepreneurial or within large organizations. And so, once an individual, um, what you- what we call OJT, on the job training, and also becoming engaged in inclusion of that organization and that— and we're talking about culture now. So, once you're—go through your training on the job and you're understanding the culture, then those two will now get you in really what we call a sustainable l level within the organization, but to really be able to get to the next level, to be able to bring out, um, your expertise and how you're different, you have to be engaged, I believe, your tire- entire career in the continuous learning process. That has to be, um, I think, depending on the discipline, um, you may have to go back and actually take certifications, you ma y not have or might need.
Deanne: I agree
Pam: A person might need to go back and take additional courses and get a graduate degree, or take additional courses.
Deanne: Yes
Pam: Or, a Masters or, and/or Doctorate. You may have to go back, maybe it's just courses that you just have to stay abreast to, maybe certain types of certifications. And then there's some that doesn't necessarily require it, but because you aspire to get into a different— the next level wall, it's good to, uh, take advantage of the internal education programs your organizations have as well as take advantage of the external education programs that your organization will pay for.
Deanne: I agree
Pam: Where I can go to a university and take a leadership certification and/or get a higher level degree.
Deanne: I've got, I've got one real quick question
Pam: Yep.
Deanne: Most everything I've read and this just—we only have a couple minutes left.
Pam: Oh yeah, sure.
Deanne: Most CEOs, I've read, read at least one book a month. Do you agree with that?
Pam: Absolutely
Deanne: Do you read at least one book a month?
Pam: Absolute- yes. Probably a little bit more, um, just because of the nature of my business, but a minimum of one book a month.
Deanne: Interesting
Pam: What will keep you abreast of some of the best, um, information out there.
Deanne: Alright, just wanted to kinda' check with that. Now, I want you to tell us, a little bit; we only have about two minutes left--
Pam: Okay.
Deanne: Want you to tell us a little bit about, uh, MBA Diversity Magazine. I know it has a readership of a million plus globally. Tell us a little bit about it, who's the audience, how do people get a copy of your magazine, and things like that.
Pam: Oh, excellent. Um, Diversity MBA is the management and leadership publication. Our website is, um, www. diversitymbamagazine.com. Uh, you may go online and—and subscribe to, uh, a complimentary subscription, annual subscription. We publish quarterly. Uh, we do reach over a million worldwide. Um, we have a lot of global and local partners. Our audience, we target, uh, the graduate students, um, and college. We target current professionals, entrepreneurs, as well as, uh, corporate executives, and at the end of the day anyone that is looking to enhance their management and leadership skills, we're the publication for you.
Deanne: So the- there's a free copy and then they can subscribe to a yearly?
Pam: Yes, they can subscribe to an annual subscription, which will be complimentary and then, clearly, they can purchase, uh, the print copies. We do print- we do print as well.
Deanne: Well, uh, a- as we're wrapping up here, only- we're down to about thirty seconds here. Is there one last suggestion for women out there that you would have for them to be successful?
Pam: Yes, I do. I think, um, if we can each reach one to teach one, where we can, um— where we show up and are excellent in one area, if we can support another woman and each— in any of her endeavors, it could just be one thing, um, I think that will be huge in creating confidence, um, in women in business. So if we can reach one— each one, reach one, to teach one, um, would be my advice. It's that no matter what it is, if we continue that chain in supporting each other.
Deanne: Wow, well, thank you. I, appreciate you being on Today's Inspiring Women. You were just a phenomenal guest.
Pam: Oh my, thank you.
Deanne: And, uh, for our listening audience, we're going to be taking a short break. Uh, stay tuned as we go on and discuss the qualities of great leadership after the break.
Second Guest (Host: Deanne DeMarco)
Deanne: Welcome back to Today's Inspiring Women. I'm your host, Deanne DeMarco. And we're going to be talking a— now about l leadership. I get a lot of questions from people asking me, "What is the difference between a leader and a manager?" And "What do leaders really do?" and "What skills do leaders need to have if you're going to— to be a leader?" So I'm going to talk a little bit about that this— this part of the, show today.
So, first of all, what's the difference between a leader and a manager? Well, leadership is really that one-to-many relationship as compared to a one-to-one relationship of a manager. That's pretty much it in a nutshell. The second question I'm asked a lot is, so what do, what do leaders do? What's the work that leaders do? Well, basically, leaders help to create a vision. They help to build alignment and they are champions of, and oversee the execution of that vision. So, those three pieces that a l leader— the work of a leader includes crafting a vision, uh, of new possibilities for the future through exploration, boldness, and testing of assumptions. The second part of that is a leader needs to build alignment, so leaders build alignment by communicating with clarity, engaging in dialogue, and providing inspiration so everyone is moving in the— in the same direction in the organization. And the third aspect of what the work leaders do is they— is around execution. So, leaders finally, um, leaders need to champion execution through building momentum and structure and feedback and enabling the— the group to capitalize on its talents while making that vision a reality. So, I'm gonna' be diving into a little bit more around vision, alignment, and execution, um, at this time, so let's go on and talk about this a little bit more. So, what do we mean by vision?
Vision is, …..there's a difference between vision and a goal, so let's say, for our company we wanted to make ten million widgets this year. Well, that is actually a goal, whereas a vision is that we want to be the world leader in widget making while maintaining the highest quality standards in the industry that makes widgets. So that would be the vision as compared to a goal, so that's a little bit different, uh, way of looking at things. So, vision is important because it expands, um, assumptions about what is to be done. It provides purpose for the organization, the teams that supports your organization, and the individuals as well as the leader as well. Vision also drives the development of specific vision supporting goals, like making the ten million widgets a year, and it helps to unify people. So that's what vision is really all about and there are three drivers in creating vision and those drivers are exploration, boldness, and testing of assumptions. And we're gonna' be touching on just a couple of these because we don't have time to cover them all. We're going to touch on just a couple of these, so what does exploration of driving vision, what does that really mean? That— that driver for vision? So, in dri- being exploring and driving vision is really all about remaining open uh, and prioritizing the big picture. There are actually three sub-drivers here, but we're gonna' touch on— on just one of these. So those three sub-drivers are, um, to explore, to be bold, and to test assumptions. So in the piece of exploration, we— the best practices around vision are to remain open and to prioritize big ideas. Remaining open is all about, um, not being so focused on a single idea but be willing to, uh, explore a lot of different ideas. Being open and unstructured and looking at a lot of different ideas and not jumping in too quickly on— on a decision, so really trying to be re- open as far as looking at different ideas. And the second piece is prioritizing the big picture, being able to think broadly, kinda' like big brush strokes. Being able to think broadly about how everything is going to fit together rather than concentrating on single, individual little details. So, it's really about looking at those— those bigger ideas. So, it's all about looking at how ideas might fit into current plans, um, maybe when you embrace a bigger picture view you are then able to more likely notice when, uh, there are outdated assumptions or practices that are maybe hindering your team or the organization.
There are other drivers of vision as well and that's boldness and testing assumptions and we can dive into those maybe at another time, another show. The second thing that I'd like to talk about is alignment. Alignment is, uh, refers to the act of getting buy-in for the vision from everyone who has a role in making that vision a reality, so alignment ensures that people are on the— the same page from both, uh, a task as well as an emotional perspective. So it's like everyone is aligned and/or working together. So alignment requires an ongoing, one-way and a two-way communication. In fact, part of the failure, um, of vision is not having both one-way and two-way communication. What it is not, it's not a check-off list. Uh, alignment is— is really a dynamic, ongoing process that requires the leader to continually and realign as the conditions change and the needs of the organization change. So alignment is important because it sets the stage. Uh, it sets the stage for proposing a plan for effective implementation. It— it provides a forum for questions and concerns from— from other managers and leaders in the organization. It helps to bring people together behind the vision. If you don’t have an alignment, people can't align up behind it. You can't help be the cheerleaders around it. And it also generates excitement or— for the vision, so that alignment is a c crucial, crucial piece in getting the vi- the vision to become reality. So, when it comes to alignment in your organization, you need to understand that there are a number of different variables that can come into play when looking at alignment. For example, some of those variables would be formal versus informal communication. Face-to-face and virtual environments where a lot of organizations today have a lot of virtual and global communication, and employees. So how is the alignment around face-to-face and virtual environments? Lateral and hierarchical organizational structures, so every organization has a hierarchical structure, which some of the organizations are pretty tall, as well as lateral. So, how is that communication both laterally and as well as in a hierarchical structure? And how is your companies communication around negotiating competing interests?
One of the things that I get pulled into a lot is helping resolve internal conflict, say, between sales and marketing or between finance and marketing. And a lot of time there's some competing interest around the same end products, so how is the alignment in your organization around those issues as well? There are three drivers with alignment as well, and those three drivers are around clarity, dialogue, and inspiration. And I'm going to touch on these, in just a little bit more depth than I did in the first piece.
So let's talk a little bit about clarity— the clarity driver that drives alignment. So the two things we need to look at as far as clarity is— are you someone who, is more intuitive, or do you explain your rationale? Are you more impromptu in your messaging or are you more structured in your messaging? Say that you need to be able to explain your rationale clearly, are you logical, are you being able to, uh, explain the rationale behind the vision to others so they can understand it versus just being reactive and being intuitive around your— your message. And the other one is a structured message versus an impromptu message. You know, a lot of times leaders are— tend to be— have a tendency to be impromptu and what ends up happening is in those impromptu messages, um, those leaders who tend to deliver impromptu messages, often provide unnecessary details, they go off in tangents, and people have trouble identifying the main points and you end up losing their attention. So, as a leader in trying to drive alignment, you need to really— maybe outline your message so that people can understand what you're trying to say in a nice, logical— approach to the message that you're trying to get across. Another one in—with alignment, is the type of dialogue that you, get involved in also drives alignment. Are you someone who just presents information or are you someone who is willing to exchange perspectives on information? In other words, are you inviting people to respond or are you pretty closed? One of the best practices around this are for leaders to solicit other people’s opinions and input and not be close-minded. So you're not just presenting information, but you're opening it up and asking for other people’s information that they might have. So there by— in that way you're then gaining alignment around vision and you're inviting a participatory type of approach, which is often a lot more effective. If a person does not feel like they're part of the process then what ends up happening is engagement and morale will both suffer. In the— in the last piece of this piece that I want to touch on just before break here is the difference between are you someone who's challenging or are you someone who's receptive? Do you have a tendency to challenge other people’s ideas or are you someone who is open to new ideas, and willing to create, an open dialogue with people so they don't feel — criticized or minimized when speaking with you— which is what challenging does. So, by being receptive, you're creating a culture of people who are not afraid to— to share their ideas. And people want to know that their words will be met with openness when they decide to— to speak up. I see we— that— we're ready for a break here. So let's, uh, go ahead and take a break and we'll come back and talk a little bit more about leadership.
Deanne: Welcome back, this is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women and I am talking about leadership and what's the difference between managing and leading and what're some of the key elements of what do leaders do— and some of those qualities and skills that leaders need to attain. And just before break we started talking a little about, uh, the second, uh, skill set which is around alignment. And— 'cause alignment is one of those areas that leaders tend to have a problem with as they— they wonder why their vision doesn't get carried out the way that they want it to get carried out and part of it is because of the alignment piece. It tends to be a really challenging a— area, so one of the things I had talked about just before break was the difference between are you someone who is more challenging or are you someone who is more receptive to other people’s ideas. And while a lot of managers or leaders tend to have a tendency to be challenging other people’s ideas. Um, while this helps you in— and in your mind your— your solutions are logical, it does not help other people, um, and— to feel like they're actually being deflated when their ideas or concerns are criticized or minimized. So what's really important is that a leader needs to create a culture where people are not afraid to share, because otherwise if you don't create that culture even when you, uh, ask them for their opinion, if they feel like their ideas in the past have been criticized or minimized, they're going to be afraid to share their opinions and you don't want that. You really need other people's perspectives on things. Uh, so people want to know that their words will be met with openness, uh, when they finally do decide to— decide to speak up. So, as a leader, best practice is that you need to be more receptive to the ideas of others and to focus on exchanging perspectives to provide that dialogue that others need as well and I want to talk a little more because alignment is definitely one of those areas. So maybe you're someone who tends to present information versus exchanging perspectives, maybe you're someone who tends to be more challenging versus receptive, so what are some tips for improvement? So, one of the tips that you can do is, um, even if your first instinct is to dismiss an opinion, you need to encourage a discussion so that you can understand the person's thought process behind their opinion. Not only will this help people feel that— that they are being heard, it might help you also to get a fresh perspective or insights as well. Need to, uh, be willing to avoid challenging or completely dismissing other people's opinions. Um, being receptive will create a culture which people feel, um, more comfortable in contributing. You need to be proactive about thanking people for the feedback, even if you don't agree. I know it's tough, but even if you don't agree with what was said, you need to thank them for their feedback anyways. Just, "Thank you for your perspective on that." This will help people feel that it's, um, worth their efforts to be part of this dialogue. So the next time that you have a question they're ((unintelligible)) more willing to open up. And make sure that your tone, uh, of voice and your body language says that you're being receptive. Your, you know, there's a lot of research between what is said and tone and body language and if your body language is saying that you really don't want to hear their opinion, I've got news for you: people are not going to speak up. So your— your tone of voice and your body language also needs to be really clear that you are open and receptive to the information that they're giving, uh, giving to you. You know, it's not always what you say but how you say it that will have the biggest impact in— in moving forward. I do want to talk a little bit about the third skill set, which is execution. So in execution, w— execution is making the vision reality. That's what execution is really about. It's turning the imagined future, uh, and the imagined future condition into a— a reality, so in carrying out the vision that you have. Successful execution of a vision can't happen without a deep commitment and support of the leader. So, it's not just something you give to somebody. You need to stay committed and being supportive as the leader in driving and executing that vision to make it reality. So execution is important because it propels the development of concrete strategies. It makes the vision actionable. It gives people a sense of achievement and it fulfills the promise of the vision. You need to understand that you have a definite role in executing the vision. The questions I— you need to ask yourself: Are you someone who is more hands on or are you less hands on? Are you advocating for resources or do you just provide resources? Are you helping to create strategy or just following strategy? Are you helping to establish a culture or supporting the culture? You need to understand that there are also three drivers in execution as well and those three drivers are momentum, structure, and feedback. I mean if you want a culture where people want to work, you have to be the driver of that. So let's talk a little bit more about the momentum aspects of driving execution. Are you someone who is low-key or are you someone who is really driven? Uh, and it goes both ways. I've worked with leaders that are on both ends of this continuum. If you're someone who tends to be very rapid— into rapid progress, you may grow restless when energy seems to drag. As the leader you need to create a culture with, uh, a substantial focus on results. This keeps people on their toes and provides a sense of drive and a— and a competitive spirit. You need to create a sense of momentum for others by encouraging them to push themselves to do their very best. And the second piece of that is are you someone who is reactive or are you someone who initiates, uh, opportunities? So, uh, as a leader who tends to, uh, initiate, you're someone who is more open to fresh opportunities. You're more likely to call attention to areas of improvement and to kick off new projects. This is kinda' that entrepreneurial spirit of leadership, is that initiating, um, skill set. 'Cause it helps to create a culture of people— are— tend to be proactive and, uh, in that— in being proactive tends to be valued. When a leader shows initiative, the group is more likely to grow and extend is— its reach much— much further than simply trying to maintain the status quo. So the— the three drivers, again, of execution are all around momentum, so you're trying to really build that momentum, structure, and then feedback as well. So let's talk a— a little bit more about the structure, uh, skill set. So in structure, it's, um, working to, um, help people plan and analyze more in depth. So with that piece of the information, are you someone who improvises or do you develop a solid plan? If you're someone who tends to improvise and you're trying to figure things out along the way, well, that may help you; it doesn't help the people who you're trying to lead. Um, people that you're trying to lead get very anxious when they don't have a well-defined structure to depend on. Without a clear process, your group can— can suffer considerably in— in being inefficient. Um, they can b— they can suffer with redundancies and there can be a lot of frustration with your employees as well and what ends up happening is those inefficiencies, ((redundancies)), and frustrations can end up threatening the successful execution of the vision. I know this ((was)) just a really short, little, uh, information around what leaders do, but if you were a leader or if you are aspiring to be a leader within your organization and you would like more information, there's a ton of information on what leaders do, uh, contact me at [email protected]. I actually have an assessment that you can take that's called "The Work of Leader Profile" that can actually help you assess where you're skill sets—- skill sets are in creating a vision, building alignment, and are you, in fact, a champion around execution to make the vision a reality? So this is, uh, a little bit information around what leaders— what leaders do. It's all about creating that vision, building alignment, and then champing— being that champion in executing the vision and going forward. One of our primary, um, sponsors for Today's Inspiring Women is, uh, Breaking Boundaries International. Breaking Boundaries International provides a personalized coaching and corporate training services to business professionals and organizations. If you are looking to break through your personal boundaries and career roadblocks, they are there to help. Breaking Boundaries provides coaching and training to organizations who want to create corporate culture where people want to work. Breaking Boundaries International has won national recognition from Training Magazine's Top 100 for their management coaching clinic program. Their services include executive and personal coaching, corporate training for managers; Breaking Boundaries can also provide a motivational business speaker for your next business meeting or conference. They can be reached at www.breaking-boundaries.com or they can be reached at 866-91-COACH.
In wrapping up today's show, I want to leave you with a quote from, Dr. D.M. Burns. And Dr. Burns say that, "We need to aim for success, not perfection. Never give up your right to be wrong, because then you will lose the ability to learn new things and to move forward with your life."
This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women. Until next time, have a wonderful day.
Dr Christine Poole and Maribeth Kasmanski
Scientific Breakthrough and Marketing
Host: Deanne DeMarco
Guests: Dr. Caroline Le Poole. Associate Professor of Pathology at Loyola University in Chicago.
Maribeth Kuzmeski. Red Zone Marketing.
Deanne: Welcome to Today's Inspiring Women. I’m your host, Deanne DeMarco. If you are ready to take the next steps to become inspired, empowered motivated and better equipped for success, then stay tuned. Each week we address relevant topics for women to spark your career and life growth.
Today we have a celebrity in the science field. I am just honored to introduce you to Dr. Caroline Le Poole, who received master’s degree and PhD from universities in the Netherlands.
In 1993 she defended her PhD and was the first woman to receive a PhD from the department of dermatology in the 100years of that schools existence, which I think is just phenomenal.
In 1995 Caroline came to the United States, to work at the University of Cincinnati. In 1999 she moved to Loyola University in Chicago where she is currently an Associate Professor of Pathology.
In February of this year, just a short time ago, she had a significant ground breaking discovery for vitiligo. Which some people refer to it as the Michael Jackson’s disease. This skin disorder affects as many as 65 million people worldwide, with at least one million of those people here in the United States.
I am so honored to welcome Dr. Caroline Le Poole. Caroline welcome to Today's Inspiring Women.
Caroline: Thanks Deanne this is a really wonderful opportunity. I am equally honored. It is great to be able to speak to your audience, and of course we have a great connection here. Because I’ve heard from you, that you also have some background in the biological sciences. So that’s absolutely fascinating.
Deanne: Yeah that was my first career. I’d really like to talk about your journey as a scientist. Was it smooth going for you, or there were some real challenges that you needed to deal with along the way?
Caroline: Well I think that any woman in any job has special challenges in work. Whether these are all unique to my particular field or whether they are just something that we share among women. Of course we always that one thing that if we raise children or if we have a family to care for, that this can be a real juggling in time.
But I think maybe in the biological sciences has its really special challenges because biological materials don't wait for you to come back. So you have cells growing in a flask and you got to be there on time to feed them. It’s a matter of feeding the baby or feeding the cells at some point. That I think was always the most important challenge to me.
There is always something that comes also with a certain expectation in my particular case, because I had family members and sibling and parents that also had a big interest in science.
So at some point I felt, you want to meet that expectation and as the challenges came up along the way. I’m happy to say that with everything said and done, or where I am now, I can now at least see that it was all worth it.
Deanne: One of the things that I was really impressed with is that you were the first woman to receive your PhD from this school’s 100 year history. I mean holy smokes.
Caroline: I’ll be very honest with you, I only knew this when my diploma was being handed to me by the professor, Professor Bosch from Amsterdam University. He actually made mention of that in his speech, when he handed me my paperwork. In front of all those people he mentioned, well you know she is the first woman in our department to ever receive her PhD. That’s of course really a great thing.
But, I think that also means that I really didn’t pay that much attention to whether there were women or men that were working in the field at that time. I know that there has been a lot of women that have followed the path and it’s really opened up. Yes that was a very fascinating thing to hear at that point.
Deanne: So you didn’t recognize any barriers that you were facing in that journey?
Caroline: I most definitely did. But not necessarily would I have recognized that I would be the first to face those challenges at the time. I guess I tried to brush them away to some extent, and I’ve worked really hard to be prepared for the interviews.
I was actually out of the field of science for maybe one and a half, two years. There were people that were freshly out of college that would probably would have found it easier to speak about the research they had recently done. So how do you make something sound really fresh even though it’s been a while?
Maybe I’ve worked that little harder to make it stick and to come through. There could be something to the fact that because of that maybe insecurity that I had going in, that I worked that little bit harder and that helped. Obviously they gave me the position.
There is also that other thing at that point I accepted a position that was actually a half time position. As women maybe we more have a tendency to say, hey that’s an opportunity for us, whereas it’s actually also an extra challenge. Because if you try to do science half time it’s extremely difficult because experiments can take longer than you actually have time allotted to finish them.
I think that’s something that we really have to juggle a little bit harder maybe, in those situations. Because I saw that half time position which my family life at that point made a lot of sense, maybe I was a little bit more eager to step into that situation.
Deanne: Yeah you’re right. I was in the field of microbiology too. I tried to take a half work load, and that was like an impossible thing to do, because you’re trying to grow your cultures. They have to be read every 24 to 48 hours.
Caroline: Exactly. That’s very much what it is. Not only that, but it seem to me that all the important meetings happen to take place exactly when that other half of the time when you’re not there. So you have to kind of give in a little bit.
Deanne: From your perspective what’s special about working in the biological sciences field?
Caroline: I think there is many very fascinating sides to it. That’s of course little bit from my own personal perspective. But I’ve always been very fascinated with anything that has to do with the living world.
There is something exciting about the sciences in the sense that you can at times you’re the first to find something. You’re the first person to know. I think we all like to be in that situation, right?
If you go from that fascination and you get really opportunities, I think in biological sciences there is this connection to other basic sciences. There is also connections to for example languages, how do organisms communicate with each other in languages that we as people don't really recognize yet. I can still be very fascinated by all of that.
You also get to take additional steps, right? Especially in my case where, and also your case then, where the biomedical field also gives you the opportunity to look at what is different from normal and disease situations. Is there anything we can do about it, can we engineer a way out of any unhealthy situation.
A step that I’m at least hoping to take, because of the findings that you were just mentioning before, is to collaborate with awesome scientists clinicians that we have here. In order to be able to take the findings a step further and possibly go into patient treatment.
All together it’s just fascination with what's going on. To see if you can do anything about it if you don't like the way it is.
Deanne: One of the things I think we should probably just touch on, I mean you had this ground breaking discovery. A lot of times people in our audience think, oh great this is going to be available for me tomorrow.
Caroline: Well I think you bring up a very important point of caution. Because despite my own excitement, I certainly have a lot of that. But it’s of course more realistic to say that there is a lot of steps to be taken before we can actually bring our findings to clinics.
We’ve been very busy and trying to understand the disease vitiligo, which is a disease where patients gradually lose pigment over time.
We’ve been able to be involved in the steps that identify this as an auto immune disease. Which were really kind of the first steps in order to see if there were ways that we could interfere with the development of auto immunity. Even if you have the genetic predisposition to that disease there are still steps to be taken to possibly interfere with the actual precipitation of that disease in patients.
It’s great that we can look at this in animal models. But, we have to be sure that we can translate this to a human situation that is actually safe and that we can get all the regulatory approvals in place and get all the people aligned to actually bring this to a clinical trial. There is definitely some time ahead of us before it comes to that point.
Deanne: That’s one of the things that people generally just don't understand. We have about two minutes before break here. I’d like to ask you one question is, how did you balance your family life and your lab life as well? How did you actually end up doing that?
Caroline: Well in my case I think there were some luck steps in the sense of getting help from outside. We had au pairs at home when the children were very small. That made it possible for me to spend time and for my girls to be in their own environment at home. Stay with the kids’ right around the corner if they wanted to. So that was helpful.
I think in a more general sense it really requires a lot of understanding from people. Both my children themselves and my partner to know that I have a lot of time to be spent. Not just by being physically absent, sometimes my mind would go somewhere else and I think that’s something that I really had to adjust to, to make sure that I could actually separate the time that I spent in the lab and this time that I spent at home.
I think that’s just a major thing to learn because you want to be there for the kids when they need you, but you can't always be. So you miss a lot of the events as they grow up.
I felt that’s difficult on the other hand, I think that by now if we look back I am happy to see that they can also start making something of their own life and their own interest. I think now they have come to a point where they’re okay with it. Even though for a long time I think that’s been difficult.
Deanne: I think it is. We only have about one minute to break here. I got to ask you one really quick question. I was in microbiology as well, and to this day I am just like paranoid about clean counters at home.
Caroline: Well actually you asked a very good question, because I honestly thought I didn’t have the time for that.
Deanne: I’m just curious.
Caroline: I think it’s a natural inclination if you’re microbiologist. The other side of it is, you either get the science done or you get the counter clean.
Deanne: I just had to ask, just had to ask. We’re going to be taking a short break here. Stay tuned we’re going to be right back on Today's Inspiring Women with Dr. Carol Le Poole
Welcome back we are speaking to Dr. Caroline Le Poole from Loyola University. This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women.
Caroline just before break we were talking about some of the issues around being in the biological sciences and being a mum some the juggling act that you have to do.
Deanne: One of the questions that I have that continues on that vein, are there challenges in science that are unique to women that may not be involved in the other fields?
Caroline: Well I think that kind of shows in the fact that there is still a very marked under representation of women at least among faculty. It doesn’t start out that way. I think we certainly go in 50/50, if not more. Ultimately I think in the leadership positions we still see less women.
I think in part it’s because of the challenges that we have because of facing family situations as well as work which both require a lot attention. But I think of course in a sense that’s certainly grown for men as well. They can take on more and more responsibilities at home as well.
You don't want it to become a real competition at home, because that makes it very difficult to keep a solid family life. Certainly I’ve faced my challenges in that regard as well.
I think we come in to it from a perspective of meeting the expectations of a field where 80% of the people are men. They have their unique perspective, if we don't understand the language that comes from male dominated field then we can't meet them either.
We don't have to necessarily have to speak the same language, but I think we certainly need to understand it in order to write grants that can be successful. Or teach in a way that sticks.
Those are all things that as women coming into that world in order to make it to the next step, I think we have to understand exactly what it takes to make it within that particular environment.
Deanne: I think what I’m hearing is that there really isn’t gender equality in the scientific field?
Caroline: I don't think that we’re there yet. I think we do have sometimes somewhat different perspective on what's important to address in sciences. In some ways, we are more harsh. In other ways we are milder if we see applications by others.
There is a lot of effort being made within the sciences I think. In the pool in women always have an equal representation. That’s still very difficult, because there is a smaller pool to choose from.
In general when decisions are made and still with that, maybe 20%, 25% women that are taking part in these decisions. The decisions are still for a large part made by men. So then it really comes down to also their feel for how comfortable they are with different perspectives.
Deanne: So one of the questions I just thought of is, are there fewer women going into the scientific field as compared to men?
Caroline: I don't think so. I think right now. I think we’re looking at women that are coming in to graduate school for example, I think we’re pretty equal if not more than half. I think at some point I hope it will start growing and that we eventually just wind up being 50/50.
I have to say, I’ve see a lot of that happening even within the particular group of people that I work with, here in Tumor Immunology and Immuno therapy.
The percentage women has grown although I could say for a while I was the only woman left that was working. The only person working on that, but as the group has grown, it growing very nicely half, half. It just gives a little bit of a different feel.
Deanne: So in the groups that you mentor, you have an equal number of women as well as men who are going on for their PhDs? Or do most women stop at their master’s degree?
Caroline: No. I think they’re going in for their PhD. Right then you come to a point where you make a transition, as an independent investigator. I think that’s where it becomes really difficult.
I think the specific challenge that we face then is even everything else being equal at that point wherever you’re being hired that phase is going to make an enormous investment into you. These are really not numbers to seize at.
There is always that in thing that inclining that maybe a woman will have a family situation that will pull her out of what she’s doing, and give first priority to a family. That would take away from the enormous investment.
I think we have to maybe work that just a little bit harder to prove ourselves in that sense. I don't know that that can be imposed on anyone else. I certainly always felt that little bit of obligation to leave that mark, because I was worried that if I were to ever step out of it, that would leave kind of a mark for the people that I’m after.
As I’ve seen that happen, and I've seen it come up in situations or discussions with male colleagues, of female colleagues for that matter. I think it’s important to just kind of set that example that we can do it. And face the challenges and take the opportunities as they come along.
Deanne: Were there any, I mean this begs the question. Were there any specific strategies that you used?
Caroline: I think we can sometimes be in situation where we can take opportunities that are not, that maybe men might not be as comfortable with. I’m just saying, I think you and I both tried to get into positions that were really half time positions or really half time work is also half time pay.
Depending on where you are in the family whether you’re the caretaker or the sole care taker, or part of at least bringing in the family income that can be an acceptable situation or not.
We maybe sometimes in situations where that’s more acceptable for a while, even if you accept positions for lesser pay, even if you’re doing the same amount of work. If you can bite through that situation for a while, at least you have an opportunity to show yourself, whereas somebody else may not.
That’s where I think there are specific challenges but there is also specific opportunities that come with it. If you can ride it out for a while, if can be very rewarding.
Deanne: Rewarding in the end, yeah. I’ve got a question for you, as a mum in the sciences, do you inspire your children to go in the science field, or?
Caroline: It’s interesting that you ask that. I would say, until very long time ago, maybe four of five years ago I would have said, oh definitely not. The one thing that my children always told me was, the one thing they don't want to do, is what their mum did. A lot of work and very little pay.
As time that was probably most defiantly true. I see that they see that I really love what I do. I think that they also see that the passion that I bring to that has brought inspiration. I see that because they also want to study that much more. Go to college, get a degree and really make a world for themselves.
That’s very interesting to see, because for example my oldest daughter, she has children of her own now. She faces the same questions. I think that’s changed her perspective a lot.
I just want to say that because there are years where it really seems that you don't want to meet that challenge, because it’s so tempting to be there at all times and always give that one person to be there at the right time.
You can't always be there at the right time. If your child is sick and there is au pair to care for it, you have to be able to transfer that responsibility to somebody else. If we learn to do that, and we pick up on what’s emotionally important to the kids, I think eventually as I said I really do think it pays off.
Deanne: I know my kids always went to mum first whenever there was a science project at school. They go, hey ma, help me with this.
Caroline: That is true. That was so fun to do. I don't know if you, I just have very specific memories of the science project, yes.
Deanne: Yeah. Always keep moments. Part of me was really kind of glad that I had that opportunity to like shine a little bit.
Caroline: Yes, absolutely. Those were the, and maybe you know, your right as you say this, actually that makes me realize that, that’s probably some of the points that they stored.
That came back up about five years ago when they kind of reevaluated whether it was worthwhile going in that direction. I think they enjoyed it too, trying to figure out whether there were more bacteria in milk or in orange juice.
Deanne: Yup.
Caroline: Those are the kind of things you can do with them. Share what you are really doing every day. I think that can be inspiring.
Deanne: So, and we only have a couple minutes left, what tips do you have for women who want to move forward as a scientist?
Caroline: I would still say, take opportunities when they come your way. Don’t hesitate too much to see if you will be able to balance those things. The solutions will come your way if you really want them.
I feel, at least I imposed on myself that I think it’s important to work hard so that you kind of leave a mark that will make it easier for the next person.
Also to try to set up a strategy to separate the time that you spend at work from that at home. That’s I think the most important, especially because I kind of fell short on that at certain times in my life. I hope that would be helpful to others.
Deanne: Yeah, that’s good. Good comments. There is a couple of things we only have about a minute and a half left. I want to ask one quick question, so people understand this. How long have you been studying trying to come up with an answer for vitiligo?
So people know that it’s not something you did overnight. How long have you been involved in that? Then how is your research funded?
Caroline: I’ve been in vitiligo research since the very early 90s, so over 20 years. It continues to fascinate me, the connection that it has to other diseases and also what we’ve been able to learn over time. I research at least since I’ve come to the States. Also really back home.
It’s funded in large part as our other studies that are supported here at Loyola University Medical Center, through federal funding for a large part. Especially the National Institutes of Health and I really appreciate that opportunity that you’re giving me here in this question.
I think it’s very important that we all lobby or at least have a great understanding or hopefully also appreciation for that type of support. Which is kind of needs to come from Washington and go to the NIH to be distributed among the most deserving investigators. So we can go on and understand, design and test our new strategies in the biomedical sciences.
Deanne: Yeah, I mean, I don't think people realize how important that really is. This funding that comes from the government. Whether it be my cancer research studies or your vitiligo. It’s very, very important to get that support.
I can’t believe that our time is up here. I would like to thank you for being part of Today's Inspiring Women. I think that you’re a great role-model for women who do aspire to go in the biological sciences. I would like to really thank you for being part of this show today.
Caroline: Okay and thank you for this great opportunity. Really this is actually an inspiring opportunity for me to think about all these things that seem to be part of everyday life, but I didn’t give enough time to thinking about them.
Deanne: Wonderful. Anyway we got to take a short break. I’d like you to stay tuned. Our second guest today is going to be Maribeth Kuzmeski, who is going to take the mystery out of marketing.
We’re going to be talking about some of the best marketing strategies. Some of the mistakes that we need to be careful of, especially of those who are entrepreneurs in the whole marketing world and understanding marketing, as well as for corporate America as well.
So stay tuned. This is the Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women. So stay tuned for our next guest and we’ll come back and talk to you after these messages.
Deanne: Welcome back to Today’s Inspiring Women. I’m your host Deanne Demarco. My next speaker is Maribeth Kuzmeski and her firm Red Zone Marketing.
She’s consults and speaks for business from financial services firms to Fortune 500 corporations on strategic marketing, planning and business growth.
Maribeth has personally consultant some of the world’s most successful CEOs, entrepreneurs and professionals. Maribeth has written seven books including the best seller And The Clients Went Wild by Wiley. By the way that’s a fantastic book, if you’ve not seen it. She is regular media contributor appearing on Fox News, ABC, NBC, CBS, WGN-TV.
Her articles have been in publication including US Today, the Wall Street Journal, Chicago Tribune, New York Times, Entrepreneur and Forbes. We‘re very lucky to have Maribeth with us. Welcome Maribeth to today’s inspiring women.
Maribeth: Well thank you very much for having me.
Deanne: By the way I love your books. I just want to let everyone know that you have great; your books are really fantastic.
Maribeth: Thank you so much.
Deanne: You’re this marketing guru. Before you got to be this guru; a lot of our audiences are sitting there going, do I want to stay in corporate America. Do I want to be entrepreneur? How did you break from that from the norm, and decide to be this entrepreneur?
Maribeth: Well, I would love to tell you that there’s some real smart way that I came up with this decision. To be honest, I was out in Washington DC. I had just gotten MBA. I had a nice job working for a corporation.
My husband got transferred to the Midwest. We were happy to go to the Midwest, because I’m originally from the Midwest. But I was five months pregnant at the time. I figured that there’ no way that anyone is going to hire me at five months pregnant. Because I looked like I was nine months when I was five months.
So, I decided to open my own firm. I thought, well that would be nice. I could do that while the babies were growing up, and all of that. It would a good thing to do.
So I did it, sort of out of maybe necessity or I didn’t know other choices. I knew that I always wanted to have my own business, but you always what’s the right time. This wasn’t the right time, but it was the time for me.
Deanne: Wow. You’ve just grown this business into a very, very successful endeavor. I mean that’s just amazing. So, what are some of the best marketing strategies for working women today or working today?
Maribeth: Well, there are lots of great marketing strategies depending on whatever business that you are in. One of the things that we know to be true is that there’s a commonality between either entrepreneur or business professional, whether you work at a corporation, you have your own company, whatever it might be, and that’s the ability to connect and communicate.
If you can do that; I’m not saying you’ve got to be a great networker. Or you have to be superior, charismatic, and outgoing person. But you do have to figure out, how you’re going to let other people help you in your career.
I think it’s especially important for women. Women have less mentors than men do. It just seems like allowing others to help you. Getting out there and asking for help. And helping others at the same time is a really great way to forward your career.
We call it the art of social intelligence ,but it’s really connecting and communicating. I wrote a book call The Connector about this very topic. Because I realized that with all the marketing strategies available; the one that work the best was to get other people to talk about you.
How do you do that? It doesn’t happen through advertising necessarily. It doesn’t happen through writing direct mail letters. But it happens through other people. So, how are we going to meet people? And get out, and tell our story in way that others want to share.
Deanne: So in other words you can’t sit at home. You have to get out.
Maribeth: Well, today you can sit at home, because you can use the internet, social media and all those sort of things.
Deanne: That’s true.
Maribeth: But there’s nothing that has ever probably or will ever replace the face to face. Letting someone get to know how passionate you are about something. Nobody can sell what you’re doing and who you are better than you can.
Deanne: I believe that’s really true. So, what are some of the biggest mistakes in marketing that people make today?
Maribeth: I think the very biggest mistake in marketing; it’s not that you’re not spending enough money. Or doing all the things that we might think are our mistakes in marketing. We should invest more. We should spend more time. We should go to more networking event. But I think that the biggest; I know that the biggest in marketing is not messaging yourself properly.
I’ll give you a case and point. If you go to a business function, I work with a lot of financial advisors. Financial advisors sometimes are both inside the corporation, or they could be an entrepreneur.
The financial advisor goes to function. Somebody says, what do you do? They say, I’m a financial advisor. That actually makes the person they’ve just said that to, want to talk to them less, not more. Just because of the industry, they think you’re going to try to sell them life insurance or whatever.
But the next time they go to a business function knowing that’s going to be the reaction. They say the same thing, I’m a financial advisor. It doesn’t resonate. It doesn’t get any one excited. It actually repels them as opposed to compelling someone to talk with you.
But if you think about no matter what business you in. Somebody says what do you do or who do you work or what’s your job. You kind of just stumble over it a little bit. The reason that sometimes that happens is we’re not maybe comfortable talking about ourselves. But on the other side; if we can’t share what we’re doing especially as an entrepreneur, if you can’t share it clearly and concisely, not for you but for them, it fails.
So, if I say, I‘m a marketing consultant. I help a lot of people with business development. That doesn’t really entice people to get all excited about what I do. But if I have a specific way of describing it; I work with financial advisors to gross more than $1million and I help them find more clients.
That’s a different statement than the first statement. I just help anybody and everybody with marketing. It‘s kind of general in its blur. Or if I’m talking to a specific target audience, if I make my message work for that target audience. It turns into something that’s more successful.
So it’s all about messaging. How are we talking about ourselves? How are we talking about our company, our products, our services, and our staff? How are we doing that? Often time we need some help with it.
Deanne: Very interesting. So, it’s all about maybe even focusing on a benefit, that they may be looking for, to kind of hook them into a conversation with you.
Maribeth: It’s all about benefits. So, you see you got that absolutely right. Because the average of attention span in United States today is 9 seconds. So, if the average attention span is 9 seconds; no one is paying attention, unless you directly to them about something that’s interesting to them.
That’s how we have to get people’s attention today. Just because we’ve put up a billboard doesn’t mean that everyone is going to go and buy your stuff. It has to be compelling to those that you want to have buy.
It sounds easy, but it’s not that easy, because most entrepreneurs, or business owners don’t make it. They don’t make it in the business that they’ve chosen, because they haven’t been to; there’s lot of things you could say. Well it’s the funding. It’s this, it’s that. But we haven’t gotten people excited about it and buy.
We have to have enough people buying what we have, in order to get that extra level of funding. In order to get the thing off the ground we’ve got to compel people. That happens through the way the writing is our website. Our messaging verbally and things that other people say about you. You have to be in control of the message.
Deanne: Wow. That’s really good advice. I didn’t realize the average listening attention span is only 9 seconds. That’s strong.
Maribeth: Well yes. Soon can imagine that people listening to your radio show. Then they come back in and they listen. I think that they’re listening to your show because they want to.
But most people when they are out in situation; they are not necessary glued t, and listening to very word that someone else is saying. We‘ve got our cell phones going on. We’ve got all sorts of noise, distractions, and everything. Its different today that it was five years ago. It’s different in a way that’s not good.
Deanne: Wow. I got a question for you? Is it different for men versus women in putting together a message?
Maribeth: I think it’s the same. I believe that men have an easier; this is just blanket generalization. I think men in general have an easier time talking about themselves in some situations than women. That’s just what I’ve seen, that women aren’t, not that men are braggadocios, I don’t think women are either. I mean some are, some aren’t. But I think that women are more modest.
A case in point with a woman being modest, if somebody says to me, oh I really like your purse. I say, oh this old thing. I got this on sale. It’s always about how you got it on sale. You sort of bring it down. You say, well it‘s that. Thank you for saying that, but this is you know. We always are bringing ourselves back down.
A man, if somebody says, I really like boots. They go, thank you. I got paid full price for them, bla bla. It’s a different way of describing who they are and the things that they have.
I think in general, men and women have difficulty describing what it is that they do. But I think it might be a little bit more difficult for women.
Deanne: Wow that’s really good information. Is there one thing that you teach your consulting clients in order for them to be more successful.
Maribeth: Well it’s all about, for whatever business you are in; it’s all about the referrals you’re getting. The positive word of mouth. The experience you are creating. The reputation that you have. The royalty of your clients.
But it all comes down, to how are you communicating? What is it that you do? What is it that you’re going to do? How do you want them to talk to others about you?
So, most of our clients are service based. Well, service based is a little bit more intangible to talk about what actually they are going to get. They are not getting a bag filled with something. They are getting a service. You can’t put your hand on it in a lot of the cases.
So, this is where messaging is even more important in service based business. Even more important than it is even in a product based business. But I mean, I just think the number one way of getting more clients is to get the positive word out about you.
Now there are all sorts of strategies to do that. You could create a video and put it up on YouTube. It’s got to be compelling. A lot of people put things up on YouTube, on blog or do all the pushing of content out. But the content isn’t compelling to whom, to target the audience. The content has to be compelling.
They have to have no choice, but to read or to watch because it’s so compelling. That it’s hitting them over the head with, my gosh. I’ve got to listen to this video. If they don’t feel that way, and something is not telling them they should feel that way. Then we’ve got start from scratch on the marketing and figure out how we can get a better message that gets people compelled.
Deanne: Wow, I think it’s easier if you’re selling a cup or a bag or a purse or car. To say, here’s this purse. Here’s this car. Here’s this bag. It’s a thing versus trying to sell yourself. I think that’s a harder sell.
Maribeth: Yeah, it’s definitely because I can’t talk about a products and the product’s feelings aren’t going to be hurt. If I’m talking about myself and you don’t want to buy. Oh men; there’s one person that’s responsible for that and that’s me.
So, it’s a little bit different. It’s a little bit more risky, especially when we‘re selling ourselves. I speak a lot, all over. Speaking is the hardest thing because speaking is used as a marketing tool. But you’re front and center in front of everyone.
They’re either going to like you or like your message. Or not like you, and not like your message. It’s pretty risky to get up there and speak. That’s why; probably the number one fear is speaking. People don’t want to do it.
It’s the same reason that we don’t want sell ourselves, because there’s just the fear factor there; that there’s going to be some rejection. Nobody wants that. We don’t want any more than we already have.
Deanne: We’re going to take quick break here. Then we’ll back. We’re going to talk a little more. We learn a little bit more about this whole world around social media and marketing. Just take a few minutes here. We’ll take a big breath. We’ll be back with Maribeth Kuzmeski with Red Zone Marketing.
Deanne Welcome back. You’re listening to Today’s Inspiring Women. I’m the host Deanna Demarco. We‘ve got wonderful guest with us today from Red Zone Marketing. Maribeth Kuzmeski.
Maribeth is a very successful entrepreneur in the world of marketing. Maribeth, what I would like to go into this side of the break is talk little about social media. It’s everywhere. Do social media really help a business?
Deanne: Well it depends on what business you have. But almost always, social media, when done properly does help business. Because it gives you something that you can’t get otherwise, that’s exposure. It’s the number one reason that, it’s not about having a million connections on Twitter or things like that.
It’s really about; hey do I have a message that I can push out in a way that people who have asked to connect with me can receive. That’s what social media is all about.
I think that the issue with social media today, is that a lot of businesses don’t know how to utilize it properly. I think that the key with social media today is being able to promote your business products, and services by offering value.
Not by selling because social media is not a place to be selling your wares. But to offering value in getting people interested by t the blogs that you’re writing. The things that you’re posting.
The information that you’re finding, that you’re sharing with audience. Really being a value driven social media person as opposed to; here’s our special, here’s our sale. Here are all things that we’re doing.
It’s not quite in line with what social media is all about. Social media is about socially connecting with people. If there’s a value that you can provide that really makes the big difference.
Deanne: So, some piece of knowledge is what I think I’m hearing you say. That you need to giving to people around your area of expertise.
Maribeth: Yes exactly. You want; I mean your platform could be your blog, your writing and things like that. But if nobody sees it, it doesn’t really matter.
If it’s valuable then you can, you write a blog on a topic that helpful to your target market. You can tweet about it. You can post it up on Facebook. You can start picking some comments around it. And get people passing it along to the people that they are connected to. Retweeting, commenting on your post, and things like that.
That’s really were the key is because if nobody is making any comments, they‘re not retweeting your posts. Then you have to think maybe I’ve got figure out a different post. Maybe I’ve got to come up with some different things. You don’t want to be spinning our wheels. Doing all of this posting and writing. Doing all of this content development for social media.
But it has to be in areas that; I mean we’d like keyword search first like in Google. Go to Google trends and see what people are searching on it. Then if it relates to your industry obviously and your business, then write a blog on that with those keywords in there.
So, if someone is searching for something. They are going find perhaps your blog or your YouTube post on the things that you’re doing. That’s what we want. We want to be able to not only push, but we want to pull. We want drive traffic to us through social media.
Deanne: Yeah. I hear a lot of people; I read on Facebook, people who are writing all these little notes a round what stores they‘re going to. I just think why would anybody want to do that?
Maribeth: Yeah, it’s not really about that. For business people, it’s not really about the typical Facebook people taking pictures of themselves on the beach or whatever. It’s different, but it’s still a social site. People want to share things about themselves.
So, you’ve got to think as business person. If they are sharing all a bunch of personal thing about themselves, you don’t want to come in, and try selling something, because they‘ll all unfollow you. Because that not hwy they are there. They’re there for social. There are a lot of people there for social.
Deanne: Interesting. That helps quite a bit. Now, what about websites? I mean when I first started my business I put up one website. I thought, well that’s sort of going to keep forever. Now I’m wondering, how often do I need to update my website? Do you have any ideas around that?
Maribeth: I can tell you that we go in and make updates RedZoneMarketing.com almost every day. I’m not saying that we change the design of the site. But we put new thing up there. We take things down.
We have whole freemium area where we’re posting new things. On every single day we’re going into our website. At least five days week in the business. Going in and making changes to the website.
Now, perhaps more of the question you’re asking is about; well is this something that I should be going in and saying I need to redo my whole website. I need to rewrite my website.
I would suggest you take a look from a messaging stand point, and from a design standpoint. And say, is this better than my competitors. Is it always better than n my competitors? Is it as good as my competitors?
Because if you go to my website there’s no good compared to all these other people. That’s the real problem today. Because nine out 10 people are going to search for you online before they ever come in and see you.
That’s a problem because if they find you; they go, nah, that’s not what I’m looking for. They won’t come in to ever to see you or call or email you or whatever it might be. So it’s pretty critical. So, the messaging is critical. The design has got to be progressive, and it’s got to meet with the time today.
But I think the one best way of figuring that out, because there are a lot of, sort opinions in what a website should like and be like. I think the best way; of determining whether or not you need to go on, and do something new with your website is to look at your Google Analytics.
Make sure that you’re getting the hits that you want get on your site. Are people coming to your site? Are they clicking to other pages? Do you have high bounce rate, which means there are people leaving your homepage before they’ve gone to any other pages on your websites.
I mean; what are people clicking on. How long are they staying? Are they unique visitors? Just taking a look at your Google Analytics will give you a pretty good feel for whether, or not you should do some updates to your website.
Often times when you start looking at your Google analytics, you want to make more changes on a more regular basis.
Deanne: Wow, you update your website every day?
Maribeth: I probably add something. We add a new presentation. Or we add a new product. They do a lot of writing. So we add articles to our freemium section of the websites. So people can download for free.
Yeah, we know people are looking. We want to make sure that we’re still the place they want to come back to, after they’ve been there one time, because we’ve got new things, and new valuable resources for them.
Deanne: Wow, that’s very impressive. I’m exhausted just hearing about it actually.
Maribeth: Sorry.
Deanne: You know. I’ve got a question for you. We’re running out of time here. I can’t believe it. So how can you get the word out about yourself, and your business without spending a ton of money? Is social media the way to do it or are there others strategies.
Maribeth: I think it’s certainly is social media. But it’s not just social media. I don’t think that an individual stand alone strategy.
I think it start with you verbally being out, and telling people about what it is that you do. Having that what we call, high level of social intelligence; to be able to share with others about what you do, in a way it resonates with them.
If you can do that verbally. You can take those same messages and put them up on your website. Put them into your social media. It’s all about sort of taking one message that you’ve got, and repurposing it all over the place.
If you’re thinking about, what am I going to say? What am I going to do? What is your core product? What is unique about you? What are you telling other people about? That should the things that you’re posting in these other places. But I believe the core of business today is about being personally socially intelligent.
Deanne: I can’t believe our time has just spurred up. You have a running program for business people what is it called. We’re only about a minute left. What is it called? How do people get hold of you?
Maribeth: Well I do have a learning program, thank you for asking, talking about social intelligence. We’ve got a program called mastering the art of social intelligence. It’s 14 course.
We call it rapid e-learning, because they are very short video. You can listen to it. Your staff can listen. Your kids could listen to it if you wanted to have them. It’s built for business owners, entrepreneurs and professionals who are looking to ramp up their social intelligence.
Not to become charismatic and outgoing, but to become better at connecting with other people, because it’s so critical to do this today. It’s the number one indicator of success in business, social intelligence. I haven’t seen any other training programs on this.
You can go to our website at RedZoneMarketing.com. Click on online learning, and you’ll see mastering the art of social intelligence. You can click on that and see the whole outline of the program. What you‘ll get. If you enter the code social, because you’ve listened to this show. You can get $100 off of the program.
Deanne: Maribeth you’ve just been a wealth of information. Again this has been Maribeth Kuzmeski from Red Zone Marketing.
I’ll just mention really quickly our premium sponsor for Today’s Inspiring Women is Breaking Boundaries International. Breaking Boundary provides coaching and training service to business professionals and organization.
They coach individuals, break through the personal boundaries and career roadblocks, so that they can attain success. Those services includes executive and personal coaching, corporate training for managers. They also provide motivational business speaker for your next business meeting or conference. They can be reached at www.Breaking-Boundaries.com, or 866-91-coach.
Wrapping up today, I would like to leave you with a brief quote. This one is from Wayne Gretzky. This has been hockey season in our house over here. This quote from Wayne Gretzy is one that really hits home to me. He says, “You miss 100% of the shots you never take”
With that I would like to leave you. This is Deanna Demarco with Today’s Inspiring Women. Maribeth again thank you very much for being on today’s show. Until next time, have a wonderful day.
Guests: Dr. Caroline Le Poole. Associate Professor of Pathology at Loyola University in Chicago.
Maribeth Kuzmeski. Red Zone Marketing.
Deanne: Welcome to Today's Inspiring Women. I’m your host, Deanne DeMarco. If you are ready to take the next steps to become inspired, empowered motivated and better equipped for success, then stay tuned. Each week we address relevant topics for women to spark your career and life growth.
Today we have a celebrity in the science field. I am just honored to introduce you to Dr. Caroline Le Poole, who received master’s degree and PhD from universities in the Netherlands.
In 1993 she defended her PhD and was the first woman to receive a PhD from the department of dermatology in the 100years of that schools existence, which I think is just phenomenal.
In 1995 Caroline came to the United States, to work at the University of Cincinnati. In 1999 she moved to Loyola University in Chicago where she is currently an Associate Professor of Pathology.
In February of this year, just a short time ago, she had a significant ground breaking discovery for vitiligo. Which some people refer to it as the Michael Jackson’s disease. This skin disorder affects as many as 65 million people worldwide, with at least one million of those people here in the United States.
I am so honored to welcome Dr. Caroline Le Poole. Caroline welcome to Today's Inspiring Women.
Caroline: Thanks Deanne this is a really wonderful opportunity. I am equally honored. It is great to be able to speak to your audience, and of course we have a great connection here. Because I’ve heard from you, that you also have some background in the biological sciences. So that’s absolutely fascinating.
Deanne: Yeah that was my first career. I’d really like to talk about your journey as a scientist. Was it smooth going for you, or there were some real challenges that you needed to deal with along the way?
Caroline: Well I think that any woman in any job has special challenges in work. Whether these are all unique to my particular field or whether they are just something that we share among women. Of course we always that one thing that if we raise children or if we have a family to care for, that this can be a real juggling in time.
But I think maybe in the biological sciences has its really special challenges because biological materials don't wait for you to come back. So you have cells growing in a flask and you got to be there on time to feed them. It’s a matter of feeding the baby or feeding the cells at some point. That I think was always the most important challenge to me.
There is always something that comes also with a certain expectation in my particular case, because I had family members and sibling and parents that also had a big interest in science.
So at some point I felt, you want to meet that expectation and as the challenges came up along the way. I’m happy to say that with everything said and done, or where I am now, I can now at least see that it was all worth it.
Deanne: One of the things that I was really impressed with is that you were the first woman to receive your PhD from this school’s 100 year history. I mean holy smokes.
Caroline: I’ll be very honest with you, I only knew this when my diploma was being handed to me by the professor, Professor Bosch from Amsterdam University. He actually made mention of that in his speech, when he handed me my paperwork. In front of all those people he mentioned, well you know she is the first woman in our department to ever receive her PhD. That’s of course really a great thing.
But, I think that also means that I really didn’t pay that much attention to whether there were women or men that were working in the field at that time. I know that there has been a lot of women that have followed the path and it’s really opened up. Yes that was a very fascinating thing to hear at that point.
Deanne: So you didn’t recognize any barriers that you were facing in that journey?
Caroline: I most definitely did. But not necessarily would I have recognized that I would be the first to face those challenges at the time. I guess I tried to brush them away to some extent, and I’ve worked really hard to be prepared for the interviews.
I was actually out of the field of science for maybe one and a half, two years. There were people that were freshly out of college that would probably would have found it easier to speak about the research they had recently done. So how do you make something sound really fresh even though it’s been a while?
Maybe I’ve worked that little harder to make it stick and to come through. There could be something to the fact that because of that maybe insecurity that I had going in, that I worked that little bit harder and that helped. Obviously they gave me the position.
There is also that other thing at that point I accepted a position that was actually a half time position. As women maybe we more have a tendency to say, hey that’s an opportunity for us, whereas it’s actually also an extra challenge. Because if you try to do science half time it’s extremely difficult because experiments can take longer than you actually have time allotted to finish them.
I think that’s something that we really have to juggle a little bit harder maybe, in those situations. Because I saw that half time position which my family life at that point made a lot of sense, maybe I was a little bit more eager to step into that situation.
Deanne: Yeah you’re right. I was in the field of microbiology too. I tried to take a half work load, and that was like an impossible thing to do, because you’re trying to grow your cultures. They have to be read every 24 to 48 hours.
Caroline: Exactly. That’s very much what it is. Not only that, but it seem to me that all the important meetings happen to take place exactly when that other half of the time when you’re not there. So you have to kind of give in a little bit.
Deanne: From your perspective what’s special about working in the biological sciences field?
Caroline: I think there is many very fascinating sides to it. That’s of course little bit from my own personal perspective. But I’ve always been very fascinated with anything that has to do with the living world.
There is something exciting about the sciences in the sense that you can at times you’re the first to find something. You’re the first person to know. I think we all like to be in that situation, right?
If you go from that fascination and you get really opportunities, I think in biological sciences there is this connection to other basic sciences. There is also connections to for example languages, how do organisms communicate with each other in languages that we as people don't really recognize yet. I can still be very fascinated by all of that.
You also get to take additional steps, right? Especially in my case where, and also your case then, where the biomedical field also gives you the opportunity to look at what is different from normal and disease situations. Is there anything we can do about it, can we engineer a way out of any unhealthy situation.
A step that I’m at least hoping to take, because of the findings that you were just mentioning before, is to collaborate with awesome scientists clinicians that we have here. In order to be able to take the findings a step further and possibly go into patient treatment.
All together it’s just fascination with what's going on. To see if you can do anything about it if you don't like the way it is.
Deanne: One of the things I think we should probably just touch on, I mean you had this ground breaking discovery. A lot of times people in our audience think, oh great this is going to be available for me tomorrow.
Caroline: Well I think you bring up a very important point of caution. Because despite my own excitement, I certainly have a lot of that. But it’s of course more realistic to say that there is a lot of steps to be taken before we can actually bring our findings to clinics.
We’ve been very busy and trying to understand the disease vitiligo, which is a disease where patients gradually lose pigment over time.
We’ve been able to be involved in the steps that identify this as an auto immune disease. Which were really kind of the first steps in order to see if there were ways that we could interfere with the development of auto immunity. Even if you have the genetic predisposition to that disease there are still steps to be taken to possibly interfere with the actual precipitation of that disease in patients.
It’s great that we can look at this in animal models. But, we have to be sure that we can translate this to a human situation that is actually safe and that we can get all the regulatory approvals in place and get all the people aligned to actually bring this to a clinical trial. There is definitely some time ahead of us before it comes to that point.
Deanne: That’s one of the things that people generally just don't understand. We have about two minutes before break here. I’d like to ask you one question is, how did you balance your family life and your lab life as well? How did you actually end up doing that?
Caroline: Well in my case I think there were some luck steps in the sense of getting help from outside. We had au pairs at home when the children were very small. That made it possible for me to spend time and for my girls to be in their own environment at home. Stay with the kids’ right around the corner if they wanted to. So that was helpful.
I think in a more general sense it really requires a lot of understanding from people. Both my children themselves and my partner to know that I have a lot of time to be spent. Not just by being physically absent, sometimes my mind would go somewhere else and I think that’s something that I really had to adjust to, to make sure that I could actually separate the time that I spent in the lab and this time that I spent at home.
I think that’s just a major thing to learn because you want to be there for the kids when they need you, but you can't always be. So you miss a lot of the events as they grow up.
I felt that’s difficult on the other hand, I think that by now if we look back I am happy to see that they can also start making something of their own life and their own interest. I think now they have come to a point where they’re okay with it. Even though for a long time I think that’s been difficult.
Deanne: I think it is. We only have about one minute to break here. I got to ask you one really quick question. I was in microbiology as well, and to this day I am just like paranoid about clean counters at home.
Caroline: Well actually you asked a very good question, because I honestly thought I didn’t have the time for that.
Deanne: I’m just curious.
Caroline: I think it’s a natural inclination if you’re microbiologist. The other side of it is, you either get the science done or you get the counter clean.
Deanne: I just had to ask, just had to ask. We’re going to be taking a short break here. Stay tuned we’re going to be right back on Today's Inspiring Women with Dr. Carol Le Poole
Welcome back we are speaking to Dr. Caroline Le Poole from Loyola University. This is Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women.
Caroline just before break we were talking about some of the issues around being in the biological sciences and being a mum some the juggling act that you have to do.
Deanne: One of the questions that I have that continues on that vein, are there challenges in science that are unique to women that may not be involved in the other fields?
Caroline: Well I think that kind of shows in the fact that there is still a very marked under representation of women at least among faculty. It doesn’t start out that way. I think we certainly go in 50/50, if not more. Ultimately I think in the leadership positions we still see less women.
I think in part it’s because of the challenges that we have because of facing family situations as well as work which both require a lot attention. But I think of course in a sense that’s certainly grown for men as well. They can take on more and more responsibilities at home as well.
You don't want it to become a real competition at home, because that makes it very difficult to keep a solid family life. Certainly I’ve faced my challenges in that regard as well.
I think we come in to it from a perspective of meeting the expectations of a field where 80% of the people are men. They have their unique perspective, if we don't understand the language that comes from male dominated field then we can't meet them either.
We don't have to necessarily have to speak the same language, but I think we certainly need to understand it in order to write grants that can be successful. Or teach in a way that sticks.
Those are all things that as women coming into that world in order to make it to the next step, I think we have to understand exactly what it takes to make it within that particular environment.
Deanne: I think what I’m hearing is that there really isn’t gender equality in the scientific field?
Caroline: I don't think that we’re there yet. I think we do have sometimes somewhat different perspective on what's important to address in sciences. In some ways, we are more harsh. In other ways we are milder if we see applications by others.
There is a lot of effort being made within the sciences I think. In the pool in women always have an equal representation. That’s still very difficult, because there is a smaller pool to choose from.
In general when decisions are made and still with that, maybe 20%, 25% women that are taking part in these decisions. The decisions are still for a large part made by men. So then it really comes down to also their feel for how comfortable they are with different perspectives.
Deanne: So one of the questions I just thought of is, are there fewer women going into the scientific field as compared to men?
Caroline: I don't think so. I think right now. I think we’re looking at women that are coming in to graduate school for example, I think we’re pretty equal if not more than half. I think at some point I hope it will start growing and that we eventually just wind up being 50/50.
I have to say, I’ve see a lot of that happening even within the particular group of people that I work with, here in Tumor Immunology and Immuno therapy.
The percentage women has grown although I could say for a while I was the only woman left that was working. The only person working on that, but as the group has grown, it growing very nicely half, half. It just gives a little bit of a different feel.
Deanne: So in the groups that you mentor, you have an equal number of women as well as men who are going on for their PhDs? Or do most women stop at their master’s degree?
Caroline: No. I think they’re going in for their PhD. Right then you come to a point where you make a transition, as an independent investigator. I think that’s where it becomes really difficult.
I think the specific challenge that we face then is even everything else being equal at that point wherever you’re being hired that phase is going to make an enormous investment into you. These are really not numbers to seize at.
There is always that in thing that inclining that maybe a woman will have a family situation that will pull her out of what she’s doing, and give first priority to a family. That would take away from the enormous investment.
I think we have to maybe work that just a little bit harder to prove ourselves in that sense. I don't know that that can be imposed on anyone else. I certainly always felt that little bit of obligation to leave that mark, because I was worried that if I were to ever step out of it, that would leave kind of a mark for the people that I’m after.
As I’ve seen that happen, and I've seen it come up in situations or discussions with male colleagues, of female colleagues for that matter. I think it’s important to just kind of set that example that we can do it. And face the challenges and take the opportunities as they come along.
Deanne: Were there any, I mean this begs the question. Were there any specific strategies that you used?
Caroline: I think we can sometimes be in situation where we can take opportunities that are not, that maybe men might not be as comfortable with. I’m just saying, I think you and I both tried to get into positions that were really half time positions or really half time work is also half time pay.
Depending on where you are in the family whether you’re the caretaker or the sole care taker, or part of at least bringing in the family income that can be an acceptable situation or not.
We maybe sometimes in situations where that’s more acceptable for a while, even if you accept positions for lesser pay, even if you’re doing the same amount of work. If you can bite through that situation for a while, at least you have an opportunity to show yourself, whereas somebody else may not.
That’s where I think there are specific challenges but there is also specific opportunities that come with it. If you can ride it out for a while, if can be very rewarding.
Deanne: Rewarding in the end, yeah. I’ve got a question for you, as a mum in the sciences, do you inspire your children to go in the science field, or?
Caroline: It’s interesting that you ask that. I would say, until very long time ago, maybe four of five years ago I would have said, oh definitely not. The one thing that my children always told me was, the one thing they don't want to do, is what their mum did. A lot of work and very little pay.
As time that was probably most defiantly true. I see that they see that I really love what I do. I think that they also see that the passion that I bring to that has brought inspiration. I see that because they also want to study that much more. Go to college, get a degree and really make a world for themselves.
That’s very interesting to see, because for example my oldest daughter, she has children of her own now. She faces the same questions. I think that’s changed her perspective a lot.
I just want to say that because there are years where it really seems that you don't want to meet that challenge, because it’s so tempting to be there at all times and always give that one person to be there at the right time.
You can't always be there at the right time. If your child is sick and there is au pair to care for it, you have to be able to transfer that responsibility to somebody else. If we learn to do that, and we pick up on what’s emotionally important to the kids, I think eventually as I said I really do think it pays off.
Deanne: I know my kids always went to mum first whenever there was a science project at school. They go, hey ma, help me with this.
Caroline: That is true. That was so fun to do. I don't know if you, I just have very specific memories of the science project, yes.
Deanne: Yeah. Always keep moments. Part of me was really kind of glad that I had that opportunity to like shine a little bit.
Caroline: Yes, absolutely. Those were the, and maybe you know, your right as you say this, actually that makes me realize that, that’s probably some of the points that they stored.
That came back up about five years ago when they kind of reevaluated whether it was worthwhile going in that direction. I think they enjoyed it too, trying to figure out whether there were more bacteria in milk or in orange juice.
Deanne: Yup.
Caroline: Those are the kind of things you can do with them. Share what you are really doing every day. I think that can be inspiring.
Deanne: So, and we only have a couple minutes left, what tips do you have for women who want to move forward as a scientist?
Caroline: I would still say, take opportunities when they come your way. Don’t hesitate too much to see if you will be able to balance those things. The solutions will come your way if you really want them.
I feel, at least I imposed on myself that I think it’s important to work hard so that you kind of leave a mark that will make it easier for the next person.
Also to try to set up a strategy to separate the time that you spend at work from that at home. That’s I think the most important, especially because I kind of fell short on that at certain times in my life. I hope that would be helpful to others.
Deanne: Yeah, that’s good. Good comments. There is a couple of things we only have about a minute and a half left. I want to ask one quick question, so people understand this. How long have you been studying trying to come up with an answer for vitiligo?
So people know that it’s not something you did overnight. How long have you been involved in that? Then how is your research funded?
Caroline: I’ve been in vitiligo research since the very early 90s, so over 20 years. It continues to fascinate me, the connection that it has to other diseases and also what we’ve been able to learn over time. I research at least since I’ve come to the States. Also really back home.
It’s funded in large part as our other studies that are supported here at Loyola University Medical Center, through federal funding for a large part. Especially the National Institutes of Health and I really appreciate that opportunity that you’re giving me here in this question.
I think it’s very important that we all lobby or at least have a great understanding or hopefully also appreciation for that type of support. Which is kind of needs to come from Washington and go to the NIH to be distributed among the most deserving investigators. So we can go on and understand, design and test our new strategies in the biomedical sciences.
Deanne: Yeah, I mean, I don't think people realize how important that really is. This funding that comes from the government. Whether it be my cancer research studies or your vitiligo. It’s very, very important to get that support.
I can’t believe that our time is up here. I would like to thank you for being part of Today's Inspiring Women. I think that you’re a great role-model for women who do aspire to go in the biological sciences. I would like to really thank you for being part of this show today.
Caroline: Okay and thank you for this great opportunity. Really this is actually an inspiring opportunity for me to think about all these things that seem to be part of everyday life, but I didn’t give enough time to thinking about them.
Deanne: Wonderful. Anyway we got to take a short break. I’d like you to stay tuned. Our second guest today is going to be Maribeth Kuzmeski, who is going to take the mystery out of marketing.
We’re going to be talking about some of the best marketing strategies. Some of the mistakes that we need to be careful of, especially of those who are entrepreneurs in the whole marketing world and understanding marketing, as well as for corporate America as well.
So stay tuned. This is the Deanne DeMarco with Today's Inspiring Women. So stay tuned for our next guest and we’ll come back and talk to you after these messages.
Deanne: Welcome back to Today’s Inspiring Women. I’m your host Deanne Demarco. My next speaker is Maribeth Kuzmeski and her firm Red Zone Marketing.
She’s consults and speaks for business from financial services firms to Fortune 500 corporations on strategic marketing, planning and business growth.
Maribeth has personally consultant some of the world’s most successful CEOs, entrepreneurs and professionals. Maribeth has written seven books including the best seller And The Clients Went Wild by Wiley. By the way that’s a fantastic book, if you’ve not seen it. She is regular media contributor appearing on Fox News, ABC, NBC, CBS, WGN-TV.
Her articles have been in publication including US Today, the Wall Street Journal, Chicago Tribune, New York Times, Entrepreneur and Forbes. We‘re very lucky to have Maribeth with us. Welcome Maribeth to today’s inspiring women.
Maribeth: Well thank you very much for having me.
Deanne: By the way I love your books. I just want to let everyone know that you have great; your books are really fantastic.
Maribeth: Thank you so much.
Deanne: You’re this marketing guru. Before you got to be this guru; a lot of our audiences are sitting there going, do I want to stay in corporate America. Do I want to be entrepreneur? How did you break from that from the norm, and decide to be this entrepreneur?
Maribeth: Well, I would love to tell you that there’s some real smart way that I came up with this decision. To be honest, I was out in Washington DC. I had just gotten MBA. I had a nice job working for a corporation.
My husband got transferred to the Midwest. We were happy to go to the Midwest, because I’m originally from the Midwest. But I was five months pregnant at the time. I figured that there’ no way that anyone is going to hire me at five months pregnant. Because I looked like I was nine months when I was five months.
So, I decided to open my own firm. I thought, well that would be nice. I could do that while the babies were growing up, and all of that. It would a good thing to do.
So I did it, sort of out of maybe necessity or I didn’t know other choices. I knew that I always wanted to have my own business, but you always what’s the right time. This wasn’t the right time, but it was the time for me.
Deanne: Wow. You’ve just grown this business into a very, very successful endeavor. I mean that’s just amazing. So, what are some of the best marketing strategies for working women today or working today?
Maribeth: Well, there are lots of great marketing strategies depending on whatever business that you are in. One of the things that we know to be true is that there’s a commonality between either entrepreneur or business professional, whether you work at a corporation, you have your own company, whatever it might be, and that’s the ability to connect and communicate.
If you can do that; I’m not saying you’ve got to be a great networker. Or you have to be superior, charismatic, and outgoing person. But you do have to figure out, how you’re going to let other people help you in your career.
I think it’s especially important for women. Women have less mentors than men do. It just seems like allowing others to help you. Getting out there and asking for help. And helping others at the same time is a really great way to forward your career.
We call it the art of social intelligence ,but it’s really connecting and communicating. I wrote a book call The Connector about this very topic. Because I realized that with all the marketing strategies available; the one that work the best was to get other people to talk about you.
How do you do that? It doesn’t happen through advertising necessarily. It doesn’t happen through writing direct mail letters. But it happens through other people. So, how are we going to meet people? And get out, and tell our story in way that others want to share.
Deanne: So in other words you can’t sit at home. You have to get out.
Maribeth: Well, today you can sit at home, because you can use the internet, social media and all those sort of things.
Deanne: That’s true.
Maribeth: But there’s nothing that has ever probably or will ever replace the face to face. Letting someone get to know how passionate you are about something. Nobody can sell what you’re doing and who you are better than you can.
Deanne: I believe that’s really true. So, what are some of the biggest mistakes in marketing that people make today?
Maribeth: I think the very biggest mistake in marketing; it’s not that you’re not spending enough money. Or doing all the things that we might think are our mistakes in marketing. We should invest more. We should spend more time. We should go to more networking event. But I think that the biggest; I know that the biggest in marketing is not messaging yourself properly.
I’ll give you a case and point. If you go to a business function, I work with a lot of financial advisors. Financial advisors sometimes are both inside the corporation, or they could be an entrepreneur.
The financial advisor goes to function. Somebody says, what do you do? They say, I’m a financial advisor. That actually makes the person they’ve just said that to, want to talk to them less, not more. Just because of the industry, they think you’re going to try to sell them life insurance or whatever.
But the next time they go to a business function knowing that’s going to be the reaction. They say the same thing, I’m a financial advisor. It doesn’t resonate. It doesn’t get any one excited. It actually repels them as opposed to compelling someone to talk with you.
But if you think about no matter what business you in. Somebody says what do you do or who do you work or what’s your job. You kind of just stumble over it a little bit. The reason that sometimes that happens is we’re not maybe comfortable talking about ourselves. But on the other side; if we can’t share what we’re doing especially as an entrepreneur, if you can’t share it clearly and concisely, not for you but for them, it fails.
So, if I say, I‘m a marketing consultant. I help a lot of people with business development. That doesn’t really entice people to get all excited about what I do. But if I have a specific way of describing it; I work with financial advisors to gross more than $1million and I help them find more clients.
That’s a different statement than the first statement. I just help anybody and everybody with marketing. It‘s kind of general in its blur. Or if I’m talking to a specific target audience, if I make my message work for that target audience. It turns into something that’s more successful.
So it’s all about messaging. How are we talking about ourselves? How are we talking about our company, our products, our services, and our staff? How are we doing that? Often time we need some help with it.
Deanne: Very interesting. So, it’s all about maybe even focusing on a benefit, that they may be looking for, to kind of hook them into a conversation with you.
Maribeth: It’s all about benefits. So, you see you got that absolutely right. Because the average of attention span in United States today is 9 seconds. So, if the average attention span is 9 seconds; no one is paying attention, unless you directly to them about something that’s interesting to them.
That’s how we have to get people’s attention today. Just because we’ve put up a billboard doesn’t mean that everyone is going to go and buy your stuff. It has to be compelling to those that you want to have buy.
It sounds easy, but it’s not that easy, because most entrepreneurs, or business owners don’t make it. They don’t make it in the business that they’ve chosen, because they haven’t been to; there’s lot of things you could say. Well it’s the funding. It’s this, it’s that. But we haven’t gotten people excited about it and buy.
We have to have enough people buying what we have, in order to get that extra level of funding. In order to get the thing off the ground we’ve got to compel people. That happens through the way the writing is our website. Our messaging verbally and things that other people say about you. You have to be in control of the message.
Deanne: Wow. That’s really good advice. I didn’t realize the average listening attention span is only 9 seconds. That’s strong.
Maribeth: Well yes. Soon can imagine that people listening to your radio show. Then they come back in and they listen. I think that they’re listening to your show because they want to.
But most people when they are out in situation; they are not necessary glued t, and listening to very word that someone else is saying. We‘ve got our cell phones going on. We’ve got all sorts of noise, distractions, and everything. Its different today that it was five years ago. It’s different in a way that’s not good.
Deanne: Wow. I got a question for you? Is it different for men versus women in putting together a message?
Maribeth: I think it’s the same. I believe that men have an easier; this is just blanket generalization. I think men in general have an easier time talking about themselves in some situations than women. That’s just what I’ve seen, that women aren’t, not that men are braggadocios, I don’t think women are either. I mean some are, some aren’t. But I think that women are more modest.
A case in point with a woman being modest, if somebody says to me, oh I really like your purse. I say, oh this old thing. I got this on sale. It’s always about how you got it on sale. You sort of bring it down. You say, well it‘s that. Thank you for saying that, but this is you know. We always are bringing ourselves back down.
A man, if somebody says, I really like boots. They go, thank you. I got paid full price for them, bla bla. It’s a different way of describing who they are and the things that they have.
I think in general, men and women have difficulty describing what it is that they do. But I think it might be a little bit more difficult for women.
Deanne: Wow that’s really good information. Is there one thing that you teach your consulting clients in order for them to be more successful.
Maribeth: Well it’s all about, for whatever business you are in; it’s all about the referrals you’re getting. The positive word of mouth. The experience you are creating. The reputation that you have. The royalty of your clients.
But it all comes down, to how are you communicating? What is it that you do? What is it that you’re going to do? How do you want them to talk to others about you?
So, most of our clients are service based. Well, service based is a little bit more intangible to talk about what actually they are going to get. They are not getting a bag filled with something. They are getting a service. You can’t put your hand on it in a lot of the cases.
So, this is where messaging is even more important in service based business. Even more important than it is even in a product based business. But I mean, I just think the number one way of getting more clients is to get the positive word out about you.
Now there are all sorts of strategies to do that. You could create a video and put it up on YouTube. It’s got to be compelling. A lot of people put things up on YouTube, on blog or do all the pushing of content out. But the content isn’t compelling to whom, to target the audience. The content has to be compelling.
They have to have no choice, but to read or to watch because it’s so compelling. That it’s hitting them over the head with, my gosh. I’ve got to listen to this video. If they don’t feel that way, and something is not telling them they should feel that way. Then we’ve got start from scratch on the marketing and figure out how we can get a better message that gets people compelled.
Deanne: Wow, I think it’s easier if you’re selling a cup or a bag or a purse or car. To say, here’s this purse. Here’s this car. Here’s this bag. It’s a thing versus trying to sell yourself. I think that’s a harder sell.
Maribeth: Yeah, it’s definitely because I can’t talk about a products and the product’s feelings aren’t going to be hurt. If I’m talking about myself and you don’t want to buy. Oh men; there’s one person that’s responsible for that and that’s me.
So, it’s a little bit different. It’s a little bit more risky, especially when we‘re selling ourselves. I speak a lot, all over. Speaking is the hardest thing because speaking is used as a marketing tool. But you’re front and center in front of everyone.
They’re either going to like you or like your message. Or not like you, and not like your message. It’s pretty risky to get up there and speak. That’s why; probably the number one fear is speaking. People don’t want to do it.
It’s the same reason that we don’t want sell ourselves, because there’s just the fear factor there; that there’s going to be some rejection. Nobody wants that. We don’t want any more than we already have.
Deanne: We’re going to take quick break here. Then we’ll back. We’re going to talk a little more. We learn a little bit more about this whole world around social media and marketing. Just take a few minutes here. We’ll take a big breath. We’ll be back with Maribeth Kuzmeski with Red Zone Marketing.
Deanne Welcome back. You’re listening to Today’s Inspiring Women. I’m the host Deanna Demarco. We‘ve got wonderful guest with us today from Red Zone Marketing. Maribeth Kuzmeski.
Maribeth is a very successful entrepreneur in the world of marketing. Maribeth, what I would like to go into this side of the break is talk little about social media. It’s everywhere. Do social media really help a business?
Deanne: Well it depends on what business you have. But almost always, social media, when done properly does help business. Because it gives you something that you can’t get otherwise, that’s exposure. It’s the number one reason that, it’s not about having a million connections on Twitter or things like that.
It’s really about; hey do I have a message that I can push out in a way that people who have asked to connect with me can receive. That’s what social media is all about.
I think that the issue with social media today, is that a lot of businesses don’t know how to utilize it properly. I think that the key with social media today is being able to promote your business products, and services by offering value.
Not by selling because social media is not a place to be selling your wares. But to offering value in getting people interested by t the blogs that you’re writing. The things that you’re posting.
The information that you’re finding, that you’re sharing with audience. Really being a value driven social media person as opposed to; here’s our special, here’s our sale. Here are all things that we’re doing.
It’s not quite in line with what social media is all about. Social media is about socially connecting with people. If there’s a value that you can provide that really makes the big difference.
Deanne: So, some piece of knowledge is what I think I’m hearing you say. That you need to giving to people around your area of expertise.
Maribeth: Yes exactly. You want; I mean your platform could be your blog, your writing and things like that. But if nobody sees it, it doesn’t really matter.
If it’s valuable then you can, you write a blog on a topic that helpful to your target market. You can tweet about it. You can post it up on Facebook. You can start picking some comments around it. And get people passing it along to the people that they are connected to. Retweeting, commenting on your post, and things like that.
That’s really were the key is because if nobody is making any comments, they‘re not retweeting your posts. Then you have to think maybe I’ve got figure out a different post. Maybe I’ve got to come up with some different things. You don’t want to be spinning our wheels. Doing all of this posting and writing. Doing all of this content development for social media.
But it has to be in areas that; I mean we’d like keyword search first like in Google. Go to Google trends and see what people are searching on it. Then if it relates to your industry obviously and your business, then write a blog on that with those keywords in there.
So, if someone is searching for something. They are going find perhaps your blog or your YouTube post on the things that you’re doing. That’s what we want. We want to be able to not only push, but we want to pull. We want drive traffic to us through social media.
Deanne: Yeah. I hear a lot of people; I read on Facebook, people who are writing all these little notes a round what stores they‘re going to. I just think why would anybody want to do that?
Maribeth: Yeah, it’s not really about that. For business people, it’s not really about the typical Facebook people taking pictures of themselves on the beach or whatever. It’s different, but it’s still a social site. People want to share things about themselves.
So, you’ve got to think as business person. If they are sharing all a bunch of personal thing about themselves, you don’t want to come in, and try selling something, because they‘ll all unfollow you. Because that not hwy they are there. They’re there for social. There are a lot of people there for social.
Deanne: Interesting. That helps quite a bit. Now, what about websites? I mean when I first started my business I put up one website. I thought, well that’s sort of going to keep forever. Now I’m wondering, how often do I need to update my website? Do you have any ideas around that?
Maribeth: I can tell you that we go in and make updates RedZoneMarketing.com almost every day. I’m not saying that we change the design of the site. But we put new thing up there. We take things down.
We have whole freemium area where we’re posting new things. On every single day we’re going into our website. At least five days week in the business. Going in and making changes to the website.
Now, perhaps more of the question you’re asking is about; well is this something that I should be going in and saying I need to redo my whole website. I need to rewrite my website.
I would suggest you take a look from a messaging stand point, and from a design standpoint. And say, is this better than my competitors. Is it always better than n my competitors? Is it as good as my competitors?
Because if you go to my website there’s no good compared to all these other people. That’s the real problem today. Because nine out 10 people are going to search for you online before they ever come in and see you.
That’s a problem because if they find you; they go, nah, that’s not what I’m looking for. They won’t come in to ever to see you or call or email you or whatever it might be. So it’s pretty critical. So, the messaging is critical. The design has got to be progressive, and it’s got to meet with the time today.
But I think the one best way of figuring that out, because there are a lot of, sort opinions in what a website should like and be like. I think the best way; of determining whether or not you need to go on, and do something new with your website is to look at your Google Analytics.
Make sure that you’re getting the hits that you want get on your site. Are people coming to your site? Are they clicking to other pages? Do you have high bounce rate, which means there are people leaving your homepage before they’ve gone to any other pages on your websites.
I mean; what are people clicking on. How long are they staying? Are they unique visitors? Just taking a look at your Google Analytics will give you a pretty good feel for whether, or not you should do some updates to your website.
Often times when you start looking at your Google analytics, you want to make more changes on a more regular basis.
Deanne: Wow, you update your website every day?
Maribeth: I probably add something. We add a new presentation. Or we add a new product. They do a lot of writing. So we add articles to our freemium section of the websites. So people can download for free.
Yeah, we know people are looking. We want to make sure that we’re still the place they want to come back to, after they’ve been there one time, because we’ve got new things, and new valuable resources for them.
Deanne: Wow, that’s very impressive. I’m exhausted just hearing about it actually.
Maribeth: Sorry.
Deanne: You know. I’ve got a question for you. We’re running out of time here. I can’t believe it. So how can you get the word out about yourself, and your business without spending a ton of money? Is social media the way to do it or are there others strategies.
Maribeth: I think it’s certainly is social media. But it’s not just social media. I don’t think that an individual stand alone strategy.
I think it start with you verbally being out, and telling people about what it is that you do. Having that what we call, high level of social intelligence; to be able to share with others about what you do, in a way it resonates with them.
If you can do that verbally. You can take those same messages and put them up on your website. Put them into your social media. It’s all about sort of taking one message that you’ve got, and repurposing it all over the place.
If you’re thinking about, what am I going to say? What am I going to do? What is your core product? What is unique about you? What are you telling other people about? That should the things that you’re posting in these other places. But I believe the core of business today is about being personally socially intelligent.
Deanne: I can’t believe our time has just spurred up. You have a running program for business people what is it called. We’re only about a minute left. What is it called? How do people get hold of you?
Maribeth: Well I do have a learning program, thank you for asking, talking about social intelligence. We’ve got a program called mastering the art of social intelligence. It’s 14 course.
We call it rapid e-learning, because they are very short video. You can listen to it. Your staff can listen. Your kids could listen to it if you wanted to have them. It’s built for business owners, entrepreneurs and professionals who are looking to ramp up their social intelligence.
Not to become charismatic and outgoing, but to become better at connecting with other people, because it’s so critical to do this today. It’s the number one indicator of success in business, social intelligence. I haven’t seen any other training programs on this.
You can go to our website at RedZoneMarketing.com. Click on online learning, and you’ll see mastering the art of social intelligence. You can click on that and see the whole outline of the program. What you‘ll get. If you enter the code social, because you’ve listened to this show. You can get $100 off of the program.
Deanne: Maribeth you’ve just been a wealth of information. Again this has been Maribeth Kuzmeski from Red Zone Marketing.
I’ll just mention really quickly our premium sponsor for Today’s Inspiring Women is Breaking Boundaries International. Breaking Boundary provides coaching and training service to business professionals and organization.
They coach individuals, break through the personal boundaries and career roadblocks, so that they can attain success. Those services includes executive and personal coaching, corporate training for managers. They also provide motivational business speaker for your next business meeting or conference. They can be reached at www.Breaking-Boundaries.com, or 866-91-coach.
Wrapping up today, I would like to leave you with a brief quote. This one is from Wayne Gretzky. This has been hockey season in our house over here. This quote from Wayne Gretzy is one that really hits home to me. He says, “You miss 100% of the shots you never take”
With that I would like to leave you. This is Deanna Demarco with Today’s Inspiring Women. Maribeth again thank you very much for being on today’s show. Until next time, have a wonderful day.